Who is actually manufacturing this inverter?

[serene_badlands]

I recently installed a Fortress Power Envy 12K inverter. I ended up having to call three layers of support, and was surprised that it was actually a Chinese company that I ended up speaking with. Anyways, the inverter looks identical to a ton of other rebadged inverters, and it's driving me nuts trying figure out who actually makes these inverters. Personally, I didn't feel it was worth $7K, especially since Sol-Ark exists. Which raises another question, who actually makes Sol-Ark? If you know the answer, please put me out of my misery. Additionally, I would love for people to add to the list!


"Fortress Power"

• Fortress Power
• GSL
• Deye
• Huaya
• EG4
• Luxpower

"Sol-Ark"

• Sol-Ark
• Deye

Edit 1: Added Luxpower
Edit 2: Where does MPP solar fit into this picture?

 

[serene_badlands]

My suspicion is that the cheapest version of the inverter will be the manufacturer, right?

 

[serene_badlands]

@jrcromer Do you have any insight on this? I love the webinars I've watched on Fortress Power, and I'm excited to see that you've moved on to Sol-Ark!

 

[1201]

I recently installed a Fortress Power Envy 12K inverter. I ended up having to call three layers of support, and was surprised that it was actually a Chinese company that I ended up speaking with. Anyways, the inverter looks identical to a ton of other rebadged inverters, and it's driving me nuts trying figure out who actually makes these inverters. Personally, I didn't feel it was worth $7K, especially since Sol-Ark exists. Which raises another question, who actually makes Sol-Ark? If you know the answer, please put me out of my misery. Additionally, I would love for people to add to the list!


"Fortress Power"

• Fortress Power
• GSL
• Deye
• Huaya
• EG4
• Luxpower

"Sol-Ark"

• Sol-Ark
• Deye

Edit 1: Added Luxpower
Edit 2: Where does MPP solar fit into this picture?

What problems were you having?

 

[EastTexCowboy]

I recently installed a Fortress Power Envy 12K inverter. I ended up having to call three layers of support, and was surprised that it was actually a Chinese company that I ended up speaking with. Anyways, the inverter looks identical to a ton of other rebadged inverters, and it's driving me nuts trying figure out who actually makes these inverters. Personally, I didn't feel it was worth $7K, especially since Sol-Ark exists. Which raises another question, who actually makes Sol-Ark? If you know the answer, please put me out of my misery. Additionally, I would love for people to add to the list!


"Fortress Power"

• Fortress Power
• GSL
• Deye
• Huaya
• EG4
• Luxpower

"Sol-Ark"

• Sol-Ark
• Deye

Edit 1: Added Luxpower
Edit 2: Where does MPP solar fit into this picture?

At least some of the MPP inverters are Voltronic relabeled. There are several flavors of the 6548 including EG4, MPP, Sunpower Gold, and a few others I don't recall. At least some of them are slightly different based on what they spec out to the manufacturer, but pretty much the same.

 

[Steve_S]

This is a tricky thing. There are really big OEM's in China that build these on spec for their clients. Voltronic for example makes several "labels" for companies. The companies can come in and order a "preconfigured" generic model and rebadge it or they can have Voltronic modify to suit a vendors/Reseller specifications and that can include hardware & software. For example, SNRE makes the Midnite Solar DIY Series of equipment which are produced to Midnite's Specifications and then sent through the very costly certifications for UL,CSA,ETL etc. Hint EG4 = Rebadged product, just like MPP, Many residential Growatts (they produce high-end commercial, low-end residential is outsourced) and more...

Other Companies to ponder (OEMS)
Voltronic, https://voltronicpower.com/
SNRE, https://www.srnesolar.com/
Sigineer, https://www.sigineer.com/
Yiyen, https://www.yiyen.com/

BTW: Casing/Boxes used.... something to note.
Much like the old PC Clone days, many companies use a standardized "basic" set of cases/boxes for their assorted devices. These are pretty generic and therefore look pretty similar. You will see that when you look at links provided above. There is probably only a couple of companies in China that all they do is stamp out these cases en-masse... Remember those old (1980s-1990s) flip top PC Clone cases - 1 company stamped those out and everyone used them with different "facias". Same sort of thing.

