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diy solar

Should I earth my electrics or not in my van?

Gueyog8a7

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I haven't so far as when doing research I read that it is questionable if it is required and so didn't. Something about how it self earths anyway or something. Don't remember exactly but since it seemed optional I did not dig into it.

I see some comments on various places that people do though so should I?

Just a simple dc only system 200w solar and 100ah lifepo4 battery.
 
I haven't so far as when doing research I read that it is questionable if it is required and so didn't. Something about how it self earths anyway or something. Don't remember exactly but since it seemed optional I did not dig into it.

I see some comments on various places that people do though so should I?

Just a simple dc only system 200w solar and 100ah lifepo4 battery.


You mean something like this?

1704098753688.png


Most people wouldn't bother, unless you don't like getting sometimes shocked with a static charge when you get in and out of your vehicle.
 
i thought all vehicles used the chassis as an earth on a DC system. are you asking should the van then be 'earthed' to the ground?
 
Boats have anchors.
Vans don't need them. (As long as the parking brake works)
 
Serious answer.
For a mobile installation. You don't need to connect to the earth.
Depending on the size of the system , how it's used, and equipment choices. My personal preference will differ.
 
Not exactly sure about "self earthing", but especially when LA batteries were the norm the batteries would be connected to the vehicle chassis via the starter battery anyways.
 
The 'earth' in your van in the van metal body. The battery negative on the starter battery and your house battery connect to van metal.

If you connect to an external AC power supply, then the protective earth of this supply connects to van metal.

Within the van the AC circuits need a 'consumer unit/fuse box', with double pole RCD and MCB.

 
In the USA (which may differ from standards in UK), generally:

* the metal car chassis / frame is used as the earth ("ground") circuit for low amperage DC devices
* for high amperage DC devices it's recommended to use a dedicated return circuit. For example, when including a DC to AC Inverter, it's best practices to wire + and - directly to your battery or bus bars. Don't try to use the car's metal body as the negative return circuit.
* for AC power, if you are running self-contained, you want a single AC neutral to AC ground bond which may be in the inverter itself, or in your RV load panel.
* for AC power, if you are running from an external source "shore power" - the neutral-ground bond should not be in the RV but should be in the feeder circuit itself.
* if your RV can switch between inverter power and shore power, you need to figure out how to handle this switching o the NG bond.
* Also, to add confusion: in USA household wiring, black is AC hot, white is AC neutral, and green (or bare metal) is AC ground, and red is often used for a switched circuit. In USA automotive wiring, black is generally DC negative, red is DC positive, and ground is often DC brown. This causes lots of confusion as many RVs will be a mix of the two standards.
 
differ from standards in UK
Much the same. With imported AC, the neutral to earth bond is at the supply point, not in the van, but the protective earth conductor in the supply cable must connect to van metal. With locally generated AC as a permanent instalation, the power source must be neutral to earth bond and earth leakage fitted, (RCD in the UK). The inverter exception is a pass through inverter operating in pass through mode, where the bond is at the AC external supply point.
high amperage DC devices it's recommended to use a dedicated return circuit. For example, when including a DC to AC Inverter, it's best practices to wire + and - directly to your battery or bus bars. Don't try to use the car's metal body as the negative return circuit.
Every metal bodied vehicle uses the metal as an negative return for the alternator and starter circuits. The issue with van conversions is that often a poor connection to the metal is made, so creating issues.
The use of dedicated return negatives does not negate the need for the house battery to have the negative connected to vehicle metal.
Any earth point on equipment casing, chargers and inverters, should connect to van metal.

An issue that is causing some problems with conversion of newer vehicles, is smart alternator charging. There are current detection circuits in starter battery negative conection to the vehicle metal. This is used to control the charging process. When fitting DC to DC chargers or power relays for house battery charging, the negative feed must be from vehicle metal to avoid compromising vehicles charging.
In the UK there are 'van life' guys putting a great deal of advice on you tube videos regarding van conversion electrical systems. The majority of advice is unsafe practice. Unlike most other European countries, for personal vehicle use, there is no requirement to use qualified electrical installers or to have the system tested to the required standards.
 
You have a simple, 12V system. Lower voltage like that should not be an issue as long as misuse is not happening.

I run a small 24V system in my truck with a Victron 1200VA inverter, none of it is connected to the chassis. No problems.

Thanks for asking this question. Maybe someone will come up with a scenario where connecting the negative to the chassis is better. Certainly more skilled individuals here than myself.
 
i thought all vehicles used the chassis as an earth on a DC system. are you asking should the van then be 'earthed' to the ground?
No I am talking about the chassis which I read was optional. So no intentional grounding at all anywhere so far. Not grounded to chassis or anything.
 
Not grounded to chassis or anything.
It's optional for you to connect battery negative to chassis but it's safer and best practice to do so. There are regulations for leasure vehicle AC and DC circuits in the UK that I have to follow if I design a system or work on someone's vehicle for payment. I do this because I don't want anyone injured or worse and/or the vehicle burning down.

You have a heating system, and for safety you have a CO monitor, it's optional, but you consider it is worth investing in a CO monitor.

To safely wire up a DC or AC system, in a camper conversion, to meet the regulations, is not expensive or difficult, yet there are those on you tube and facebook that chose not to implement electrical systems that meet the required standards.
 
I run a small 24V system in my truck with a Victron 1200VA inverter, none of it is connected to the chassis. No problems.
No problem at the moment.
Stuff can develop faults , wire insulation can fail.
Victron are specific regarding earthing to the chassis body!
Screenshot_20240102-171716_Drive~2.jpg
 
No problem at the moment.
Stuff can develop faults , wire insulation can fail.
Victron are specific regarding earthing to the chassis body!
View attachment 186452
Can you explain the reasoning for this? Not trying to argue, but I would like to be able to conceptualize why it is safer. My brain short circuits when I try to think it through and finding a coherent answer proves difficult.
 
Can you explain the reasoning for this?
Download the pdf,

Everything if fine until faults develops inside the electrical item, inverter, appliance, or on cables in the system.
Read the section in the Wiring Unlimited .

Mike
 
12v dc only
You still need the house battery, leasure battery, connected to the van metal 'earth'. If you fit a DC to DC charger, it will need this to function for most chargers.

Poor connections, failed insulation, faulty 12V devices, can cause current flow and/or return through unwanted paths, metal parts of the vehicle and its equipment. By having the battery negative connected to the metal, protective overcurrent fuses would fail and prevent issues, like fire.

I guess at times you have AC 230v in the van. Again faulty equipment or cables could introduce AC live on the van metal. Anyone outside touching the van , perhaps standing on damp ground, would receive an electric shock. By having the van metal connected to the imported earth conductor, breakers or fuses at the supply point would provide protection.
 
Issue comes into play when you connect to shore power. Safest setup is grounding stake when connected to shore power.

You never know what might be happening between neutral and ground on shore power outlets. There are long AC distribution lines and some other camper may have neutral and ground connected together pulling ground above real earth ground with their loads. Camp grounds should have GFCI breakers to prevent this but not all do.

You might have an AC voltage between your RV chassis and earth ground when on shore power.

You can get a neutral-hot GFCI breaker to put on your shore power feed to check for balanced current on your neutral-hot feed. If there is a real ground current return bleeding current it will be detected and break shore power connection. It is like two wire GFCI plugs on hair driers.
 
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