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Schneider XW Pro 6848 AC2 Generator Not showing up in Insight.

When I saw my issue, the XW status page always showed ...
AC2 Voltage
210 V
AC2 L1 Voltage
106 V
AC2 L2 Voltage
105 V
AC2 Frequency
59.5 Hz
Yet it would not qualify for me. Constantly said Qualifying. The above was well within my Config settings for ac2.
It took me to reenter those upper and lower values slightly differently to overcome my issue.
It now says Qualification Good.
Also note that you will never see AC2 qualify good until you disconnect or force AC1 off. Both will not Qualify Good at the same time.
I opened up AC2 voltage & freq to min & max & my generator qualifies. Thanks so much for your help!
It is quite possible that when one downloads and applies and upgrade, the values are invisible and internal. The numbers on the webpage no longer truly represent the internal or operational values. When you apply individual changes you force the webpage side to push the corrected values into the internal operation code.
Someday S/E might look into this allegation I am making. Might be some truth to it as so many of us have generator issues.
Hello, people of this thread, New member here, and i realize this thread is almost a year old by now. I'm having similar issues that keepsake is having with is generator not qualifying. I am gonna paste what i just emailed off to schneider electric, as it should give the most clarity on what my issues are and what i have tried
- I have two XWPro 6848 inverters, two MPPT60 150 Solar Charge Controllers, one Conext Gateway with an SCP display, and one XWAGS. This off-grid unit was installed in 2019. This past month a lithium ion battery got installed and took place of the lead acid batteries that were previously installed. All components have been upgraded to the newest firmware Schneider Electric has released (inverter: 2.04.00bn29).
- My generator worked fine at charging the lead acid batteries. After the lithium ion battery install and the firmware upgrades and settings changed so the lithium battery is charged and monitored properly from the MPPT Charge controllers and the XWPRO inverters. My generator will not "qualify" and charge the battery through the inverters. (I have no faults/warnings showing from the BMS or the inverters, it simply won't qualify for any length of time.)
- With XWPRO 6848, AC2 voltage limits set to the default settings the generator will qualify and connect for 2-3 seconds, then disconnect, it will try to reconnect after 40s approximately and it will repeat this cycle for 5 tries at least, (i usually turn off the generator by then). When i connect and turn an area fan/heater (1500 watts) to the generators 120 outlet, it will then connect to the inverters for approximately 20-30 seconds then disconnect, it will repeat this cycle about 3 times, after this it will reconnect but only for 5 seconds approximately and repeat this cycle.
- With XWPRO, AC2 voltage settings 'widened' so there is more voltage and frequency range on the high and low side to give a better chance of the genset staying connected, i tried to get the generator to qualify with the area heater on (this is plugged into the generator outlet directly), and it did qualify and connect for approximately 50 seconds and then it disconnected and it behaved the same way it did before. Without the area fan/heater it still would only qualify/connect for 5 or less seconds then disconnect.
- My Hz out the generator is sitting at 60 give or take 2 Hz depending on my experimentation with the generator speed. AC2 L1 volts averages 122, AC2 L2 averages 120 volts when the generator is not qualified/connected.
- When it is qualified/connected, my values were (on average) 3147 watts, 58 Hz, AC2 L1 117 volts, AC2 L2 130.4 V, AC2 L1 active current -12A, AC2 L2 active current -11.3A, AC2 active current -12.5A, AC2 voltage 247.4 V.
- Some more background, my LED Christmas lights would flicker when the generator is running, it did before when i had the lead acid batteries and the generator was running. When it is qualified/connected currently the LED lights flicker as well.
- My generator is a 1.3L isuzu diesel engine with a 8KW pancake generator, model: 332CSA5211.

- Any suggestions on what i should do in order to get the generator to qualify/connect to the inverters so it can properly charge the batteries?
Yet it would not qualify for me. Constantly said Qualifying. T
That usually means there is too much wobble in the generator's rpm control by its speed governor. Generator should sound smooth and steady without a sound pitch 'wha-wha' variation. A DVM frequency readout is too slow to show the wobble frequency variance.

