Deciding Between Magnum MS4024, Samlex EVO 4024, and Victron Quattro 24/5000

[gilliganphantom]

Hey guys. Trying to decide between inverters. I am a novice. I have an all electric school bus conversion that I'm trying to power off grid. I have a 315AH @ 24V battery bank coming (might add more if necessary), approx. 2400 watts of solar on the roof, a Midnite Solar Classic 150 MPPT Charge Controller, an MNDC 250 DC Disconnect Box to combine Charge Controller, Batteries, Solar, and Inverter, a 500A Whizbang Junior Shunt and now I need to pick an Inverter.

Potential loads that I'd like to run at once are: AC refrigerator, AC point of use water heater, Induction Cooktop, Mini-Split Air Conditioner (rarely), fans, computers and television, and Instant Pot pressure cooker and blender. No I don't expect to be able to run all of that at once but I'd like to be able to say wake up, turn on the water heater (1440 Watts), heat some water on the cooktop on high (1800 watts) while running maybe 2 fans, a television and our 10 cu ft refrigerator/freezer. Lets just round that all up and say I need 800 watts. It looks like I can meet my needs with a 4000 watt inverter. 5000 watts would be nice, but for the cost of the Victron Quattro I'd rather be limited in our energy use by our inverter. It will help us ration electricity as I don't think we have enough KWH in our battery bank to go too crazy.

Being able to monitor my batteries remotely through my phone would be really nice, but as I understand it I can buy a Victron Battery Monitor regardless of what inverter I use if that ends up feeling necessary.

Here are the inverters:

The Magnum 4024: https://www.altestore.com/store/inv...y-ms-series-invertercharger-p40780/#MAGMS4024
The Samlex 4024: https://www.altestore.com/store/inv...0w-24v-pure-sine-wave-invertercharger-p11915/
The Victron Quattro: https://www.solar-electric.com/vict...vykA0dnG6m1QP_DsUeeCEAGa2xHI3rFhoCtaAQAvD_BwE

And finally I could buy one or eventually 2 of the Victron Multiplus 24v 3000W: https://www.solar-electric.com/vict...fpOiiH-bs2rXAUpQ3Mk-rVpUxfLioa8xoCQK0QAvD_BwE and combine them to reach my needs, but that's potentially more money and more work.

So what would you do? Thanks for your help. -Justin

 

[Justin Laureltec]

I'm a Victron product expert and work at a Victron distributor, so obviously I'm biased to Victron. That being said up front, a few impartial observations:

One big difference between the Quattro and the other two options is that the Quattro has two 50A transfer switches (part of why it's so expensive, transfer switches are ungodly expensive) while the Magnum has two 30A switches and the Samlex has a single 40A switch. If you're trying to stay strictly off-grid, this may not be an important feature to you... but it's a worthy consideration.

I will note that two MultiPlus 24/3kVA units costs less than one Quattro... so if you don't need the dual transfer switches -and you have the physical room- it makes a lot more sense to get two Multi's than one Quattro, and you'd have ~6kVA (between 4800-6000 usable watts, depending on the type of loads).

I'll finally note one more big consideration: The Samlex has a 2-year warranty, the Magnum has a 3-year warranty... ALL Victron components (except batteries) have a 5-year warranty.

They're all fine products, so I'd personally say that you won't be making a mistake with any of them, although for your application I'd strongly recommend two Multis instead of a single Quattro. Other than that, the Victron units are clearly superior.... but more expensive. There's always a catch

 

[Sivak]

Doesn't sound like you need a transfer switch. I personally really like Victron components, they are slick!
I'm voting for the Victron Multiplus 24v 3000W. I also like the idea of having redundancy. 5% off @Northen Arizona Wind and Sun now. Pull the trigger.

 

[gilliganphantom]

Thanks for your help guys. I really appreciate it. Unfortunately I don't exactly understand the benefits of having multiple transfer switches. Could you give me a quick answer? Here's what I imagine I would do on the road: 1st I have a 50 amp shore inlet. If I plug into 30 amp service or even just a 15 amp outlet will these inverters augment the power and send energy from the batteries when necessary? Will they all also charge batteries from shore power when not using 50 amps but plugged in to service?

