Sol-Ark's Comment on EG4 18k-PV-12-LV

[pilotdrh]

you were going to get a SolArk which is splitphase. That made me assume you had splitphase.

I sold all of my large 120 volt stuff before I moved here.

 

[SignatureSolarJames]

Page 26 of the manual claims it can handle 8kW of imbalance.

Imbalance isnt the issue as much as the 50% cap of capacity on each leg, we can do 67% power on each 120v leg or 8kW each of 12

 

[timselectric]

I thought only half the unit was from China, I thought I read on here that Sol-Ark builds part of it here, and makes their own software.

Deye builds the unit and puts the Sol-Ark logo on it. With the software version of their choice.
Then ships it to Sol-Ark. When you receive it, you are the first one to see it since it left China.

 

[Lt.Dan]

Imbalance isnt the issue as much as the 50% cap of capacity on each leg, we can do 67% power on each 120v leg or 8kW each of 12

I still haven't actually seen this happen. Is there a video showing it?

 

[HighTechLab]

Deye builds the unit and puts the Sol-Ark logo on it. With the software version of their choice.
Then ships it to Sol-Ark. When you receive it, you are the first one to see it since it left China.

I don't have a source to cite, but I vaguely recall being told FW was loaded in Texas as part of the final QC / poweron procedure and that process is where the serial number is "born" (and to be fair crookedly labeled on the inverter). I'll have to double check my sources so I can offer something to stand behind the claim.

 

[timselectric]

I think any Klutz could imbalance a high frequency inverter if he tried hard enough.

You forgot to add in split-phase.
My high frequency inverters can't be imbalanced.

 

[timselectric]

I don't have a source to cite, but I vaguely recall being told FW was loaded in Texas as part of the final QC / poweron procedure and that process is where the serial number is "born" (and to be fair crookedly labeled on the inverter). I'll have to double check my sources so I can offer something to stand behind the claim.

I would fully expect them to pull out a percentage of units for QC inspection. But I don't see them unboxing and putting hands on every single unit.

 

[houseofancients]

So I'm not nearly as up to speed as you all on this, but am curious. I really want an all-in-one-inverter for my offgrid world. And I really like the smart load concept that both the EG and SolARK will do (when 90% charge and keeping up with loads, divert the excess solar somewhere else). I got spooked off on SolARK because of the David Poz video showing how he managed to trip his from the balancing aspect. Would the EG model suffer the same reality?

david did not put up a fair comparison here..
just like a lot of youtubers this was a demo setup to fail

 

[Plum Crazy Rob]

I would fully expect them to pull out a percentage of units for QC inspection. But I don't see them unboxing and putting hands on every single unit.

I watched a promo Sol-Ark YouTube video where they had a bunch of units out of the boxes on tables and wire boxes all open and it looked like employees tightening/loosening lug screws. I believe meant to give illusion of "happy Texas employees manufacturing our units"

I wondered if the Sol-Ark sticker goes on in China. What a kick in the nuts!

 

[cs1234]

I don't have a source to cite, but I vaguely recall being told FW was loaded in Texas as part of the final QC / poweron procedure and that process is where the serial number is "born" (and to be fair crookedly labeled on the inverter). I'll have to double check my sources so I can offer something to stand behind the claim.

I would fully expect them to pull out a percentage of units for QC inspection. But I don't see them unboxing and putting hands on every single unit.

If they pay anything near what we can get them for as a DEYE unit, then they have ample margin to pay people in the US to load a firmware on them and run a few minutes of basic tests before selling them to us.

 

[timselectric]

If they pay anything near what we can get them for as a DEYE unit, then they have ample margin to pay people in the US to load a firmware on them and run a few minutes of basic tests before selling them to us.

But it's not an efficient production process to open every single unit , again. This is only something that would be done if a bad batch got through the original manufacturing process. And it was minor enough to be cost effective to make the repairs. Instead of discarding the whole batch.

 

[Lt.Dan]

But it's not an efficient production process to open every single unit , again. This is only something that would be done if a bad batch got through the original manufacturing process. And it was minor enough to be cost effective to make the repairs. Instead of discarding the whole batch.

I can just imagine a container of SolArks in the dumpster ?

 

[cs1234]

But it's not an efficient production process to open every single unit , again. This is only something that would be done if a bad batch got through the original manufacturing process. And it was minor enough to be cost effective to make the repairs. Instead of discarding the whole batch.

Sure, not efficient.. but it's not like they are a diaper manufacturer. The things cost nearly $8,000+ each and aren't exactly high volume.

 

[timselectric]

Sure, not efficient.. but it's not like they are a diaper manufacturer. The things cost nearly $8,000+ each and aren't exactly high volume.