First, it detects an AC voltage on AC_in port. Then it starts its phase locking frequency scan of the inverter set frequency range limits. You can put your DVM in freq readout mode on inverter AC output and see the frequency scan happening while it is trying to qualify the AC input.

Inverter must phase lock to generator and inverter phase lock bandwidth is very narrow. Too much generator speed wobble is like trying to thread a needle with an unsteady hand holding the needle.

The phase locking of inverter is slow and narrow. It slowly scans the frequency range set limits in the inverter until it finds a phase lock. Then it closes pass-through relay connecting to generator. If the generator is wobbling in phase due to rpm wobbling it will pass by the frequency of generator and continue to scan the allowable freq limits set in inverter.

The wider the frequency range limits set in inverter, the longer it may take to lock onto AC_in source. This is why AC1 which is usually used for accurate grid frequency is set to a narrower search range freq limits than AC_2 used for a generator input. AC_1 has priority so if AC_1 input shows up while generator is running on AC_2, the generator pass-through relay will release, and inverter will begin lock search onto AC1_input.

Frequency range limits set in inverter has nothing to do with phase lock bandwidth of inverter. If a sudden surge load on generator causes it to bog down and change rpms, the inverter may lose phase lock and release the pass-through relay to generator.
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Thanks for the reply RCinFLA, my generator does not surge up or down, audibly that is anyway.

What is DVM frequency? The DVM is what i'm curious about.

When the generator is qualified the generator bogs down a little bit and runs steady, but it doesn't surge, its just attempting to meet the 3200 watt load that it is putting out.

RCinFLA are you still thinking it might be along the lines of the generator surging? Or any other settings in the inverter that can cause 'out of range readings'? To go into frequency read out mode am im doing this through insight - XWPRO device - status, performance or configurations?
Many newer digital multi-meters (DVM's) have a frequency counter setting that allows you to check AC output frequency of a generator.

The most common issue on synchronous fixed speed generators is their speed control stability. Second most common, particularly on older generators is they are low in rpm's, therefore low in frequency, possibly below the inverter acceptable range limit.

Older generators have nothing more than a wind vane running from flywheel cooling air blower with spring loaded linkage to carburetor throttle control. They have an adjustable set screw to adjust engine speed for 60 Hz output, which varies a bit as the generator is loaded more and more. If there is a sudden drop in rpm the inverter will not be able to follow it and cause inverter to release. These are notoriously poor for holding a stable output frequency.

New generators have electronic control modules running a stepper motor on carburetor throttle. They use a hall effect magnetic sensor to measure flywheel rpm's. They also have an electronic regulator to better hold their AC output voltage constant.

Older generators AC output voltage is also a function of their rpms so as rpm is low, frequency is low, and AC output voltage is low. Those three items as well as holding a constant rpm are the only criteria for an inverter to connect to generator.
That all makes sense to me. Just for some reference i believe my genset is a 2003. And it's an Isuzu 1.3L, 3 cylinder diesel, so i have no linkage in regards to a carburetor, i just have a governor set screw that can be adjusted manually to increase/decrease engine rpm. I have tweaked the engine rpm some while using it, and it definitely affects the voltage and hz values

I actually was able to get the generator to connect to the inverters and stay qualified for 20 mins. It would not qualify without having the load of a 1500W heater attached to the genset outlet plug. With the heater not plugged in, it would attempt to qualify and as soon as it said qualified the generator would just drop rpm slightly (audibly) and it would not stay qualified to the inverters.

With the heater on, plus i lowered the charging rate down to 5% instead of 35% (only feeding 7.5A per inverter into the battery), then it stayed qualified for 20mins, the kicker is that my Christmas lights flickered last winter when the genset kicked in, but when it connected this time, my Christmas lights were flickering quite aggressively, i also had two hall lights flickering in the house which i haven't had happen before.

