How do DIY folks deal with NEC 690.4 (C) - Qualified Persons Only

[TheMadNucleus]

I'm curious as it seems contrary to all the videos and DIY information on the net about Solar Systems. The NEC states in 690.4 (C)

(C) Qualified Personnel. The installation of equipment and all associated wiring and interconnections shall be performed only by qualified persons.

This is the section on Photovoltaic Systems so "equipment" in this section refers to Solar system equipment.

How can a DIY person align with this rule from the NEC?

Any Thoughts?

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Installation verification by a qualified person.

 

[HammaMan]

I'm curious as it seems contrary to all the videos and DIY information on the net about Solar Systems. The NEC states in 690.4 (C)

(C) Qualified Personnel. The installation of equipment and all associated wiring and interconnections shall be performed only by qualified persons.

This is the section on Photovoltaic Systems so "equipment" in this section refers to Solar system equipment.

How can a DIY person align with this rule from the NEC?

Any Thoughts?

It comes down to your jurisdiction. As far as I'm aware, it'd be a steep slope for them to try and say a homeowner cannot perform their own work so long as it's permitted and inspected.

Part of 'doing your own work' is showing the system design / specifications. Don't expect to just slap a bunch of stuff together and get rubber stamped. It's like school...... show your work, not just the 'answer'.

 

[TheMadNucleus]

So you mean someone who is qualified, but did not do the work, but is willing to say they did do the work since the code specifically indicates the work needs to be done by a qualified person, not just verified by a qualified person. Correct?

 

[HammaMan]

Qualified and licensed are not synonymous....

Are you qualified to bake a cake? What makes you qualified to bake a cake, or cook on a grill?

 

[TheMadNucleus]

Hi HammaMan - I have two engineering degrees (ET and CS) and I would certainly not just slap something together. However in my County in NY (AHJ), I I simply cannot pull a permit - a "qualified person" needs to do that. They don't consider me "qualified" as the home owner or based on my background, period. I called and asked how to go about pulling a permit and hit a brick wall. Interestingly, forget about working with the installers - they all have only one approach - the system they offer and design and you have no input other then to pay them.

 

[Shimmy]

Hi HammaMan - I have two engineering degrees (ET and CS) and I would certainly not just slap something together. However in my County in NY (AHJ), I I simply cannot pull a permit - a "qualified person" needs to do that. They don't consider me "qualified" as the home owner or based on my background, period. I called and asked how to go about pulling a permit and hit a brick wall. Interestingly, forget about working with the installers - they all have only one approach - the system they offer and design and you have no input other then to pay them.

That is how some jurisdictions work. If you know any small electricians that will pull the permit for you (and supervise or execute the electrical work) that is usually the easiest way. Expect to pay them at least 3% of the project value to do it.

 

[TheMadNucleus]

Yes agree - that section 100 "Qualified Person" does not specify Licensed - however most AHJ have no way to determine that you are qualified unless you have a license and this is the fall back for the jurisdictions. But I guess that depends on your jurisdiction.

 

[TheMadNucleus]

Hi Shimmy - do you know any in the NY area - I have called many and they simply refuse to have anything to do with this.

 

[HammaMan]

Unfortunately that's one of those situations where they'd bully you while not having a legal leg to stand on. Taking them to court would end up more expensive than borrowing someone's license.
I ran into a warranty issue for a $14k mits minisplit in that the warranty was much longer w/ a "qualified" installer. I did all the work and paid an HVAC shop to do the leak testing and they agreed to take ownership of the installation for parts warranty purposes. They also wanted me to work for them :D

 

[Mattb4]

I need to setup an online school to qualify people to do their own PV installations. After a rigourous course of reading this Forum, and looking at several Videos from Will, a Final qualification test would have to be passed. I would than issue a shiny "Certificate of Personal Home Solar Qualified Individual". The named individual is deemed qualified under NEC 690.4(C) allowed to pull permits and complete his/her own solar installation.

 

[HammaMan]

I need to setup an online school to qualify people to do their own PV installations. After a rigourous course of reading this Forum, and looking at several Videos from Will, a Final qualification test would have to be passed. I would than issue a shiny "Certificate of Personal Home Solar Qualified Individual". The named individual is deemed qualified under NEC 690.4(C) allowed to pull permits and complete his/her own solar installation.

The issue is that to get licenses in some states they require you to have several years in the profession. As such you'd have zero means of actually making someone 'certified'.

If it weren't for having to prove years under a company for certain licenses, I'd get them just to have them out of ..... not really boredom that drives such things, it's just that it's really easy to obtain the knowledge to adequately qualify for all sorts of things. I've got all sorts of certifications the past 2 decades simply because I could. It's just a function of legacy thinking interfering with those capable of fully utilizing the information age.

 

[Mattb4]

The issue is that to get licenses in some states they require you to have several years in the profession. As such you'd have zero means of actually making someone 'certified'.

I was attempting humor. Thank goodness I live in a State where working on your own place requires no State approval. And in my County no permits.

 

[HammaMan]

I was attempting humor. Thank goodness I live in a State where working on your own place requires no State approval. And in my County no permits.

Same -- anyone can pull their own permits and complete the work here.

 

[timselectric]

If you know any small electricians that will pull the permit for you.

Large electricians can pull permits too. lol

 

[TheMadNucleus]

Mattb and HammaMan - what state do you live in - understand if you don't want to say - I'm asking because I'm thinking this is the last straw for me to move out of NY.

 

[timselectric]

In Kentucky, any homeowners who also reside in the home. Are allowed to do any and all work themselves.
It's called a homeowners permit.

 

[BlueMarblePA]

I called my permit and codes office in PA, and the woman said that I could file the permit without a contractor or electrician. I hope she is correct. We will see. Am about to pay greenlancer.com to draw everything up.

 

[Quattrohead]

In Kentucky, any homeowners who also reside in the home. Are allowed to do any and all work themselves.
It's called a homeowners permit.

Same for Florida.

 

[HammaMan]

Mattb and HammaMan - what state do you live in - understand if you don't want to say - I'm asking because I'm thinking this is the last straw for me to move out of NY.

GA
It's extremely stupid for any permitting office to not allow a home owner to pull their own permits. It doesn't stop home owners, it just FORCES them to act 'un-inspected'.

Very shortsighted of them to say the least.