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Adding additional kw without a permit

Micmuse

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Sep 25, 2020
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Hi. I live in the SF bay Area and I have a dilemna. I installed a 2500 watt grid tie system on my house in 2005 and it has worked flawlessly. I got a Chevy Bolt and now I'm paying for electricity again. I'd like to add another 2500+ watts to cover it but I can't get a permit because in the last 15 years I've added several non-permitted (but up to code) improvements to the house. It would be too big a risk at inspection time! If I just upgrade to 5kw or more will the electric company bust me for the extra grid feeding?
I'm thinking maybe just add panels and upgrade the inverter (probably to a SMA 6000 watt) then turn off the additional panels when I'm not charging the ev or running heaters etc. I probably couldn't claim the 26% tax credit -or could I? Any warnings and other ideas would be appreciated. Thanks.
 
The utility rules probably say you can add 1 kW of inverter.
If you add more panels facing a different angle, you'll get more kWh/day without as big an increase in peak kW.

Was there a "permission to connect" notice from utility after inspection? What does it say?
There was a size allowed without even demonstrating history of usage to justify it. Probably 5 kW is under that limit.

You should be eligible for the credit.
 
You should try to stay within the 1kW extra allowed for export.
Have you thought about a hybrid inverter and some storage? I AC coupled my existing GT inverter and added another 3kW of panels but restricted the output of the entire system to be in compliance with my NEM agreement (including the 1 kW increase)
I now self consume more of my production but have enough production left over to charge my cars from either solar or the stored value by banking solar at peak rate and drawing it down at off peak rates. I have big differentials in rates and that strategy works for me.
 
What is your rate plan? Were you forced on a new one recently? Did you select one suitable for the electric car?
Peak use rates are 4:00 to 9:00 PM, part-peak 3:00 to 4:00 and 9:00 to Midnight.
As Ampster says, you can store any power not produced during peak time to feed the grid then for highest credits.
That lets you draw 3 times as much off-peak.

Usually we would upgrade an older inverter with a less-old model, but the newer Sunny Boy use Ethernet to talk with Sunny Boy Storage, allowing it to peak-shave and shift consumption and grid-feed times. Separate Automatic Backup Unit is a transfer switch if you also want backup when the grid is down.

If you had 3.5 kW (AC) of PV, single fixed panel orientation, 5.5 hours gives 19 kWh of production per day. With multiple fixed angles of panels, you can get about 1.5 times the kWh and the same peak kW. (Not that PG&E is actually looking closely, but with smart meters they could if they wanted.)
Two or three 10 kWh LG batteries or BatteryBox on Sunny Boy Storage could be used to shift all your production to peak.






(looks like some LG batteries are shown with "**" in SMA's list, and a note on limitations)

These add up to quite a lot of money. Maybe one of the hybrid inverters Ampster mentioned with a less expensive battery.

That BYD battery is $750/kWh and has 10 year warranty. Don't know actual lifespan. cycled daily for 10 years, cost is $0.21/kWh.
Spread between $0.45 peak rate and $0.15 off-peak is $0.30/kWh. Add cost of inverter and you don't save any money.
So the question is, what's the most economical battery, and what inverter can you use with it?

You can probably get away with adding basic grid-tie PV, and utility won't pay attention.
With newer panels around 20% efficient, replacing current panels with new or newer used ones would boost output by 50% without adding mounts. Some inverters have "secure power" feature to provide AC power during blackouts without batteries.
 
Thanks guys for the good ideas and I checked out the links. I'm hoping to do this on the cheap and avoid a more expensive inverter and batteries. My airbnb business is the shits since the pandemic and I'd rather not go into the hole for this. It becomes a little more affordable if I get the tax credit. Hedges, you say I should be eligible. I know I had to have a signed off permit in 2005 but that was a CA rebate not a tax credit. I guess it all works regardless as long as I don't get audited.

In my paperwork from then I found the system was rated at, and the rebate based upon 2352 watts. From what you both say it looks like I wouldn't want to feed in more that 3350 odd. Am I understanding right that the new Sunny Boys can control the max that will feed into the grid and I'll also be able to determine when? I didn't see that in their blurb. Oh, rereading that I see it's Sunny Boy Storage not the standard grid tie you are talking about. It would be great to have that capability though so I could feed in the 3350 max most days of the year with 5000 watts of panels. Do you know of any inexpensive inverter that has that ability? I don't care much about backup power since outages are rare but I do like the "secure power" feature on the Sunny Boys.