Now my plan when I don't have shore power and I don't have enough solar to charge batteries adequately is to buy a little generator like this: https://www.northerntool.com/shop/t...kN4tWt-yuBO8vmfBwwLdRO-3kwzJx9pxoCmwQQAvD_BwE and plug that straight into my shore power inlet to charge up the batteries.

So that being said...do I just need one transfer switch from batteries to shore power to accomplish all of the above?

Thanks for your advice about the Multiplus'. I'll drop the Quattro and start with one Multiplus if I go that route, but since I'm looking at $2400-$2600 for two vs $1600 for the Magnum or Samlex I don't feel like the warranty makes up for that big price difference. I don't need the fancy one, just the one that works unless Victron has something I can't live without...

 

[Steve_S]

I'm a Samlex User so chiming in, I use a 4024 Inverter/Charger and love it, and also have a Classic 200 and E-Panel with 250A, similar to your including the wizbang. It has dual AC in, 1 for grid power & 1 for the Genset, ATS is built in and quite capable. I do not have Grid Power here (would have cost over $50K to get it up here, solar was MUCH LESS ! lol). Hindsight moment though, as I bought my Classic in 2015, if I was buying everything today, I'd go with the Victron Solution for the Solar Controller & the Inverter/Charger. Midnite has been quite lackadaisical in updating firmware & capabilities for the Classics and their are furtling with their own Inverter and haven't even considered a battery line. While I love the company & support they have which is amazing really, their lack of progress is concerning. To swap out now would cost me much too much.

The Samlex Inverter can accept signals from a BMS to stop charging when full etc via one of it's interface ports. Victron Units can as well I believe. In addition, the ability to program by software / bluetooth is a big plus as well. I also believe that with the Victron you can use MODBUS / CANBUS to interface software for monitoring, tracking, configuration and much more... if you want to integrate everything and have overall control, one family makes it easier. I am coding Modbus for the Classic as well as my Samlex (Modbus protocol info for Samlex is restricted, require an NDA) and will be also integrating the BMS (Chargery BMS8T) into that software.... Yes, some BMS' can also communicate with a PC or Bluetooth / wifi depending on which you get if building a pack.

The classics can be programmed to handle LFP / Lithium by "dummying" the charge profile but that is a kludge IMO. At this moment I am running with an FLA Bank (8x Rolls S-550's 4s2p - 428AH net @ 24VDC) but am adding in the ShunBin LFP pack once I fix it up which is complicating life a bit as I want to keep the FLA's running till they finally die.... more details in my signature links

Hope that helps.

 

[Picasso]

I'd go Victron or Magnum. With Magnum being my first pick if it was the hybrid version but I think that just comes in 48v.

 

[HRTKD]

Justin, what did you end up using in your install? I'm looking at the Quattro because I will have both shore power and generator inputs.

 

[Craig]

Justin, what did you end up using in your install? I'm looking at the Quattro because I will have both shore power and generator inputs.

The samlex allow for two Ac input as well

 

[HRTKD]

The samlex allow for two Ac input as well

Thanks for the reminder. I did look at the Samlex a couple days ago, but I've shifted my thinking to an all-Victon design. Probably not Victron batteries though.

 

[gilliganphantom]

I ended up getting one 24v 3000va multiplied. I've been happy with it. I have to be conscious of when I run my water heater but other than that it hasn't limited us much. We haven't been off grid a ton though to really test it out. I ended up getting a Bluetooth monitor for it and then a battery monitor too. I'd likely go all victron if I did it again. Good luck!

 

[HRTKD]

Thanks for the update Justin.

 

[Dantheman]

I am very attracted to the victron eco system but I worry about power loss at elevation and wanted to give a buffer to load capacity so lean to the samlex evo 4024 or magnum 4kW or even a 5kw inverter from somewhere unless someone advises not to. Anyone ever run into elevation limitations?