That's what they sell for.
Cost is much lower.
And the volume is high enough that efficient productivity makes a difference to the profit margin.

I can just imagine a container of SolArks in the dumpster ?

That's what an insurance claim is for.
But yes, it would bring a tear to my eye.

 

[cs1234]

That's what they sell for.
Cost is much lower.
And the volume is high enough that efficient productivity makes a difference to the profit margin.

I have no idea what their volume is. As such, I can't say whether paying a QA person to inspect DEYE's work is worthwhile to them.

My experience running a company providing a service that depends on equipment made in China has certainly soured my opinions though. I'm not in control of the quality processes involved, but failure rates are high enough, that I make it a company policy to carry at least two spares for every part I'm installing to avoid a return trip. Obviously my experience does not equal every experience dealing with manufacturing out of China, I'm sure Apple has a much higher success rate than I'm used to seeing on my end.

 

[Hedges]

Imbalance isnt the issue as much as the 50% cap of capacity on each leg, we can do 67% power on each 120v leg or 8kW each of 12

Sounds like boost converter from 48V battery to HV rail is good for 12 kVA, and each 120V phase inverter from HV rail to AC output is good for 8kVA

Which is actually a very nice thing - for the boost converter, kVA = kW, because all power delivered is "real"
For inverter output, load likely has some inductive or otherwise non-ideal characteristic, either current draw out of phase or pulses of current, PF < 1.0. With 8kVA capability, you can put full 6kW on each leg and probably deliver 12kW into non-ideal loads.

That's what an insurance claim is for.
But yes, it would bring a tear to my eye.

Insurance wouldn't cover flaws/errors from manufacturing.
Better hope the bad batch gets damaged in shipping.

 

[solar8484]

I have no idea what their volume is. As such, I can't say whether paying a QA person to inspect DEYE's work is worthwhile to them.

My experience running a company providing a service that depends on equipment made in China has certainly soured my opinions though. I'm not in control of the quality processes involved, but failure rates are high enough, that I make it a company policy to carry at least two spares for every part I'm installing to avoid a return trip. Obviously my experience does not equal every experience dealing with manufacturing out of China, I'm sure Apple has a much higher success rate than I'm used to seeing on my end.

It's totally possible to get great QA out of factories in China. Apple sends a team of up to 100 engineers/technicians every month to their China factories to fix and ensure quality before products get shipped.

 

[timselectric]

Sol-Ark also has their own QC personnel at the Deye factory.

 

[cs1234]

So double check it here in the states, or double check it there. So long as somebody is double checking it I suppose. The problem is really that the 3rd party Chinese manufacturing company isn't doing that themselves. If you agree to manufacturer something for somebody, to a certain standard, they shouldn't have to babysit you to make sure you do it properly. I realize we don't live in an ideal world, but one can dream.

 

[Hedges]

Left to their own devices, some contractors will deliver test results right down the middle between limits.
They usually aren't clever enough to distribute them properly, so it is obviously dry-labbed.

It is useful to feed known flaws to quality checkers. Unless you're the TSA, because that can mean a firearm getting through. (Note to TSA: I suggest only non-functional replicas for this purpose.)

Sample testing stateside should work for foreign manufacturers, but then you have a container load of faulty product. Maybe with contract and payment arrangement so the pain is borne by manufacturer. In the end, boots on the ground seems to the the best way. For Golden Gate Bridge, all the program managers had to do was say repaired welds did not need reinspection, and then fire the inspection company when it came time to renew contract.

 

[DIYrich]

I can just imagine a container of SolArks in the dumpster ?

Take them apart for spare parts.

 

[jrcromer]

So double check it here in the states, or double check it there... I realize we don't live in an ideal world, but one can dream.

Sol-Ark provides this at its TX HQ on the entire production line entering the USA before it hits distributor shelves. So sleep soundly or come take a tour if you are still counting sheep.

 

[jrcromer]

When you receive it, you are the first one to see it since it left China.

Baloney.

 

[jrcromer]

I watched a promo Sol-Ark YouTube video where they had a bunch of units out of the boxes on tables and wire boxes all open and it looked like employees tightening/loosening lug screws. I believe meant to give illusion of "happy Texas employees manufacturing our units"

I wondered if the Sol-Ark sticker goes on in China. What a kick in the nuts!

Come take a tour of our facility. I think you will see the same thing as the video, but not be so cynical about our product or quality control or the role of the USA in global manufacturing. If you want to do more, lobby your representatives to include the domestic production incentives afforded to utility-scale solar to also apply to residential projects. I can tell you having personally switched jobs recently from a Chinese-owned manufacturer, that I was as amazed as you at how relatively happy Sol-Ark employees are. On camera and off camera.