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diy solar

What Can I personally do to help against climate change?

I would think that the more electric cars sold, the more petroleum fuel prices should fall.. Especially when they start selling electric trucks to replace the gas guzzling soccer mom and dad use to go back and forth to work with.


In what drug induced alternate reality universe did you get that load of misinformation garbage from? Not even close.


Nope.. The cost is cheaper because the labor is cheaper.. Employees don't unionize, sue their own employers, or do all the other "spoiled entitlement" behaviors Americans do. Their employers also don't have to pay unemployment, social security, stupid insurance, and a variety of other legally mandated things.. American's demanded those things, we got what we asked for. Remember that the next time you read about someone slipping on a sidewalk and suing the business.. or spilling hot coffee on themselves and suing the business. It has absolutely NOTHING, ZERO, to do with a company's cost for environmental regulations.

In fact, most pollution controls are not even a significant investment for companies.. And I know.. My family's own company ran industrial ovens that exhausted gasses that had to be curtailed via the EPA guidelines.. The cost of installing and running after-burners was pretty minimal. I also did some engineering work with a plating company just down the road from us.. same deal. They had to cut emissions out of a waste water stream.. and again, the cost was minimal.

Stop reading all the wacko right wing crap.. they're lying to you.. pure and simple.

Buying USA made products is always a good thing.. but it has nothing to do with climate change. YOU driving your car does.. YOU keeping your home at 70+ degrees in the winter does.. YOU turning on the air conditioner because its "a bit warm outside" does.. YOU are the cause of climate change, not china, india, or any other country.

But the wack job websites won't tell you that.. and no politician WILL EVER EVER come out and say something is YOUR fault and YOU need to chage YOUR behaviors. Never going to happen.


Yes we do.. once again, your information is wrong.

NOPE.. WRONG WRONG AND WRONG AGAIN..

How the hell did you survive puberty?

I see your the typical leftest because you have to make personal attacks to prove your point or ideas are far more superior.
It just shows not only your arrogance and ignorance and stops the conversation.
 
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Not even close. USA is one of the worst emitters both in absolute terms and per capita.

Look at the data again. The USA has gone down in emissions from 2017 to 2020. China has increased so who is doing more. And China emissions are double almost 3 times that of USA
Not even close. USA is one of the worst emitters both in absolute terms and per capita.


Look at the data again. The USA has gone down in emissions from 2017 to 2020. China has increased so who is doing more. And China emissions are double almost 3 times that of USA
 
I see your the typical leftest because you have to make personal attacks to prove your point or ideas are far more superior.
It just shows not only your arrogance and ignorance and stops the conversation.
I'm not left or right.. but in my older age, I have zero tolerance for stupid, misinformation, and dumb propaganda..

There's no such thing as a conversation with people who willfully keep themselves ignorant.
 
Look at the data again. The USA has gone down in emissions from 2017 to 2020. China has increased so who is doing more. And China emissions are double almost 3 times that of USA
ROFLMAO.. Instead of changing your statement or your argument, why not just admit you're wrong? You see, that's the difference between people like me and people like yourself.. Sometimes I am wrong, and then I admit it, learn from my mistake, and move forward.

You don't seem to want to admit your mistake.. Now you're changing the argument to "who is doing more"..

Look at the data again. The USA has gone down in emissions from 2017 to 2020. China has increased so who is doing more. And China emissions are double almost 3 times that of USA
I really don't know if they are or aren't.. it doesn't matter to me because I don't vote or live in China. Also, here's a tip: Never point at someone else's behavior to justify your own.

Being honorable means being truthful, and if you don't know the truth, go look it up.. stop being lazy.
 
Ok then everyone run out and but a Tesla. We have 5 charging stations where I live. 5 charging stations for 43k people. All the electric power plants here are coal or natural gas. So it doesn't make any sense to buy an electric car. Not to mention the electric grid couldn't handle all the extra load on it.

 
Ok then everyone run out and but a Tesla. We have 5 charging stations where I live. 5 charging stations for 43k people. All the electric power plants here are coal or natural gas. So it doesn't make any sense to buy an electric car. Not to mention the electric grid couldn't handle all the extra load on it.


