Off grid people ill-prepared

[Warpspeed]

The only oxygen candle I've ever heard of are designed to produce oxygen, not deplete it.

Of course, if you put an actual wax/paraffin candle in a food container, the flame would go out before it is done using up all the oxygen.. just like your lights would go out without enough oxygen on an aircraft or the top of a mountain. Oxygen levels would be low, but not nearly low enough for food storage.

I'm not aware of any device called a candle that can suck all the oxygen out of a container for food storage and do a good enough job for the purpose.

At a very basic level, all you need is a container of iron powder.. The iron will rust, thus taking all the oxygen with it. That's basically what an oxygen absorber is. A coffee cup of it in a 55 gallon drum would probably be plenty enough to do the job.

Thanks for clarifying that.
The whole subject is something I have never really been interested in or investigated.

 

[MurphyGuy]

Thanks for clarifying that.
The whole subject is something I have never really been interested in or investigated.

You really should make sure you have some food storage for your family. 30 days minimum.. and that's 30 days with increased activity. Much better to keep a year or more.

We are preppers.. we keep all that stuff as well as a "get home" bag in our vehicles.. which sort of paid off just yesterday. Wife hit a deer and it knocked her front bumper loose. She calls the cops to file a report for the insurance and the cop says "you can't drive that with the bumper hanging on the road, I'll call a tow truck for you if you want"..

My wife is like "hold my beer".. Goes into her trunk, pulls out her get home bag, opens it up and produces zip ties, duct tape, and a small roll of stainless steel mig welding wire.. Cop said he's never seen anyone do that. She McGuyvered it up and was on her way again.

Being prepared pays off.. Even during covid when they locked everything down and people were acting like retards at the grocery stores.. We just sat around watching the news with smug looks on our faces.

 

[Warpspeed]

being prepared pays off..

Have to agree.
Oh I have probably almost a years supply of food here.
Canned, dried and frozen. Bake my own bread, and plenty of powdered milk that I became used to during a year in the Antarctic. Off grid for power, and the climate here is quite mild, requirement for heating and air conditioning is minimal.
No frost or snow ever, and it goes over +40C about four days each year.
Also have an excellent workshop. Lathe, milling machine, several types of welding equipment, plenty of tools. I have a proper full Ham radio license, Two vehicles and a bike. And a bible.
Pretty much independent.

Threat of war here, either civil or direct nuclear almost zero.
Lockdown is about the worst scenario, but much was learned from Covid, and I cannot see the exact same mistakes being repeated.
People power plus the Police succeeded against the politicians.

 

[wattmatters]

Oh I have probably almost a years supply of food here.
Canned, dried and frozen.

How much freezer space is that? I doubt we could store more than about a month or two. Weather here is more humid and not conducive to storing many types of foodstuffs. They would have to be very well sealed/preserved. Cans are OK. Frozen vegies say up to 10 months.

Bake my own bread

Regular oven or use a bread maker?

plenty of powdered milk

What sort of packaging? It's an interesting option. I have the mancave for storage of such things but humidity is the issue.
1kg makes ~ 7 litres of milk, call it a week's worth.

For power I have the off-grid PV system, and I can always redeploy some of the grid PV arrays to feed the off grid MPPT if I really needed it.

While rural we have town water supply (the town water supply plant is not far from us). We do have a 4000 litre tank if needed. It's not potable water, just rooftop capture with a filter only designed for non-potable uses but sanitising it would not be hard if we needed it. Average rainfall is 1358 mm (53.5") per year.

Fuel supply would be tricky. EVs are kind of handy in that respect as you can fuel them at home from solar PV.

I could probably use a better supply of wood for the fire. Been burning an old fence this winter!

 

[Bluedog225]

I understand the difficulties of gas flushing a large container and agree. 02 absorbers are cheap and even cheaper if you diy.

But curious what reason there is not to flush with CO2? Why bring up more expensive gasses?

edit-and I forgot to mention throwing a big jar of cheap multi-vitamins.

