Chargery BMS now with Low Temp Cutoff

[Solarfun4jim]

Sure, I suppose that could be done, hang a preloading battery like an AGM or something on Pos 2 with the main power bank on Pos 1 but "in-vehicle" the switch with AFD would be more prudent.

I was thinking more along the lines of, taking the power from the original bank(not a seperate battery) and simply wiring it in such a manner that it must pass through the resistor first thus restricting the inrush current when the switch was in position 1.

 

[Solarfun4jim]

Let me disagree here. The BMS is here to allow or forbid charge and/or discharge. You can do it the hard way with relays, this way you physically open the circuit and you are sure that no current can flow anymore. But you can also use the function of many inverters, chargers and SCC that have inputs to control whether they are allowed to charge or discharge the battery. Nearly all Victron equipments (inverter/chargers, MPPTs etc...) have that for instance. They have 2-wire inputs that are "on" when the contact between the two wires is closed and "off" when the contact is open. Using an optocoupler as in one of the latest videos from Will, you can use the Chargery outputs that are initally supposed to drive relays to control the inputs of the inverter/charger/SCC and forbid or allow charge. Then everything is about how much you trust your equipment and whether you would trust more a relay than direct control of the chargers/loads (both have weaknesses I would say).

Yes, this is how im planning my own, and why i had to divert from an 'all in one' unit to a seperate SCC & Inverter/charger. Makes it so much simpler and cost effective.

 

[Steve_S]

;-) I won't "forbid" a damned thing... lol.... ohh chinglish at work. As I said, it all does depend on the hardware you have. Victron may be able to accept a signal but not everything does... so we can pick nits or move on to productivity. Nits can go outside & freeze in the Metre of snowfall I have to go and shovel later.... snow.. a 4 letter word like other nasty 4 letter jobbies.

 

[Solarfun4jim]

Got word back from JasonWang, the 100mV shunt would not be ok....so at least that is clear.
Too bad about your snowfall Steve....i dont envy you that.

 

[Steve_S]

Got word back from JasonWang, the 100mV shunt would not be ok....so at least that is clear.
Too bad about your snowfall Steve....i dont envy you that.

As chargery docs say, MAX is a 75mv shunt. RTFM ! So many refuse to read docs or to take the time to understand them. @Justin Laureltec can tell you nightmares wit customers blaming everything on something and returning product with manuals & docs still sealed in the plastic...

Anyone want snow, I have tons and FREE just come and pick it up !

 

[tim0shel]

As chargery docs say, MAX is a 75mv shunt. RTFM ! So many refuse to read docs or to take the time to understand them. @Justin Laureltec can tell you nightmares wit customers blaming everything on something and returning product with manuals & docs still sealed in the plastic...

Anyone want snow, I have tons and FREE just come and pick it up !

You can keep the snow Steve!!!!!

 

[HMR]

NO not at all.... The BMS is the "agent" in between.

Great. That clarifies things immensely. Thanks for the diagram.

 

[Solarfun4jim]

As chargery docs say, MAX is a 75mv shunt. RTFM ! So many refuse to read docs or to take the time to understand them. @Justin Laureltec can tell you nightmares wit customers blaming everything on something and returning product with manuals & docs still sealed in the plastic...

Anyone want snow, I have tons and FREE just come and pick it up !

What is RTFM?
What the document states is
"Please use correct current shunt according to actual maximal charge and discharge current, singe shunt is
enough for BMS16T, 75mV or less shunt is suggested"
That does not specify a maximum in my english.

 

[Bob B]

Let me disagree here. The BMS is here to allow or forbid charge and/or discharge. You can do it the hard way with relays, this way you physically open the circuit and you are sure that no current can flow anymore. But you can also use the function of many inverters, chargers and SCC that have inputs to control whether they are allowed to charge or discharge the battery. Nearly all Victron equipments (inverter/chargers, MPPTs etc...) have that for instance. They have 2-wire inputs that are "on" when the contact between the two wires is closed and "off" when the contact is open. Using an optocoupler as in one of the latest videos from Will, you can use the Chargery outputs that are initally supposed to drive relays to control the inputs of the inverter/charger/SCC and forbid or allow charge. Then everything is about how much you trust your equipment and whether you would trust more a relay than direct control of the chargers/loads (both have weaknesses I would say).

That's what I am hoping to do as well. Try to avoid switching the main 12V with the BMS.

The Samlex inverter charger has the ability to remote shut off the charge and discharge independently .... and the output of the SCC can be fed thru the inverter charger so that the Samlex would be able to control everything.
The other thing I like about it is that it will also manage the AC side so that both the generator and grid AC can be connected to it.

I was considering using a dual input device for my RV and bring the Alternater voltage and SCC into it .... and then feed that thru the Samlex and have all the charge control be done by it.

Does anyone know if the Victron has independent remote shut off of charge and inverter?

 

[Solarfun4jim]

That's what I am hoping to do as well. Try to avoid switching the main 12V with the BMS.

The Samlex inverter charger has the ability to remote shut off the charge and discharge independently .... and the output of the SCC can be fed thru the inverter charger so that the Samlex would be able to control everything.
The other thing I like about it is that it will also manage the AC side so that both the generator and grid AC can be connected to it.