The proper, well reasoned adult rationalization is "If I were to purchase an EV, how would I keep it charged. My town only has 5 charging stations"

Instead, your: "ok then, everyone run out and buy a Tesla", makes you sound like a 20 something year old who hasn't lived long enough to know anything yet.

You can charge EV's at your house.. You do have electricity at your home right? Now, if you're in an apartment where such arraignments are not available yet, then you'll need to wait a while until the market catches up, or until you get a better job and buy your own home..

No one expects a college kid or burger flipper living in a 3rd story apartment to go out and buy a tesla if they can't access a charging station..

Eventually, my guess is about 5 to 7 years, you will see apartments advertising charging stations in their parking spaces to attract renters.. but with so few EVs on the road so far, there's no reason for it yet.

Shortly after that, you will probably see federal laws enacted that force condominium associations to allow the installation of chargers as well..

Change happens slowly and some people find it painful.. that doesn't mean its a bad thing, especially when its necessary.

Also, your comment about the electric grid is full of crap too.. The grid has plenty of reserve capacity, especially with all the people putting solar on their homes these days.
 
Look at the data again.
I don't need to. This is the claim being refuted:
the USA is already the cleanest most carbon neutral country

Your original statement is just factually inaccurate, and not just a little bit wrong but comprehensively so. That's the thing with facts, they don't care what you think/believe.

By the way, my own country is even worse than the USA on a per capita basis, largely due to our reliance on coal and gas for energy. Like the USA we are making some inroads as renewable energy supply is growing, just not quickly enough.

Ok then everyone run out and but a Tesla. We have 5 charging stations where I live. 5 charging stations for 43k people.
It might come as a surprise to learn that where there is demand, business works on ways of supplying it. More charge stations will emerge as more EVs are purchased, the grid will cope quite well and people such as the many good folk on this forum will have their own sources of solar PV energy to charge their EV.

In Australia by the end of the decade EVs will be responsible for adding about 3% to grid demand. By that time domestic rooftop solar alone will have increased to supply from 7% of grid demand today to about 15% of the grid's total demand. I think the grid will be fine. I can't say specifically about the USA but you have good engineers, they will work it out. If little ol' down under can work it out, I'm pretty sure my 'mericun friends can.
 
Ok then everyone run out and but a Tesla. We have 5 charging stations where I live. 5 charging stations for 43k people. All the electric power plants here are coal or natural gas. So it doesn't make any sense to buy an electric car. Not to mention the electric grid couldn't handle all the extra load on it.

The carbon emissions from coal and natural gas power plants is lower per ratio than gasoline car motors.
With the regulations in place, and the scrubbers cleaning the tower emissions, electricity from these power plants is more efficient, thus lower carbon footprint than the same energy from burning gasoline to move a daily driver vehicle.
Now, it certainly would be better carbon footprint wise if the plant was nuclear, wind, hydro, or solar… but some states simply can’t use wind, or hydro… and nuclear has its pitfalls keeping those plants from being built in many places.
 
...you can't just turn the spigot off when the infrastructure to make it happen just isn't there.
It's not a sudden spigot turnoff, our national strategy is a 30-year plan and we've known about climate change for decades.

A lot of the arguments you hear are from people resisting the change, trying to prevent that infrastructure. They know anything they can do to delay or destroy the existing infrastructure so painfully built-up (e.g., Florida HB 741) slows progress. But that progress creates new businesses and brings new jobs at the cost of toppling century-old monopolies. Without the dire need for oil, countries that don't have it can't be held hostage by countries that do.

People don't like things shoved down their throat.
I see it more like WWII. Americans didn't want to get involved until the sneak attack on Pearl Harbor. Many thought it just wasn't our fight.

A lot of folks feel the same way about climate change. It's either not their fight, they're willing to let others do it, or they're actively resisting it. So it might feel like it's shoved down their throat now. But it's a problem we made over the last century and then ignored the last 30 years as we were more afraid of other things. It feels that way because like Pearl Harbor, a lot of us (me included) are just waking up to the cold harsh reality of climate war and the realization we can't afford to ignore it any longer.