 

[Warpspeed]

@ wattmaters,

I am well into my seventies, and live by myself, so I can live very simply if I have to.

Refrigeration, just a mid sized ordinary refrigerator and a chest freezer for the long term stuff. I have three independent phases of grid power available, as well as single phase off grid. Power here is pretty reliable. I have a rotary switch, phase 1, 2, or 3, or inverter. Can run the whole house from any of four separate power sources. For frozen stuff you need VERY reliable power, or you are screwed.

I use a bread maker, but have a brand new spare still in its original packing, just in case. If the original stops working, there is a very good chance I can fix it. As a retired electronic engineer, I have plenty of electronic test equipment and electronic parts here that I have accumulated over a lifetime.
All my solar electronics are self designed, and home built. So I can fix anything that stops working, as I carry multiple spares for everything.

Fuel supply, not much stored. As I am old and retired, no real need to travel about much. Plenty of shops within walking distance.

Water, not much of that stored either. If trouble starts, there should at least be some prior warning, and I can fill up many plastic containers, enough to last for several months. Same with fuel, big pile of empty jerry cans. Water and fuel need to be fairly fresh, So I have empty containers on standby.

We in Australia live right in the middle of a tectonic plate, which is a very geologically stable place to be. I am on the top of a hill overlooking the city.
If they nuke the city, all my problems will be over in a flash. Being up high means no possibility of flooding. Being in a suburb means no likelihood of wild fires.

Thinking about all of the possibilities, I think I should end up being fairly well off compared to a great many others out there.

*edit* almost forgot.

Powdered milk, I have about a years supply of that, plus a food blender to mix it. Tried that for a couple of months to estimate consumption, and no problems at all. It comes in a foil package, 1Kg makes 7litres. Humidity should not be an issue for storage. I find that once mixed, its always better from the second day onwards. It says that on the package, and its true.

Like baking bread, its a nuisance, but something you can adapt to very quickly.

 

[wattmatters]

I have three independent phases of grid power available, as well as single phase off grid.

Interesting. We have 3-phase supply but it if one phase goes down the others do as well. I have single a phase off-grid system I put together which provides UPS like backup. 35 kWh of battery, and the generator if needed (should the PV be unable to keep up with demand on bad solar days).

We get regular grid outages, hence the power backup.

For backup a propane generator would probably be a better option as the fuel can be stored for a very long time. Propane gennies not common here though.

Refrigeration, just a mid sized ordinary refrigerator and a chest freezer for the long term stuff.

Yeah we have two fridge/freezers, no chest unit. Something to consider.

I am on the top of a hill overlooking the city.
If they nuke the city, all my problems will be over in a flash. Being up high means no possibility of flooding. Being in a suburb means no likelihood of wild fires.

We are roughly halfway between Sydney and Brisbane. Also on a hill so local flooding doesn't reach us but can cut us off. Fires are an issue. We had the emergency evacuation packs ready to go at a moment's notice for the 2019/20 fires. They just missed us. We still have those items ready.

I'm an amputee so have some other considerations when it comes to doing stuff. Brother has a small farm a couple of hours south, goats, chickens, vegetables. I am crap at garden stuff.

 

[Warpspeed]

For many years we had regular power outages here. The very high voltage long distance transmission lines are arranged vertically, red phase at the top, then white, and blue lowest down. Lightning strikes would always hit the red phase.
The delta star transformers that drop the voltage down to 415/240v would still supply 240v on the blue phase whenever that happened.
Its just a peculiarity, but before I became totally grid independent, whenever the power went off, and the street lights did not work, I was always o/k running on blue phase.

Since then, they seemed to have fixed the problem whatever it was. And there has not been a single power interruption here, for many years.

I have a brown thumb too. The only thing that thrives are weeds. So I just leave everything in the garden pretty much alone, and it seems to do a lot better that way.

