Grid Export Limiting AIO inverter/charger options

[sleek54]

Hello everyone, this is my first post after lurking through the vast information for the past year. I would like some information and feedback on building a 48v house system to offset our business consumption.

I have plenty of electrical and mechanical experience as I am an industrial engineer by trade, however My solar knowledge is limited. I have installed two smaller 12v solar systems built into cargo trailers for lighting and tool battery charging. Currently with the business on the same property as the house we never go below 25/30 kwh per day of consumption, up to 120 kwh per day at peak times (we've had up to 12500 kwh consumed in one month).

Starting out I would like to have a system that will generate 25-50kwh per day with most if not all of that being consumed directly as soon as it's generated from the solar. We have a nursery greenhouse and indoor growing facilities on our farm here in Colorado. We have plenty of open full sun acreage for a massive array eventually so we are not limited by our location.

Are there any all in one inverter chargers with grid export limiting? Ideally I am looking for an AIO type unit but I am open to separate components if that is the only way to make this work as needed. The system will only provide solar power for what is being consumed from the A/C loads in the main panel that supply the house and outbuilding sub panels and in the situation where the solar system is producing more then what is being consumed it would be pushed to a battery bank for storage to be used at night.

Thank you for your responses.

 

[BentleyJ]

Sol-Ark 15K is a good choice it has everything built into one unit including breakers and connection lugs. Others would be Schneider XW Pro, which would require a number of separate components. SMA, Outback, perhaps the EG4 18kpv.

 

[1201]

If you are in the USA wait for the growatt 10000tl-hu-us to come out. It can do self consumption or zero export or be grid tied.

 

[sleek54]

My POCO will not pay or credit us for any net metering, with that in mind will either Growatt or Sol-Ark be capable of grid export limiting so nothing is fed into the grid for free?

 

[1201]

My POCO will not pay or credit us for any net metering, with that in mind will either Growatt or Sol-Ark be capable of grid export limiting so nothing is fed into the grid for free?

Who is your poco?

 

[sleek54]

Mountain View Electric. Let me clarify, they do net metering as a company but not with our current configuration that's been grandfathered in. They will allow an interconnection agreement but they won't pay for any export.

I am just looking for the best AIO charge/inverter with a limiting function with CT's.

 

[Solar Guppy]

Mountain View Electric. Let me clarify, they do net metering as a company but not with our current configuration that's been grandfathered in. They will allow an interconnection agreement but they won't pay for any export.

I am just looking for the best AIO charge/inverter with a limiting function with CT's.

Just about any UL listed AIO has that feature.

 

[1201]

Mountain View Electric. Let me clarify, they do net metering as a company but not with our current configuration that's been grandfathered in. They will allow an interconnection agreement but they won't pay for any export.

I am just looking for the best AIO charge/inverter with a limiting function with CT's.

This mountain view?

Interconnection/Net Metering

Interconnection If you are considering installing renewable energy sources (solar, wind, biomass, hydro, or other sources), you have come to the right place! We are here to be your source of...

www.mvea.coop

Any growatt min xh us will be your cheapest option for zero export
The cheapest one is about $1k from signature solar. You'll need a $100 meter. With this you can self consume without export.
I recommend interconnecting though even if you have no plans to export.

 

[SSC00]

If you are in the USA wait for the growatt 10000tl-hu-us to come out. It can do self consumption or zero export or be grid tied.

Any growatt min xh us will be your cheapest option for zero export
The cheapest one is about $1k from signature solar. You'll need a $100 meter. With this you can self consume without export.
I recommend interconnecting though even if you have no plans to export.

I am curious about these units. My utility is probably the most hostile utility towards rooftop solar - and by hostile i mean you have to pay to have solar on your roof.

Which Growatt inverter from signature are you talking about? Is it this one? https://signaturesolar.com/growatt-7-6kw-grid-tie-inverter-min-7600-xh-us/

I don't see where it says its essentially a hybrid inverter.

is this the one you were talking about in your first post to wait for? https://us.growatt.com/products/sph-10000tl-hu-us

 

[1201]

I am curious about these units. My utility is probably the most hostile utility towards rooftop solar - and by hostile i mean you have to pay to have solar on your roof.