Maybe it would be more worth to get a new 3500 ish inverter for grid tie and use my existing Sunny Boy independently for charging the ev. I might not be able to use the 240 volt charger then. I couldn't charge at all at night without plugging into the grid. Although since I'm sort of retired I could probably manage with that most of the time. Maybe I could switch the existing panels so that they could go to either inverter as needed. They could be part of the grid feed in winter and connected to the old inverter when charging the ev or running electric heaters. Does that sound feasable? As you have no doubt guessed I'm not much of a tech guy but I do know house wiring and construction.

My rate plan is called E6. Peak is 1pm to 7pm M-F May to Oct and 5pm to 8pm Nov to Apr. Part Peak is 10am to 1pm and 7pm to 9pm M-F May to Oct. Our peak cost is .40 / kwh, mid peak .29, off peak .21. So it's expensive but less than double for peak. I don't have a good option for panels facing other than straight south or north. I could probably fit 3 panels facing west on a separate string but that roof is shaded all morning. I do have another south facing roof that will fit up to (7) 60 cell panels. So I could send that new wattage to the grid tie inverter on one string and a few of the old 190 watt panels as well on another. The rest of the old panels could go to my old Sunny Boy. Panels are cheap nowdays so I could replace some of those if needed.

Is it possible to grid tie two inverters simultaneously and change as I like with a switch?
I appreciate the advice. Thanks much.
 
Not a question of getting audited. Don't mess with the IRS - don't do anything that isn't legit. Read what is required to get the credit, and save records of purchases. If stuff is purchased for use on your residence, I think that qualifies for the 26%. (Solar heating of pool does not.) Bigger problem would be if you don't have enough income this year to use the credit. Unlike for CEC rebates, permits don't appear to be part of the documentation.

If your plan is still peak 1 to 7 PM, then panels facing West earn you a premium credit so worth doing.

Rather than looking at your rebate form, did you get a form from PG&E, maybe a card left attached to the meter? "Permission to Connect". See what figures are on it. And like I said, they may not even pay attention if your export doubles. It's all small potatoes.

Sunny Boys won't charge EV without grid (except by Secure Power). I don't know if that wakes up on its own each morning or if you have to kick it.
If you put a grid-tie sunny boy behind a switch, one a 230V circuit charging the car, Sunny Boy would only operate when switch was turned on. If car was charging, no export because car takes more than it produces. There are also "zero export" configurations - I think Sunny Boy Storage and Power Wall may off that, but batteries are expensive. Don't think Sunny Boy by itself can do it. I think Enphase can.

Probably replacing all your older panels would boost output 50% (given a bigger sunny boy.)
Check out the operating voltage range of the new 5kW Sunny Boy (has 3 MPPT inputs). If the 3 panels on West face produce enough, that will kick in late in the day Can you fit more with some hanging over the edge as an awning?. If all strings are same length they can parallel on a single MPPT, but if different lengths need separate MPPT.

State did audit me around 2013, over finally using up some credits that had carried over for 10 years. I thought 4 years after return accepted, the figures on it were good. But they treated credits like basis of a property - have to prove it the year you sell (or use credit.) I pulled returns for 10 years covering AMT tax and had receipts for 3 rounds of rebates. I documented $50k to within 1 dollar and they left me alone after that. (thermal printer paper fades away so make photocopies.)
 
Most likely, your old inverter is grid tie only. If it is not connected to an AC power source, it won't be able to make any power. This is a safety function required on grid tie inverters to shut down if there is a problem with the grid, so you don't back feed power when someone might be working on the lines.

Having East and West panels is a kind of cool idea also. Get more power in the morning, the same mid day power, and then more in the evening again. For it to work though, you do need good sun at the morning and evening limits. I see a few of the homes around me that have their roof turned from mine using panels on the East and West sides, but they did it as an only option. It would be interesting to see their solar output across a whole day. A few on here are doing this by running parallel strings and don't even need to upgrade the inverter as the max power is no higher, but it lasts much longer.

What size are your old 190 watt panels? Could you just swap them out for modern 300 watt panels, and then upgrade the inverter. If they come and scream at you for exporting too much power, just say, the system needed service, so you "improved it". If you charge your electric car while the sun is shining, you won't export any more power, it will all go into the car's battery. Depending on what electric car you have, you may be able to (in a year or two) use the car's battery as a home storage battery. This can be done now if you have a Nissan Leaf, but the inverter to work with it is very expensive.