 

[MurphyGuy]

I understand the difficulties of gas flushing a large container and agree. 02 absorbers are cheap and even cheaper if you diy.

But curious what reason there is not to flush with CO2? Why bring up more expensive gasses?

edit-and I forgot to mention throwing a big jar of cheap multi-vitamins.

CO2 can be absorbed.. thats how they put the fizz in soft drinks. and when it happens, the pH is lowered.

Not sure if that would apply to every type of food however..

Even CO2 is expensive when compared to the o2 absorbers.

 

[LittleLebowski]

This sort of extreme characterisation is far from reality and does not help us have a reasonable discussion.

I’m being as reasonable as possible in trying to relate to you that you accept certain compromises and outright denials of natural rights that I do not.

No, one of us takes enforced vaccinations with experimental vaccines more seriously than the other. One of us prefers to make his own choices as a parent. One of us doesn’t trust a government that censors your online speech. One of us isn’t a fan of mandatory government literal camps for the unvaccinated.

Bottom line, is that I’ll take the US over the overbearing nanny state that is Australia. I’m not dodging bullets in public unlike what you think. I’ve been to both countries too.

 

[MurphyGuy]

I’m being as reasonable as possible in trying to relate to you that you accept certain compromises and outright denials of natural rights that I do not.

No, one of us takes enforced vaccinations with experimental vaccines more seriously than the other.

The government did not force anyone to take a vaccination.. They gave everyone a choice, most people just didn't like the choice.

All vaccines are experimental until they are in wide use, and even then, it is not possible to know how a vaccine will affect every person every time.

One of us prefers to make his own choices as a parent.

That's a sticky conversation.. If you make a bad choice, which results in your child dying or becoming sick, should you be held accountable? Or did you want that freedom without accountability?

One of us doesn’t trust a government that censors your online speech.

The government didn't censor your speech, the social media companies did that.. They may have been enticed to censor that speech, but it was still their choice. The unpopular speech, the bigoted speech, the misinformation, fake news, etc etc, still propagated through thousands of smaller websites that were never contacted, approached, threatened, censored, or in any other way, manipulated by government. In fact, it took place right on this website as well.. and without censorship.

You call it censorship.. the owners of the websites call it "My website, my rules".. and if you don't like that, go somewhere else... just don't complain about it.

If someone plops a Biden sign on your front lawn, are you going to allow it to remain? Are you going to censor it by removing it? What about their free speech?

One of us isn’t a fan of mandatory government literal camps for the unvaccinated.

No such thing.

Bottom line, is that I’ll take the US over the overbearing nanny state that is Australia. I’m not dodging bullets in public unlike what you think. I’ve been to both countries too.

That's fair. I wouldn't want to live in a nanny state either.

 

[D71]

this guy is the turd in the punch bowl… stay away from his insanity.

 

[wattmatters]

No, one of us takes enforced vaccinations

Australia does not and has never had enforced vaccinations.

One of us isn’t a fan of mandatory government literal camps for the unvaccinated.

I don't know where you are getting your information from but like most of what you are claiming this is just fanciful nonsense.

I’m not dodging bullets in public unlike what you think.

How do you know what I think?

I have expressed no opinion on the matter, only shared verified information.

But I can see you have little epistemic interest and are seemingly unable to distinguish how we understand what is real and what is just made up bullshit.

 

[D71]

Snicker okay
just 1 example from bbc

Howard Springs: Australia police arrest quarantine escapees

The trio had fled a remote camp near Darwin by scaling a fence in the middle of the night.

www.bbc.com

 

[wattmatters]

This had nothing to do with people's vaccination status. Indeed this was before COVID-19 vaccinations were even available in Australia.

A quarrantine period was used for a while for people arriving back into the country to help stop the spread of the disease amongst an as yet unvaccinated population. Mass COVID testing was also not available at the time. RATS testing for people was not available until late 2021.