Which Growatt inverter from signature are you talking about?

Growatt 7.6kW Grid-Tie Inverter | MIN 7600 XH-US

Signature Solar provides solar panels, off-grid solar systems, grid-tie, and hybrid systems. Quality solar inverters, bifacial solar panels, complete solar kits, solar batteries. Featuring brands such as EG4 Electronics with their solar battery, LifePower4 and EG4 LLifePower4 and EG4 LL

signaturesolar.com

If you plan to add battery later it requires a specific battery. I think it would be better to wait for the 10000tl hu us to become available

 

[1201]

I am curious about these units. My utility is probably the most hostile utility towards rooftop solar - and by hostile i mean you have to pay to have solar on your roof.

Which Growatt inverter from signature are you talking about?

is this the one you were talking about in your first post to wait for? https://us.growatt.com/products/sph-10000tl-hu-us

How are they hostile?

 

[SSC00]

How are they hostile?

Like charge a fee pretty much just to have solar panels on your roof and connected to the system. I think its a $5 dollar per installed kw of capacity charge. I'm no supporter of full net metering, but this is ridiculous. Makes it hard for solar to actually pay off. Better to just install it without them knowing. lol It would just be better if I didn't get anything for energy put back on grid. There is a lawsuit over it that has been going for years and I have no clue if anything has changed on it in awhile

Growatt 7.6kW Grid-Tie Inverter | MIN 7600 XH-US

Signature Solar provides solar panels, off-grid solar systems, grid-tie, and hybrid systems. Quality solar inverters, bifacial solar panels, complete solar kits, solar batteries. Featuring brands such as EG4 Electronics with their solar battery, LifePower4 and EG4 LLifePower4 and EG4 LL

signaturesolar.com

If you plan to add battery later it requires a specific battery. I think it would be better to wait for the 10000tl hu us to become available

ok. so that is the correct unit. Where can I read about the 10000tl hu us unit and when do you think it would become available? How would you rate Growatt as a company compared to the others?

This 7.6k unit is really cheap and it has home assistant integration too which is nice. Are the the EG4 the specific battery?

 

[1201]

Like charge a fee pretty much just to have solar panels on your roof and connected to the system. I think its a $5 dollar per installed kw of capacity charge. I'm no supporter of full net metering, but this is ridiculous. Makes it hard for solar to actually pay off. Better to just install it without them knowing. lol It would just be better if I didn't get anything for energy put back on grid. There is a lawsuit over it that has been going for years and I have no clue if anything has changed on it in awhile



ok. so that is the correct unit. Where can I read about the 10000tl hu us unit and when do you think it would become available? How would you rate Growatt as a company compared to the others?

SPH 10000TL-HU-US | Residential Storage Inverter | Growatt

SPH 10000TL-HU-US | Residential Storage Inverter | Growatt

us.growatt.com

I'm quite happy with my growatt.

This 7.6k unit is really cheap and it has home assistant integration too which is nice. Are the the EG4 the specific battery?

No the current ones require the aro battery.

If you are not going to connect to the utility then do it the right way. Install a second sub panel and power that with a hybrid or off grid inverter. Then you are not connected in parallel and don't have to worry about zero export.

A hybrid inverter would be better because you can power that panel with inverter power and grid power at the same time so you could get away with a smaller inverter. Make sure the hybrid you get is capable of this though. The two best ones are luxpower 12k and solark 15k(it's also a 12k unit).

The growatt tl10000 will also compete at about half the price.

 

[1201]

You are looking for inverters that offer a self consumption or peak shave feature

 

[SSC00]

SPH 10000TL-HU-US | Residential Storage Inverter | Growatt

SPH 10000TL-HU-US | Residential Storage Inverter | Growatt

us.growatt.com

I'm quite happy with my growatt.

No the current ones require the aro battery.

If you are not going to connect to the utility then do it the right way. Install a second sub panel and power that with a hybrid or off grid inverter. Then you are not connected in parallel and don't have to worry about zero export.

A hybrid inverter would be better because you can power that panel with inverter power and grid power at the same time so you could get away with a smaller inverter. Make sure the hybrid you get is capable of this though. The two best ones are luxpower 12k and solark 15k(it's also a 12k unit).