And it look like Tesla may be starting to do this as well.


My NEM agreement had both a max power export cap and a maximum KWH per month cap. But I am not even close to those limits as it is basically what my system could produce in perfect sun if I have no load on in my house at all. I have 16 x 300 watt panels, but each panel is on a 240 watt Enphase iQ7 micor inverter, so the top power I can make is 16 amps, 3850 watts. I have seen the system clip to that on very sunny but cool days in late fall and early spring. Most of the time, I peak out around 3,500 watts. My monthly export to the grid was topping out at about 10-15 KWH per day, for a monthly total of under 465 KWH's, and I am allowed to export up to 900 KWH's. I was using the rest of that power in my house, so the meter never sees it.

I have recently added a home storage battery, so I am hardly exporting anything now. Maybe 3-5 KWH's in a whole week. My system is not perfect yet and does not auto switch nicely from charging the battery to powering my house. There are other systems like a Tesla Powerwall2 or the Outback Skybox which seem to do a much better job on the time shifting. Swapping out your existing inverter for a Skybox might be a very cost effective update. Maybe a Sol-Ark as well, since you have a string inverter system, that could work very well. I am using a Schneider XW-Pro AC coupled to my Enphase inverters. It makes for a great backup power system, but the power time shifting is causing me headaches. If I had the solar panels DC charging the batteries with a Schneider charge controller, it would work better, but I think I have a decent work around, just my programming skills are a little rusty.

As for the federal tax rebate, I asked my accountant what I needed, and he said just send in the invoice for the solar system install. I got that last year, so I got the full 30%. I will also ask if he can submit the XW inverter for this year. It would be nice to get 26% back on $3,000 inverter. I spent another $3,000+ on the batteries and other hardware and wiring components, but that would be hard to show as part of the inverter system.
 
Do you know of any inexpensive inverter that has that ability?
Responding to just that comment you could add Enphase inverters plus an Envoy and put them on different circuits. The ones on the Envoy circuit could be programmed to Non Export and the others could export up to their capacity.
Earlier I had suggested a more expensive solution involving a hybrid inverter like I have and programming it to limit export to a specific amount. I have an Outback Skybox but also have Enphase inverters AC coupled to the Skybox. I believe in getting building permits but understand your dilemma. I also believe in gaming the system legally and within the contractual restraints of a NEM agreement and the Permission to Operate. I would be happy to articulate further.
 
Further optimized would be if the Envoy could monitor power in/out at the meter, and keep it no higher than 3350 W.
(instead of keeping car charging branch circuit at zero.)

I always say a hardware solution costs less to build, install, repair than does software.
While you're trying to hack the Envoy code, I'll just put a variac in series with the current transformer plus resistor that monitors current to grid.
That introduces an offset so current equal to 3350W produces zero volts. Existing Envoy software will then try to achieve that setpoint.
 
Further optimized would be if the Envoy could monitor power in/out at the meter, and keep it no higher than 3350 W.
(instead of keeping car charging branch circuit at zero.)
I think it would be possible to place the Envoy CTs to manage that to zero but their algorithm is simple . It would take software like in my Skybox and other expensive hybrid inverters to manage a specific quantity of export. As you inferred, software solutions are not free.
 
Ideally, charging of car would vary to capture surplus generation before it exceeds export limit, so PV production isn't curtailed.
Having car charger seek to regulate export to 3300W (just short of where Envoy should curtail production) would be the goal.

It appears both AC level 2 and DC charging provide variable rates:

"AC Level 2: Utilizes 240vAC residential or 208vAC commercial power to supply between 12-80Amps (2.5-19.2kW)."
"DC Level 1: Supplies a maximum of 80kW at 50-1000vDC."

Need a way to tell charger what to deliver. I would guess for DC this might be communicated using voltage, while for AC needs to be digital data.

There is still the point of what utility's "permission to connect" says. CEC rebate was based on actual installation (panels added up to slightly less than inverter capacity), and reservation was based on what was requested and some cap possibly based on historical usage. But utility may have granted permission for more. There was an amount where no justification based on prior usage was required, based on typical homes. So maybe 5 kW is within what was originally allowed.
 