 

[serene_badlands]

What problems were you having?

I kept getting an "AFCI High" alert, which refers to an arc in the PV strings. However, the alert was tripping in the middle of the night...when the sun was down. I believe the issue had something to do with the battery cutting out at 20% DOD. I never got a clear answer, and the issue has seemingly resolved itself, which is concerning to say the least.

 

[serene_badlands]

BTW: Casing/Boxes used.... something to note.
Much like the old PC Clone days, many companies use a standardized "basic" set of cases/boxes for their assorted devices. These are pretty generic and therefore look pretty similar. You will see that when you look at links provided above. There is probably only a couple of companies in China that all they do is stamp out these cases en-masse... Remember those old (1980s-1990s) flip top PC Clone cases - 1 company stamped those out and everyone used them with different "facias". Same sort of thing.

That seems obvious now that you say it. I'm not implying that hardware is the same as the other inverters, however I did get the impression the software was being outsourced. Generally speaking, it feels as though you're more likely to run into software issues than hardware issues with these products.

 

[timselectric]

who actually makes Sol-Ark?

Deye is the manufacturer of Sol-Ark.

 

[serene_badlands]

This is a tricky thing. There are really big OEM's in China that build these on spec for their clients. Voltronic for example makes several "labels" for companies. The companies can come in and order a "preconfigured" generic model and rebadge it or they can have Voltronic modify to suit a vendors/Reseller specifications and that can include hardware & software. For example, SNRE makes the Midnite Solar DIY Series of equipment which are produced to Midnite's Specifications and then sent through the very costly certifications for UL,CSA,ETL etc. Hint EG4 = Rebadged product, just like MPP, Many residential Growatts (they produce high-end commercial, low-end residential is outsourced) and more...

I really appreciate this answer. Since these are built to spec, would it accurate to say that you can't truly draw conclusions in regard to reliability, even if they are produced by the same manufacturer?

 

[Steve_S]

All of the OEMs have "standard offerings" for VARS (Value Added Resellers) can have rebadged for them when buying bulk. Other VARs can spec certain modifications to both hardware / software or to be compliant for certain standards etc.

 

[Mattb4]

I really appreciate this answer. Since these are built to spec, would it accurate to say that you can't truly draw conclusions in regard to reliability, even if they are produced by the same manufacturer?

It is even worse about drawing conclusions since the OEM (Voltronic) can and does change internal components for the same models. This can be based on availability and sometimes price of the component. Regardless of the specs of the company marketing them.

Reliability often can only be known after consumers have in in their hands for awhile and reviews become common.

 

[EastTexCowboy]

I really appreciate this answer. Since these are built to spec, would it accurate to say that you can't truly draw conclusions in regard to reliability, even if they are produced by the same manufacturer?

My opinion only, but I think the best way to assess any inverters or most any other solar component is to look at reviews, watch videos, and maybe most of all use this forum to read or interact with people who have experience with any particular device. As I've said before, DIY solar is still quite a bit in the Wild West phase. There's a significant amount of risk but there's also significant potential reward.

 

[serene_badlands]

My opinion only, but I think the best way to assess any inverters or most any other solar component is to look at reviews, watch videos, and maybe most of all use this forum to read or interact with people who have experience with any particular device. As I've said before, DIY solar is still quite a bit in the Wild West phase. There's a significant amount of risk but there's also significant potential reward.

Is sticking to UL listed equipment the best way to mitigate that risk?

 

[Steve_S]

Is sticking to UL listed equipment the best way to mitigate that risk?