The growatt tl10000 will also compete at about half the price.

ok that is good to hear. Glad its been working for you.

I will have to think about how i would go about with the sub panel. I know i have to do that eventually. to me, the most challenging load is my electric range. My service connection is only 100Amps too.

That solark unit is definitely a Cadillac. lol. Very nice. it truly does do everything. I wonder when all these features will become more common on lower priced ones. it seems to only happen with the really nice ones now.

You are looking for inverters that offer a self consumption or peak shave feature

ok that is helpful too. I guess I could start putting together a list of features I need an inverter to have.

 

[1201]

ok that is good to hear. Glad its been working for you.

I will have to think about how i would go about with the sub panel. I know i have to do that eventually. to me, the most challenging load is my electric range. My service connection is only 100Amps too.

That solark unit is definitely a Cadillac. lol. Very nice. it truly does do everything. I wonder when all these features will become more common on lower priced ones. it seems to only happen with the really nice ones now.


ok that is helpful too. I guess I could start putting together a list of features I need an inverter to have.

How much in kWh does your electric range use per month? Most of my large loads are on the sub panel, which in reality is just HVAC and water heater. I decided not to have my electric range or electric clothes dryer on there. Demand is way too high even though they only use about 100kwh a month.

Now, with a good hybrid inverter you could still put the range on there and it will use its max output plus input from the grid, at the same time, to supply the loads.

 

[SSC00]

How much in kWh does your electric range use per month? Most of my large loads are on the sub panel, which in reality is just HVAC and water heater. I decided not to have my electric range or electric clothes dryer on there. Demand is way too high even though they only use about 100kwh a month.

Now, with a good hybrid inverter you could still put the range on there and it will use its max output plus input from the grid, at the same time, to supply the loads.

I'm thinking more of the peak power load of the unit because that affects the sizing of the inverter, as far as I understand. I probably would have to do like what you did. I think that we will start seeing more products come on the market that can help with these load conditions.

The image below shows by home's energy use for the past 18 months. I need to update it to current. I live in a 3 bed 2 bath and I'm single (looking to change that lol). My whole home is electrified and my car is not an EV (yet)

 

[1201]

I'm thinking more of the peak power load of the unit because that affects the sizing of the inverter, as far as I understand. I probably would have to do like what you did. I think that we will start seeing more products come on the market that can help with these load conditions.

The image below shows by home's energy use for the past 18 months. I need to update it to current. I live in a 3 bed 2 bath and I'm single (looking to change that lol). My whole home is electrified and my car is not an EV (yet)

View attachment 200643

Not a lot of kWh use. What high demand items do you have? How about high surge?

 

[SSC00]

Not a lot of kWh use. What high demand items do you have? How about high surge?

My home is about 1900 sqft and the building envelope is not that great. About to improve it though.

The only high demand items I have are the heat pump air conditioning unit (cant remember total load on that one right now im not really clear on that though), the range with an absolute (with everything on) load of 13kw, the water heater 4.5kw, and dryer which i think is 5kw. The water heater and dryer are getting close to end of life/warrant too, so can just replace those with far more efficient units. (heat pump dryer and water heater) My AC heat pump was installed in 2008 too (well before i bought the house).

In any case, I am coming up on some upgrades that will reduce energy use further and should help with peak loads. I have not done a formal calculation on that yet though because i have been more focused on just learning how the different components come together.

Unless I either put a lot of storage or I find some way to do seasonal storage - with a thermal battery or something - I wouldn't need a huge system.

 

[sleek54]

This mountain view?

Interconnection/Net Metering

Interconnection If you are considering installing renewable energy sources (solar, wind, biomass, hydro, or other sources), you have come to the right place! We are here to be your source of...

www.mvea.coop

Any growatt min xh us will be your cheapest option for zero export
The cheapest one is about $1k from signature solar. You'll need a $100 meter. With this you can self consume without export.
I recommend interconnecting though even if you have no plans to export.

Yes, that is my POCO. I know they offer it but I can't participate due to our grandfathered farm configuration, the POCO wants us to go to a full commercial transformer or bring multiple services to the property. Either option is too expensive to have solar ever pay for itself going that route since they won't approve us to sell back to the grid currently.