Truck Fire Caused by Wrapped Cells?? Hmm..

Just had a viewer email me this article:


And they blame the fire on this:

My security cameras recorded the entire fire incident. Watching the security footage, the battery compartment exploded at 4:20am. Ten seconds later you can hear the smoke detector going off in the camper. That indicates that there was no fire in the camper that could have caused the battery to explode.

I later spoke with a few battery companies. They all said lithium phosphate does not explode like that, but lithium ion does. I was also told that there have been rumors of an overseas company rewrapping lithium-ion batteries and selling them as lithium phosphate. While I have no absolute proof due to the level of devastation, I believe that’s what happened.

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I do not buy that excuse for a second. And any battery that was using a cobalt based chemistry would have a totally different voltage range and would run at too low of a voltage to have any usable capacity (assuming 3S configuration).

I really would love to find out who in the "battery industry" told him that. I open batteries every day and I have never seen that before. Seems like a ridiculous excuse in my honest opinion.

Has anyone here heard of or seen cells wrapped as LiFePO4? The voltage alone would be a dead giveaway. And what caused the cells to combust? There really is no actual explanation here.

This post indicates that its probable a lithium ion battery was sold as a LiFePO4 labeled battery.


Mike

mikefitz said:

This post indicates that its probable a lithium ion battery was sold as a LiFePO4 labeled battery.

Battery charging 1% less with every recharge.

Hi i have a 3KW Must Hybrid Inverter and a 2.6Kw sunX Life Po4 Lithium Battery. in South Africa we have Loadshedding and this setup is here to keep the lights on while there's loadshedding and the battery recharge once the power is back. My problem now is that every time the battery recharge it...

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Mike

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Yes but I have not seen one of those. Have you?

Can tell by the voltage alone if it is or not.

if he was mooching, could it have been induced by over charging, or some issue that drove them to a significant over volt.. ? such as mistaking a 220v slatted for 110v 20 amp something like that. thats a heck of a fire.. but someone should know what type of batteries were installed for sure. I dont buy it for a second either.. most accidents are cause by human error.. whether its in the design, use or execution.. systems that are functioning properly usually dont pop like that.. I have witnessed a large scale cobalt ion based fire.. even then, it did not engulf, it burned precisely everything around it.. something else caught fire and chained it.. imo.. but what do I know..

Too bad we don't have the security camera video, or the battery brand.

I would not be very surprised if they were lithium-ion sold as LFP

Check this out, no BMS LOL

Will Prowse said:

And any battery that was using a cobalt based chemistry would have a totally different voltage range and would run at too low of a voltage to have any usable capacity (assuming 3S configuration).

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Could be 4s, and they just charge to 3.65 per cell like LFP, maybe even used a LFP BMS. They could have even put larger capacity cells to make up for the lack of a full charge? Even so, many users just want to toss a battery in, and go, so they may not even notice a lack of capacity.

Just thinking about possibilities.

BradCagle said:

Could be 4s, and they just charge to 3.65 per cell like LFP, maybe even used a LFP BMS.

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I am not sure I understand your explanation? With Cobalt chemistry 3 x 4.1 = 12.3. with LFP 4 x 3.65 = 14.6.
I agree with Will that the voltage would be a dead give away..

Ampster said:

I am not sure I understand your explanation? With Cobalt chemistry 3 x 4.1 = 12.3. with LFP 4 x 3.65 = 14.6.
I agree with Will that the voltage would be a dead give away..

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So if you're being underhanded, you don't think it's possible to take that one step further, and do 4s colbalt cells, with a LFP BMS?

They would charge to 3.65v just like LFP, but would have about half the capacity of the normal cobalt base cell, they could make up for that by using higher capacity cobalt cells, they'll fit because of the higher density, and well there's typically a lot of extra space in the battery enclosure.

BradCagle said:

So if you're being underhanded, you don't think it's possible to take that one step further, and do 4s colbalt cells, with a LFP BMS?

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Yes it is possible but I am not sure that the economics would make sense because typically LFP is less expensive per kWh than Cobalt based cells. I still agree with Will and have not seen any examples. That was the point, not whether it was possible

Ampster said:

Yes it is possible but I am not sure that the economics would make sense because typically LFP is less expensive per kWh than Cobalt based cells. I still agree with Will and have not seen any examples. That was the point, not whether it was possible

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If you got a great deal on used, or rejected cells the economics would make sense. If we're talking shady practices anything goes.

I'm just putting out possibilities, i have not seen this, but it is possible.

Or we have yet another situation that raises the question of whether LFP vent gases in an unventilated compartment can reach explosive levels and encounter an ignition source. What is electrolyte anyway, ether? If it was described as a fire in his starting fluid storage compartment I don't think anyone would consider that a mystery.