I don't understand your last post Hedges. Level I as I understand it for the Bolt is either 8 or 12 amps of output from the little charger that came with the car plugged into a 110v AC outlet. Or did you mean level 3? I won't need that at home. I imagine level 1 would work fine on the SunnyBoy "secure power" outlet. Do you know if that operates all the time or only with a power outage?

Unfortunately I never found a "permission to connect" statement in my documents. I wonder if it's a good idea (or not) to just call PG&E solar hotline and ask where the limits are. What may be the downside of asking? If they are ok with me just upgrading panels etc and exporting up to 5000 watts then my problem is solved. In that case I would just send it all to the grid and charge off peak.

Ampster, I'm thinking the Enphase / Envoy wouldn't be good for me. Sounds like potential software issues that I will know nothing about and computers are already a pain in the ass to me (my back actually). I'm sitting at mine too much these days. That route may cost more as well. If I did that though I would want to export some more power besides what the old Sunny Boy puts out. Can you program the enphase inverters to put out only a certain amount or better yet to limit the amt at certain times of the day?

To answer the GMXnow questions, I have (14) 190 watt panels (15 years old) that are 52" x 35". If I replaced them all on the same rails with the 320 watt panels I'm planning to buy, I would get 3520 watts but I'd be extending above the roof ridge. 72 cell are not goin to fit at all. I like the idea of putting panels on the west side to get more peak (1-7pm) export time as Hedges suggested. My wife doesn't like this idea but I measured and I could fit (4) of the 320 watt panels on the front of our house (west facing) for roughly1200 watts in the afternoon when the existing array is waning.

.
 
It is certainly worth calling your utility and asking a "what if". Have them bring up your account and say you are thinking of upgrading your aging solar power system. Ask them what are your existing net energy connection limits? They may say you are grandfathered into something and any change might move you into a less favorable NEM 2.0 like I am stuck with. So ask what that change would be as well. They should be able to give you the details and it should not throw up any red flag for them to watch you. You can also ask about getting an EV or home battery and see what they say. So Cal Edison was very quick to offer me the ToU Prime D rate if I had a plug in car. It makes the overnight rate $0.17 per KWH. Since you already have the Chevy Bolt, you may be able to get a better rate without changing anything.

My panels are pretty standard 60 cell 300 watt units, just 14 months old now. They are 67 x 40 inches. The extra 5 inches wide might lose a panel or two, and they are 15 inches taller. This year SilFab (my brand) lists this size up to 330 watts per panel. I think other brands may even go to 345 or so. I see that may be a tough fit for you though. Your current panels were rated at 190 watts when new, and took up 1,820 sq inches. 9.58 sq in per watt. The 330 watt modern panels are 2680 sq inches. 8.12 sq inches per watt. I actually expected a bigger difference. So using the same roof area would be just under 18% more power. If they are in 1 or 2 rows, it looks like you could only fit 12 panels in the same width. 12 x 330 = 3,960 watts. Not a bad increase if the height will fit. Now your panels are also 15 years old. The warranty on my SilFab panels claims they will still produce at least 91.6% at 12 years, and 85.1% at 25 years. I'll call it about 0.6% loss per year. So your current panels may be at about 90% give or take. So they could be more like 170 watt panels now. Does your inverter give you a solar production graph? If you have decent sun on your panels, at this time of year in the Bay Area you, you should be producing about 10 KWH's a day, when you are not fogged in. If you are doing better than that, your panels are holding up well. My 16 x 300 watt panels made 22 KWH's today, but I am a bit further south as well. Assuming the voltage is still safe, you may be able to over panel your existing inverter and just have it clip a bit in the middle of the day and get more power for more of the day. I have Enphase micro inverters, but the idea is the same. My panels could hit 300 watts, but each inverter can only handle 240 watts. Most of the time that are under that 240 watts, so I get all of the panel's power, but for a few days, when it is very sunny, but cool, I have seem my array clip at the 240 watt cap, for a total of 3,840 watts total out of the 16 inverters. The normal "bell" curve power graph just goes flat at the top for up to 3 hours in those rare days. If the inverters were larger, they could have made a little more power those days, but that is rare, and it still has the benefit of making more total power for the day, without going over my 16 amp limit of power I can push back into my panel (80% of the 20 amp 240 volt back feed breaker). What is your current inverter? Do your existing panels have any shade on them for some of the day? I do have some shade issues, which is a big reason I want with the separate micro inverter on each panel. If you do get fog often, you can likely add quite a bit of panel without exceeding the original system rated power.