I want to hook up another generator with the same phase and voltage and see how it works with the system. If it does work fine, then my dilemma is whether i buy a generator and install on the engine or possibly wire in an isolation transformer which was suggested to me by a friend, to smooth out the dirty power which i am experiencing.
I want to hook up another generator with the same phase and voltage and see how it works with the system. If it does work fine, then my dilemma is whether i buy a generator and install on the engine or possibly wire in an isolation transformer which was suggested to me by a friend, to smooth out the dirty power which i am experiencing.
I'm no transformer expert, but I don't think any type of transformer is going to change the frequency coming from your generator.

I'd be happy to be proven wrong. Maybe the magnet field on the core will stabilize the frequency? Seems like a stretch.
Here in Florida, after the hurricane. No utility power.
Cannot get more than 500 watts of charge from AX2 (gen) into my batteries. Any ideas ?
Gen will automatically provide the house loads power plus 500 watts more for charging. But when my loads go down, I still cannot see more than the 500 w into batteries. When I have grid ac1 before the storm, I could charge 2 to 3 kws.
Have any readers of this thread, used their XW 6848 Pro, with their genset on AC2, and been able to use the Generator Support mode ?
No matter what settings I have tried, when the genset get up to the Support Amps, it doesn't work together, the XW just goes on batteries, and after the timeout of 10 seconds or so, goes back to 100% on genset. Never assists as manual says it is supposed to.
Any feedback of any might help.
I am using the XWPro 6848 with solar, batt, and Gen AGS (On Grid.) Gen set to come on at 30%SoC and off at 95%SoC. The gen shows on the dashboard, but the kW in/out does not show from the generator. It works fine otherwise. I am not sure exactly what you are trying to do. My generator and grid are never connected. If you are trying to do some load shaving, that's a whole different thing .I've never tried that because I don't particularly want it. Load shaving is under Devices > Inverter > Configuration > Advanced > “Grid Energy Management (Grit Support.)
Another common mistake is not setting maximum charge current rate to stay within limits of generator power capability. Inverter will lock on generator then quickly jump on generator with set bulk charging rate.

If this bulk charging load setting on inverter exceeds power capability of generator the generator will bog down causing inverter to immediately release from generator. A few minutes later it will repeat the same process again.

On some inverters that have separate Generator AC input you can just set the maximum AC input current limit on Gen port to stay within generator capability. Charge rate will automatically be backed down to stay within AC input current limit, with any additional AC output loads added to charging load for AC input current limit total summation.
Another common mistake is not setting maximum charge current rate to stay within limits of generator power capability. Inverter will lock on generator then quickly jump on generator with set bulk charging rate.
Very good point!
When I figured out a working configuration to charge the batteries via AC2, purposely ran the batteries down to 80% for a test.
Fired up the generator, batteries immediately pulled 12kw from the genset!
One of my pet peeves on XW is they changed the naming convention on AC input current limiting.

The setup for AC port input current limit is cloaked within the 'AC input breaker' size user setting with 20% margin subtracted off for actual AC current limit. Just makes setting AC input current limit more complicated and confusing. The wording in manual adds to the user confusion.

Way overly complicated then it needs to be.

When you have a synchronous generator, its governor may be slow to react to a motor startup turn on surge current resulting in a momentary bog down on generator that results in inverter releasing from generator. You can set AC current limit lower to allow the inverter to supplement the surge but that also lowers the constant AC current level draw where the inverter supplements AC output current from battery.

Victron inverters have an additional feature called 'dynamic load shaving' where it measures the rate of increase in AC input current and will begin to supplement AC output from inverter/battery before AC input current setting limit is reached. When the surge calms down the inverter/battery supplementing is backed down as long as the AC input current is still under AC input current limit setting. This, in theory, gives a jump on supplementing surge currents. Since the inverter has some reaction time, I am not sure how effective it truly is.
I answered my own question.

The Generator emblem doesn't show up in Insight Local until AFTER the first time the generator is qualified. Then it's there.

Got the Generator qualified finally and now for some load testing.

View attachment 79522
My generator is running, qualified, etc. And the icon shows up. Bur energy flow does not show (moving dots)

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