My thought is the sooner we all start working together on this the less expensive it will be for everyone. Working against that are those that don't understand the issue or believe the lies. What they fail to realize is WW3 is already here. It's not a fight for ideology or territory, and it'll be won through hard work, cooperation, and the vote.

... electric car but the cost are prohibitive....Nor can I afford a 70k electric car.
The thread isn't trying to slap you in the face and scream YOU MUST DO THIS. Please don't take it that way or feel guilty if there are things you just can't do. It's about what you might be able to do if you want to and can. For example, all citizens of the appropriate age can vote. So don't feel obligated by any of the recommendations. But if there's something you can do and want to do, then ask questions if you're not sure or want to see if it's right for you.

The cheapest EV I know of is the Kona at under $28k. There's a $7500 rebate on EVs, so the effective price is $21k. EVs are less expensive to fuel per year too, about $600 on average, so over a 5-year life a cost reduction of $3000, bringing the effective cost down to $18k. There are reduced maintenance costs too.

In comparison, last summer the average new car price was around $40k (ref) The cheapest new ICE car I know of is the Chevy Spark, $16k - but it's being discontinued.

Except for the battery, EVs are cheaper to build and maintain than ICE cars. Battery prices are continuing to fall, so EV prices should fall too. Shouldn't be too much longer before EVs are cheaper and better than ICE cars (assuming we're not already there).

BTW, the national plan doesn't do away with ICE as many think, but it does shift gasoline to green fuels. Good news for the American farmer!

...I can't build my own solar and can't afford the $30+k I was quoted.
Solar's not the solution for everyone, they might live in a condo, have excessive shading from nearby buildings, etc.

But, whoever quoted you that was most likely trying to rip you off. If it's something you want; try getting another quote. Don't go with a lease, definitely not from a guy standing outside (or even inside) of HomeDepot.

The average installed price in Australia is $0.50 to $1.00/watt. In the U.S., it's typically between $2/W and $3/W. DIY is generally less than $1/W in the U.S.. A lot of folks get a very small system professionally installed that is "oversized" with the intent to add on after the fact. Then DIY add on a string of new panels as they can afford them (everything downstream is in place, so it's just copying the existing roof mounting and running the wires to a combiner box). Then there's the semi-DIY where you do all the planning, permits, and ordering, then have a handyman drill the holes and install the mounts, an electrician run the wires, etc. Prices for that are probably under $2/W. Folks on the forums are generally happy to help answer questions and plan how to shave costs; many of which have hard-won experience.

You also don't need a massive array, every little bit helps. Let's say for electricity you pay $0.134 per kWh and you have an average insolation of 4.5. Then each kW of solar panels saves you 365 x 4.5 x 1 x 0.134 = $220 in power each year. At $3/W the installed cost should be $3000, a 13-year payback and afterwards you're just making money. DIY would have less than a 5-year payback.

Update: Many countries still have some sort of rebate or federal program. For example, in the U.S. there's a federal credit of 26%, so that $3000 system actually costs $2220, and has a 10 year payback.

... they [other countries] don't care about the environment or using fossil fuels....
They do now. Almost every country has signed on to being net neutral by 2060, Some are more aggressive, e.g., Finland by 2035, Austria by 2040, Germany by 2045. We're signed up for 2050 (see our national strategy).

...we are all buying from countries that do not take the environment seriously....
All the big manufacturing companies (e.g., China, India) have signed a legally binding international treaty on climate change (e.g., the Paris Agreement). China's well underway in reducing emissions as measured independently. India has some really huge challenges and complications, but even they have a program underway.
 
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it's going to be painful no matter what, but so much less now & sooner, rather so much more pain later.

Every baby step helps. My family always give me the look when I flip off the power strip to the entertainment console (darn cable box draws a constant 25-watt), I ask them how much would I get if every American send me one lousy penny.
 
it's going to be painful no matter what, but so much less now & sooner, rather so much more pain later.

Every baby step helps. My family always give me the look when I flip off the power strip to the entertainment console (darn cable box draws a constant 25-watt), I ask them how much would I get if every American send me one lousy penny.
$3,297,000.00
Ish…
 

Methane​

Before diving into this, let's recap the basics of methane. The graph
to the right shows methane emission sources.