If you don't have a storage battery, the only way to limit power export, would be to just throw away the extra power. There are inverters that can do it, but it is literally a waste unless you have to do that for legal reasons. Hawaii for one has a "no export" clause for new solar installs.
 
I "breezed" through the thread and did not see it mentioned.

Considering that you have an EV you want to charge, have en existing grid-tied system and potential issues with all of it (danged legislators eh).
Have you consider Solar Car Port or Solar Awning directly connected to a battery bank & EV-Charger sub-system but not connected to the Grid-Tied system ? There is no reason it could not be independent of the grid-tie side and therefore none of the hooey related to it should apply, I would think. Never know though, as it seems rules & regs are really all over the place in the US and some places are downright "hostile" with regards to home solar. Max Charge Capacity for a Chevy Bolt seems to be Single Phase 32A / 7.4kW.

From https://evbox.com/en/electric-cars/chevrolet/chevrolet-bolt
Capture.JPG
 
I don't understand your last post Hedges. Level I as I understand it for the Bolt is either 8 or 12 amps of output from the little charger that came with the car plugged into a 110v AC outlet. Or did you mean level 3? I won't need that at home. I imagine level 1 would work fine on the SunnyBoy "secure power" outlet. Do you know if that operates all the time or only with a power outage?

Unfortunately I never found a "permission to connect" statement in my documents. I wonder if it's a good idea (or not) to just call PG&E solar hotline and ask where the limits are. What may be the downside of asking? If they are ok with me just upgrading panels etc and exporting up to 5000 watts then my problem is solved. In that case I would just send it all to the grid and charge off peak.

Ampster, I'm thinking the Enphase / Envoy wouldn't be good for me. Sounds like potential software issues that I will know nothing about and computers are already a pain in the ass to me (my back actually). I'm sitting at mine too much these days. That route may cost more as well. If I did that though I would want to export some more power besides what the old Sunny Boy puts out. Can you program the enphase inverters to put out only a certain amount or better yet to limit the amt at certain times of the day?

To answer the GMXnow questions, I have (14) 190 watt panels (15 years old) that are 52" x 35". If I replaced them all on the same rails with the 320 watt panels I'm planning to buy, I would get 3520 watts but I'd be extending above the roof ridge. 72 cell are not goin to fit at all. I like the idea of putting panels on the west side to get more peak (1-7pm) export time as Hedges suggested. My wife doesn't like this idea but I measured and I could fit (4) of the 320 watt panels on the front of our house (west facing) for roughly1200 watts in the afternoon when the existing array is waning.

.

Chevy Bolt has level 2 charging, also DC. Those apparently use negotiation to determine charging current acceptable to both car and charger.
Your ideal configuration is a 6 kW Sunny Boy, but with the car sucking down variable kW to limit what is exported to grid to max 3500W. I'm sure the charger is programmable to work with whatever amperage circuit it was connected to, but don't know how readily the value could be tweeked on the fly.

Look up tariffs, etc. from when you got net metering. If you find something like, "you may only install PV up to the amount of consumption documented by utility bills, except a 5 kW system doesn't require documentation because typical homes need that much", then you should be able to put in that size, or perhaps that size plus 1 kW extra. How big a filing system do you think the utility has, anyway, for paperwork processed over a decade ago?

Simplest to just put in the extra kW, not try to program a car charger to shave peaks. Put the car on a timer to disconnect when peak or part-peak rates kick in, then reconnect for off-peak (or some appropriate time.) Objective would be to charge at max rate right up until higher rates kick in (1:00 PM with your present schedule), keeping export lower.

If you put in a modern inverter that implements rule 21 (which you're not required to do as replacement for an existing installation), you'll be doing the grid a favor by promoting its stability rather than having your production fall off a cliff and wait 5 minutes the moment it gets into trouble. And that will give you Secure Power to charge the car (level 1) or run the refrigerator during outages. it ONLY works during outages, when manually enabled. So you'd like an SPDT relay with 120V coil as an automatic transfer switch. If secure power outlet is on, charge from that. If not, charge from grid. Otherwise, move the plug when you enable secure power.

"fit (4) of the 320 watt panels on the front of our house (west facing)"

The Sunny Boy (new models) requires 125Vdc to start up, and 100V minimum MPPT. So four panels should be a good fit on their own MPPT input. 5 kW and large have three MPPT.
 