I was considering using a dual input device for my RV and bring the Alternater voltage and SCC into it .... and then feed that thru the Samlex and have all the charge control be done by it.

Does anyone know if the Victron has independent remote shut off of charge and inverter?

Im not cetain, but i think all the 'smart' versions have remote on/off
You can search product range here for your specific models and datasheets

Products - Victron Energy

Find an overview of all Victron Energy products. From Inverters, Solar Panels, Solar Charge Controllers to Car Transformers and System Monitoring.

www.victronenergy.com

If it is a 'combined' unit, then they might not be seperate functions....best check your model

 

[Steve_S]

What is RTFM?
What the document states is
"Please use correct current shunt according to actual maximal charge and discharge current, singe shunt is
enough for BMS16T, 75mV or less shunt is suggested"
That does not specify a maximum in my english.

the docs are in poor English translation.
RTFM = Read The Freakin Manual no aimed AT YOU just a general comment.

 

[astronom]

Im not cetain, but i think all the 'smart' versions have remote on/off
You can search product range here for your specific models and datasheets

Products - Victron Energy

Find an overview of all Victron Energy products. From Inverters, Solar Panels, Solar Charge Controllers to Car Transformers and System Monitoring.

www.victronenergy.com

If it is a 'combined' unit, then they might not be seperate functions....best check your model

Actually they do, you can find how to set them up like this (2 input control signals) here. EDIT: That's at least for the Multi and Quattro devices, you have to check for other product lines. Also beware, you need to buy a special connecter to connect to the inverter to be able to configure it properly with the Victron Configure software (not accessible via Victron Connect over Bluetooth for this setting).

I did this on my EasySolar, which includes a Multiplus (inverter/charger) and an MPPT all integrated together. So if the discharge contact is opened, the inverter is stopped, and if the charge contact is opened, both the charger and the MPPT are stopped. But you can also do that easily with a charger/inverter and a MPPT that would be separated, using optocouplers.

 

[Bob B]

Actually they do, you can find how to set them up like this (2 input control signals) here. EDIT: That's at least for the Multi and Quattro devices, you have to check for other product lines. Also beware, you need to buy a special connecter to connect to the inverter to be able to configure it properly with the Victron Configure software (not accessible via Victron Connect over Bluetooth for this setting).

I did this on my EasySolar, which includes a Multiplus (inverter/charger) and an MPPT all integrated together. So if the discharge contact is opened, the inverter is stopped, and if the charge contact is opened, both the charger and the MPPT are stopped. But you can also do that easily with a charger/inverter and a MPPT that would be separated, using optocouplers.

Thank you for that info .... I am having trouble deciding between the Samlex and the Victron. I had read thru the Victron manual and didn't see the info in the manual you linked to.

 

[Steve_S]

Sorry folks but this thread is a CHARGERY BMS topic, let's not go on side trips too much please. It's too easy to veer off course, I do it too often as well trying to cover the bases when a question is asked.

BTW, If memory serves, the EasySolar is not yet available in North America as far as I know but they were working on it.

 

[Bob B]

Sorry folks but this thread is a CHARGERY BMS topic, let's not go on side trips too much please. It's too easy to veer off course, I do it too often as well trying to cover the bases when a question is asked.

Well .... I understand how a thread can get sidetracked, but the Chargery BMS doesn't stand alone in a system. There are a lot of possibilities to consider. I do intend to use a Chargery BMS to control either a Samlex or a Victron inverter charger. Maybe a seperate thread for that would be appropriate.

 

[Steve_S]

It's okay in here as it deals with Chargery & interconnecting to SCC & Inverters but we need to not get too far into it and lose sight of what this thread is about. Unlike the simpler ones that only have the + & - wires and nothing else, these are more complicated and so integrating them is more involved as they are so flexible.

 

[Bob B]

It's okay in here as it deals with Chargery & interconnecting to SCC & Inverters but we need to not get too far into it and lose sight of what this thread is about. Unlike the simpler ones that only have the + & - wires and nothing else, these are more complicated and so integrating them is more involved as they are so flexible.

I agree ..... I am trying to figure out the best way to do the charge and load switching independently to minimize the need for higher current relays .... even though I did get a couple of them when I bought the chargery.

 

[HMR]

I agree ..... I am trying to figure out the best way to do the charge and load switching independently to minimize the need for higher current relays .... even though I did get a couple of them when I bought the chargery.

Would it be an idea to begin a new thread: The best way to do charge and load switching ? This is a very timely topic for me also at this point in my development and I would relish some good discussions and examples on this topic. It might usefully begin with someone organizing the existing options and their pros and cons.

 

[Barold]

How long does delivery take (recently) to Canada? I had ordered the BMS recommended by Will back on Jan 30 but it still hasn't shipped on Aliexpress. At this point can you just cancel the order and I'd order the chargery but if shipping is going to take 2 months, I may look elsewhere.

 

[Steve_S]

I got two BMS from Chargery, only took two weeks. BUT I buy direct from Chargery not vendors.
Other products have also arrived which I ordered via AliExpress in lieu of my battery pack build.
My LFP Cells were supposed to arrive yesterday BUT a major snow dump and unplowed roads delayed that till sometime today. ** And there was shipping delay due to the virus issue.