Methane is 25x more powerful than CO₂, has a half-life around a
decade, and eventually breaks down into CO₂. So, methand is a big
deal and doing what we can to eliminate it is a really good thing.

Starting at the bottom in the blue band, about 30% of the natural gas
comes from leaky pipelines, but about 60% comes from intentional
venting and about 5% from incomplete flaring. So there's a lot that
we can do to tighten up here.

In the green band, as was mentioned in Diet, Enteric fermentation (green)
can be reduced by lifestyle choices and cattle feed options (e.g., NOP).
That's about a 50% reduction.

The tan part of the graph is from landfills, and that's what this post is
about. There are biosolids (microbes in the dirt) that can eat the methane
and convert it into CO2 before it escapes a landfill.

But did you know there was something all of us could do that would
make a big difference in the methane generated in landfills?
1636310253847-png.71621

Composting​

I just learned about this. It's a great example of what lots of folks have known for a long time and took for granted. But most of us (me anyway) were clueless.

I learned about it while reading a law that California passed that follows a whole slew of such laws. Basically, it's to separate kitchen wastes similar to separating recycling. In a landfill, these wastes create a lot of methane:
Composting gives off minimal methane compared with landfills – 22 times less... The process produces carbon dioxide... and has many benefits... fosters plant growth – which, in turn, takes CO2 out of the air. ref

But if properly composted it creates mainly CO₂ and a lot less of it, that is more carbon stays fixed in the soil.

Even if you or your neighbors don't need the compost, it can be safely thrown away. Join the conversation in this thread to learn more.
 

Methane​

Before diving into this, let's recap the basics of methane. The graph
to the right shows methane emission sources.

Methane is 25x more powerful than CO₂, has a half-life around a
decade, and eventually breaks down into CO₂. So, methand is a big
deal and doing what we can to eliminate it is a really good thing.

Starting at the bottom in the blue band, about 30% of the natural gas
comes from leaky pipelines, but about 60% comes from intentional
venting and about 5% from incomplete flaring. So there's a lot that
we can do to tighten up here.

In the green band, as was mentioned in Diet, Enteric fermentation (green)
can be reduced by lifestyle choices and cattle feed options (e.g., NOP).
That's about a 50% reduction.

The tan part of the graph is from landfills, and that's what this post is
about. There are biosolids (microbes in the dirt) that can eat the methane
and convert it into CO2 before it escapes a landfill.

But did you know there was something all of us could do that would
make a big difference in the methane generated in landfills?
1636310253847-png.71621

Composting​

I just learned about this. It's a great example of what lots of folks have known for a long time and took for granted. But most of us (me anyway) were clueless.

I learned about it while reading a law that California passed that follows a whole slew of such laws. Basically, it's to separate kitchen wastes similar to separating recycling. In a landfill, these wastes create a lot of methane:


But if properly composted it creates mainly CO₂ and a lot less of it, that is more carbon stays fixed in the soil.

Even if you or your neighbors don't need the compost, it can be safely thrown away. Join the conversation in this thread to learn more.
Yay! I do something to offset a tiny amount the carbon I use (my footprint is LARGE)… I compost!
I grew up on farms all my life, and I’ve always separated my trash… used to do it for the pigs, and chickens… now I do it for ease of taking out the trash.
 
I had a chat yesterday with the much better half and we have agreed to pursue a few specific options, which I am now going to research. The first two are:

1. Move our hot water storage tank energy from the overnight off-peak grid energy and onto our regular daytime tariff when our solar PV can supply most of the energy. Our solar PV can supply 70-80% of the HW energy demand, grid supplemental energy required for the balance. Currently our excess solar PV is exported to the grid, which offsets grid fossil fuel, but it also offsets grid daytime renewables.
On Monday the electrician will be here to fit the Catch smart solar PV power diverter for my hot water storage system. It's taken quite a while to get one in.