Ok, I'll call PG&E and see what they say for my case. Hopefully I can export a lot more to the grid and charge at night off peak. Regardless I'll replace some or all my old panels that are probably only producing 170 watts in perfect conditions. Fortunately I have no shade issues but the panels are mounted flat on the roof and thus only tilt about 15% towards the sun.

I looked into carport type off grid chargers but that format doesn't work for me since I live in an urban area where there's no room for such things. Also It means a 2nd inverter to buy and of course always charging during sunshine unless I buy expensive batteries.

I really think the simplest and most afforadable is to just buy a new Sunny Boy with the new panels incl additional west facing and then charge the EV during peak sunshine if the export limit is reached, which can be easily monitored and manually adjusted with the changing seasons. Probably if necessary one or two of the strings could be diverted to my old Sunny Boy 2500 for immediate use and set to not export (if that is possible).

I think the whole upgrade will cost well under 4000. I'll post what happens with PG&E.
 
Chevy Bolt has level 2 charging, also DC. Those apparently use negotiation to determine charging current acceptable to both car and charger.
I have had 2 Chevy Volt models and both charged very constant right up to the last 10 minutes of charge where there is ramps down of the power draw.

Many of the hybrid inverters you can set to charge a battery all day (with new panels) and then have the battery run loads all night and never back feed the grid. You can set the times that inverter runs off the batteries. You could also use it to offset peak rates and backup for that great California grid. This is a lot like a super flexible generator/backup system.
 
PG&E says that I can export up to 110% of the original rated capacity or a maximum of 1000 watts over. That sounded pretty definite. I can also apply for a modification to the system and when that is reviewed "their team" will tell me whether or not I'll need a permit. The person I talked to says that I would likely need a permit if I add more panels rather than just exchange old for new and replace the inverter. I'm going to apply with that in mind. If I add the 4 panels facing west that would have to be after the upgrade is approved and I presumably have a higher rated capacity. I'm assuming, for now, that I would then be able to push the exports another kw beyond that new rated capacity (probably after a few months to establish a new normal).

I will update when I have something new to report. Thanks for all the input.
 
If exceeding +10% or +1kW, the rules probably say you have to switch to NEM 2.0, (which would otherwise happen at no cost after 20 years since first permission to operate, I think.)

Swapping panels may get you 150% in the same area. Rules for new permits would require 3' walkway on two sides and top, but your system predates that. Typically replacing equipment doesn't require a permit. Rewiring might. Your existing inverter likely puts out 11A 230V, and has 12 gauge wire and a 15A or 20A breaker. The 3.8 kW Sunny Boy is 15.8A max AC, so can still use 20A breaker.

Depending on your mounts, and considering that newer panels are taller than original, you may be able to add area as well. My SunPower panels are 62" long and AstroPower are 58". You may be able to select a much taller one.

Check out the voltage and current ratings of the panels you consider, and of each of the two MPPT inputs for the 3.8 kW Sunny Boy (which can probably be paralled for more current.) You might be able to plan out how to add a few more panels later.
 
Eventually PG&E told me no changes to the panels or inverter of my existing system without a permit. Why they wouldn't just tell me that up front before my proposal submission is a mystery. Since I can not get a permit at this house I am just going to swap some old 190 watt panels for new 320 watt. My existing 2500 Sunny Boy will clip some in summer but give me a lot more power in winter and on cloudy days. I'll charge my ev off peak at level 2.

At some point I will add some panels (without permit) and try to charge the car on sunny days off grid. It would only be level 1 but that would work for me since I am retired. Does any one know if its possible with micro inverters to use their power output without a charge controller and batteries? Would that harm the Bolt or its level1 charger?
Thanks
 
Does any one know if its possible with micro inverters to use their power output without a charge controller and batteries? Would that harm the Bolt or its level1 charger?
In an earlier post or two I suggested several Non Export solutions. Micros only output AC so batteries and charge controller are irrelevant. Micros can be an effective way to add solar generation incrementally. Eventually you will need an Envoy to limit some export if you are getting close to your limit. I have some ideas in that regard. It all depends on the data.
My challenge is not solving the No Export issue, the challenge is charging my EV during the day and finding a way to modulate the charging current to optimize solar and not use mid peak power. I am on an EV rate and have plenty of credit I can use up at super off peak rates but I just don't like paying NEM 2.0 Non Bypassable Charges. If I recall you are on NEM 1.0 but you are not on an EV rate plan and you may want to analyze that. Let me know if I can clarify the benefits of an EV rate because in summer you can store energy at three times the rate of charging an EV off peak. It my depend on how much you consume during peak rates versus how much you can store during mid peak and early peak in summer before the sun goes down. Ping me if you want to explore further. I am also retired and view this as a challenge to optimize my system. I am also in PG&E and have a few issues that I need to work out with my County building department before I sell this house.
 