Most quarrantine was done in people's own homes, some in hotels and some govt owned facilities. A period of travel restrictions applied.

 

[Warpspeed]

Indeed, that is how it was.

 

[LittleLebowski]

The government did not force anyone to take a vaccination.. They gave everyone a choice, most people just didn't like the choice.

All vaccines are experimental until they are in wide use, and even then, it is not possible to know how a vaccine will affect every person every time.


That's a sticky conversation.. If you make a bad choice, which results in your child dying or becoming sick, should you be held accountable? Or did you want that freedom without accountability?


The government didn't censor your speech, the social media companies did that.. They may have been enticed to censor that speech, but it was still their choice. The unpopular speech, the bigoted speech, the misinformation, fake news, etc etc, still propagated through thousands of smaller websites that were never contacted, approached, threatened, censored, or in any other way, manipulated by government. In fact, it took place right on this website as well.. and without censorship.

You call it censorship.. the owners of the websites call it "My website, my rules".. and if you don't like that, go somewhere else... just don't complain about it.

If someone plops a Biden sign on your front lawn, are you going to allow it to remain? Are you going to censor it by removing it? What about their free speech?




No such thing.

That's fair. I wouldn't want to live in a nanny state either.

You are literally ignoring or perhaps unaware of the fact that I’m talking about Australia and therefore I am absolutely right about the vaccinations and camps for the unvaxxed there, but how do you not know that the US govt actively took a leading role in censorship of social media? Are you unaware of the documented evidence of the US govt telling social media companies what to censor, whom to ban, etc? I mean, this isn’t exactly uncommon nor esoteric knowledge.

 

[LittleLebowski]

This had nothing to do with people's vaccination status. Indeed this was before COVID-19 vaccinations were even available in Australia.

A quarrantine period was used for a while for people arriving back into the country to help stop the spread of the disease amongst an as yet unvaccinated population. Mass COVID testing was also not available at the time. RATS testing for people was not available until late 2021.

Most quarrantine was done in people's own homes, some in hotels and some govt owned facilities. A period of travel restrictions applied.

Yes, sounds oh-so voluntary.

Howard Springs: Australia police arrest quarantine escapees

The trio had fled a remote camp near Darwin by scaling a fence in the middle of the night.

www.bbc.com

I can’t believe I thought this was forced!

The Howard Springs centre near Darwin in the Northern Territory is one of Australia's main quarantine facilities for people returning to the country.

Police said the trio scaled a fence to break out of the facility.

Officers found them after a manhunt on Wednesday. All had tested negative to Covid the day before.
Officials did not state whether the escapees were returning travellers or locals in quarantine.

 

[Warpspeed]

You are literally ignoring or perhaps unaware of the fact that I’m talking about Australia and therefore I am absolutely right about the vaccinations and camps for there.

Nobody was ever forced to take the vax.
Persuaded, but never forced.
Strict travel limits were imposed as well as lockdown restrictions.
The only people arrested and locked up were violent demonstrators, and those that were found not obeying the quarantine restrictions.

If an American cop tells you to do something, and you attack or abuse him/her, what is the likely outcome of that ?
Same thing happens here, you will end up being cuffed and locked up.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Nobody was ever forced to take the vax.
Persuaded, but never forced.
Strict travel limits were imposed as well as lockdown restrictions.
The only people arrested and locked up were violent demonstrators, and those that were found not obeying the quarantine restrictions.

If an American cop tells you to do something, and you attack or abuse him/her, what is the likely outcome of that ?
Same thing happens here, you will end up being cuffed and locked up.

Do you have 100% vaccination or not?

Australia: percentage of adults vaccinated with COVID-19 vaccine by state 2022 | Statista

As of August 22, 2022, over 80 percent of adults in Western Australia had been vaccinated with three doses of a COVID-19 vaccine.

www.statista.com

Looks like mandatory to me.

Coercion and lockdown unless you take vaccination is forced..