This unit constantly monitors the available solar PV in excess of consumption and diverts that to the hot water system's resistive element, up to the peak power capacity of the element (3.6kW). I expect >90% of our hot water energy demand will now be met by our solar PV*. It is currently using overnight off-peak energy, which is almost solely coal fired power.

Since this also means my solar PV exports to the grid will be reduced which offset coal power elsewhere in the grid, it's not a direct reduction in emissions, but a net reduction. That's because the daytime grid is a lot cleaner than the nighttime grid.

My reasonable estimate is the net reduction in CO2 emissions will be ~1 tonne/year. As our grid gets cleaner each year, that net benefit gets larger.

2. Improve insulation at one end of the house. Our home is thermally pretty crap, and in many ways we can't do a lot about it due to its construction.

Had this done as well. Hard to say/measure the impact, it's been a weird Summer - very, very wet - we've had multiple big rain events and regions near me have experienced flooding events described as one in 3000 year events. Except they've now had two of them this year.

But it should help reduce the cooling/heating demand. I will be doing the same at the other end of the house but it will have some structural changes happening first so that has to wait.


* I modelled our excess solar and hot water demand in great detail to assess this at 5-min intervals over a couple of years.
 
On Monday the electrician will be here to fit the Catch smart solar PV power diverter for my hot water storage system. It's taken quite a while to get one in.
Good for you.(y)
But it should help reduce the cooling/heating demand. I will be doing the same at the other end of the house but it will have some structural changes happening first so that has to wait.
I am not sure what you will be using for insulation in the future but if it is rigid foam, you could purchase it now and (go hillbilly) place it against the walls where you loose/gain the most. It's a bandaid for sure but if the product is not available next year, at least you've got the bandaid.
 
I am not sure what you will be using for insulation in the future but if it is rigid foam, you could purchase it now and (go hillbilly) place it against the walls where you loose/gain the most. It's a bandaid for sure but if the product is not available next year, at least you've got the bandaid.

It was ceiling insulation.

Before:
IMG_3254.jpeg

After:
IMG_3258.jpeg

The brick veneer walls are a bit of a lost cause to insulate without complete removal of interior walls (not happening), as are the 80m² of single pane glass windows and doors. Dealing with those will take a lot of $. At least the eaves surrounding the whole house are 2m wide which do help a lot.

We are in a warm climate so nothing overly severe weather wise. Occasional super hot days >40°C.
 
It was ceiling insulation.

Are those insulation bats against the roof decking? I researched that last year as my mother-in-law's attic had some mold issues.

Not an expert by any means, but you might want to look at some of the early references cited in that thread. As I recall, putting bats against the roof is a bad idea as the attic builds up humidity and then moisture condenses on the roof decking above the batting causing it to rot out. To insulate against the roof decking it seems only sprayed foam can keep the moisture out, and even then you have to condition the space to prevent humidity build-up.
 
It was ceiling insulation.

The brick veneer walls are a bit of a lost cause to insulate without complete removal of interior walls (not happening), as are the 80m² of single pane glass windows and doors. Dealing with those will take a lot of $. At least the eaves surrounding the whole house are 2m wide which do help a lot.

We are in a warm climate so nothing overly severe weather wise. Occasional super hot days >40°C.
The leaking roof in both pictures is enough to make a grown man cry.
Is there any type of venting above the new insulation, in the "after" picture?
Rafter Venting.PNG I have never used the product but some say it works.
Each fall we put up clear plastic inside some windows to keep ALOT of cold from flowing into the house. 3M calls it a Window Insulator Kit.
I still don't understand why more folks are not using Shutters, whether inside or out they are effective.
Shutters 001.PNGShutters 002.PNG Old homes are a challenge but sometimes a simple fix can make a big difference.

Are those insulation bats against the roof decking? I researched that last year as my mother-in-law's attic had some mold issues.

Not an expert by any means, but you might want to look at some of the early references cited in that thread. As I recall, putting bats against the roof is a bad idea as the attic builds up humidity and then moisture condenses on the roof decking above the batting causing it to rot out. To insulate against the roof decking it seems only sprayed foam can keep the moisture out, and even then you have to condition the space to prevent humidity build-up.
Great information in the linked thread svetz. There's a healthy week of study.
 
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