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It sounds like your charging problem would be solved with the right level 2 charger, if it exists. Or maybe something that can disconnect your ev charger based on your grid feed. I can't help you with that but I imagine an electronics hobbyist could.

I am on the E6 rate plan which I think is best for me since I can export at a high peak rate and charge the ev completely off peak. I'm feeling a little nervous about adding equipment now that PGE has told me I can't. Just upgrading six existing panels and staying with the same inverter is enough for now. As I said before I'm trying to keep this simple and affordable.

For the ev I want to stay off grid when possible in the day and I want to avoid storage batteries. I mentioned micro inverters thinking maybe I can just send the 120 volt output straight to my level 1 charger which would draw either 8 or 12 amps according to my Bolt. If I add 4 x 320 = 1280 watts I could at least charge at 8 amps on sunny days. I suppose another way would be to wire the 4 panels in parallel and find an inverter that converts 48DC volts to 110AC. My worry is that in either case it may only work with full sun and at other times destroy the charger or hurt the EV.
 
maybe I can just send the 120 volt output straight to my level 1 charger which would draw either 8 or 12 amps according to my Bolt. If I add 4 x 320 = 1280 watts I could at least charge at 8 amps on sunny days. I suppose another way would be to wire the 4 panels in parallel and find an inverter that converts 48DC volts to 110AC. My worry is that in either case it may only work with full sun and at other times destroy the charger or hurt the EV.
Micros need to have a grid connection to sync to so they would have to be wired to a subpanel or service panel like your charger. Micros cost about $100 but you would need a $500 Envoy plus some current transformers to control the micros for Non Export. That is the most cost effective solution for a few panels.
It is complicated finding a standalone inverter which would run directly off solar panels and at the same time be able to run a charging station. My attempts at that kept having ground fault issues.
My EVA rate for super off peak charging is $0.15 per kWh and I charge two Teslas. I don't think the E-6 rate gets that low but you know your usage and the time periods better than I. Apparently you are grandfathered in E-6 like I am in EVA. I think the new EV rate and other TOU rates have slightly less favorable time periods and we only have until 2022 and then we roll into those less favorable time periods.
The main thing I watch to make sure I don't go over my NEM agreement is my maximum export in kW at any one time. That in my opinion is the the only way PG&E is going to be able to observe that you may have added a lot of panels. I am fortunate that I was able to add some additional panels facing west which do not add to my peak generation of my main NEM system, but do extend the time and thus give me more kWhrs later in the day which means more kWhrs stored on the grid. My hybrid inverter does give me data that I can use to tweak my system. You can see in my signature that I have added 3 kW to a 5.7kW system but because of orientation I have never gone over the 1 kWh max because the main system tapers off before the west facing panels start hitting their peak.
Do you have some loads you can shift. The more loads you can shift out of peak period puts more money in the bank from generation that you can use off peak. In summer I get $0.54 for every kWh I generate and I store that on the grid and use it up at a 3 to 1 or better rate at $0.15 per kWh. In other words Every kWh I bank at peak, I can use 3 kWhs at off peak with zero financial cost.
Take a look at these two EV rates and compare them to what you are paying now.
 
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Why would PG&E have any say with respect to permits. are you tied into the grid and making your meter run backward or selling your excess power back to them. I was once told by a PG&E repairman, that anything I do on my side of the meter, they have no say in it, at least if I'm not tied to them in any way.

I'm getting ready this spring to cut the PG&E power line on my side of the meter and main circuit breaker to tie in my solar system. I will not be affecting their side in any way. - I just will not be using any of their power, but only as a backup source.

Anyway, just curious!
 
I was once told by a PG&E repairman, that anything I do on my side of the meter, they have no say in it, at least if I'm not tied to them in any way.
I am of the same opinion, and I will stick to that opinion until the Joules come home from the pasture.:LOL:
I do believe in following the building code and using UL approved equipment when feasible.
 

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