Having devices with UL etc certifications does help in the sense that minimum standards & requirements are met for safety. That has little to do with quality or longterm reliability. It could last 1 month, 1 year (or to end of warranty) or 15 years. Then of course there is Tier-1 equipment like Schneider, Victron and so many more that come with a premium price tag but you get exactly what you pay for with big corporates behind their products. Also a lurking thing here, is that the higher quality products are also more efficient, take a Victron Quattro which is 96% Efficient and has a very low idle consumption versus an equivalent 2nd or 3rd tier product that has a much higher idle consumption and only 87% efficient. The numbers may not be huge but cummulatively it adds up fast.

 

[jrcromer]

It's easy to be cynical about the role of the US in global manufacturing. The #1 thing you can do to change this is to write your representatives and ask that the domestic manufacturing tax credit rider is added to the residential tax credit, not just the commercial one.

It's also frustrating to see informed viewers attribute Sol-Ark developments as Deye - it simply is the other way around. Sol-Ark is the pioneer of whole home backup hybrid inverters. If you want to play into the hands of copycat culture, go with one of our imitators. If you want systems that hum and buzz and drive you nuts, leave it to the China OEMs who have very little understanding of the US market and typically have "supply chain managers" as their figureheads.

One way to figure out where your money goes is to look at the relative size of the companies and what they do (info is readily available on LinkedIn). If you want, drill down further into how many of those are in technical roles vs. sales and marketing.

Sol-Ark just moved into a 500 person office in Allen, TX. That's commitment to the USA. I remember feeling fortunate if the battery inverter manufacturer had one USA-based person picking up the phone!

 

[1201]

It's easy to be cynical about the role of the US in global manufacturing. The #1 thing you can do to change this is to write your representatives and ask that the domestic manufacturing tax credit rider is added to the residential tax credit, not just the commercial one.

It's also frustrating to see informed viewers attribute Sol-Ark developments as Deye - it simply is the other way around. Sol-Ark is the pioneer of whole home backup hybrid inverters. If you want to play into the hands of copycat culture, go with one of our competitors. If you want systems that hum and buzz and drive you nuts, leave it to the China OEMs who have very little understanding of the US market and typically have "supply chain managers" as their figureheads.

One way to figure out where your money goes is to look at the relative size of the companies and what they do (info is readily available on LinkedIn). If you want, drill down further into how many of those are in technical roles vs. sales and marketing.

Sol-Ark just moved into a 500 person office in Allen, TX. That's commitment to the USA. I remember feeling fortunate if the battery inverter manufacturer had one USA-based person picking up the phone!

I guess you are want us to infer that solark has 500 employees?

 

[jrcromer]

No, if we had 500 employees, we would be looking at a 1000+ person office. The intent in my post was to inform that Sol-Ark is locked into position for growth to a 500 person office, as we have outgrown our 100 person office moved into 2 years ago. It's disruptive to move around every 2 years. Having followed Sol-Ark since the beginning (and recently joined as an employee), I think its impressive growth. I'm fortunate enough to work remote, but it brought a tear to my eye to see so many Sol-Ark engineers + technicians being trained as a group when I visited the campus. Sol-Ark offers tours and onsite training if you ever want to see for yourself, btw.

 

[1201]

No, if we had 500 employees, we would be looking at a 1000+ person office. I want you to inform that Sol-Ark is locked into position for growth to a 500 person office, as we have outgrown our 100 person office moved into 2 years ago. It's disruptive to move around every 2 years. Having followed Sol-Ark since the beginning (and recently joined as an employee), I think its impressive growth. I'm fortunate enough to work remote, but it brought a tear to my eye to see so many Sol-Ark engineers + technicians being trained as a group when I visited the campus. Sol-Ark offers tours and onsite training if you ever want to see for yourself, btw.

How many employees does solark have? Cos the internets is saying 28

 

[jrcromer]

As we have outgrown our 100 person office, obviously over 100.