I'm new with lithium

[BrandonFenn]

Hello. I am very new to the lifep04 batteries and have recently purchased an Sok battery per Will's recommendation. I have an Outback Flexmax 60 amp Charge controller and 3 Agm batteries currently. It took alot of digging to find the proper setting for those lead batteries and I'm even more confused with the lithium. So in short I just want to make sure I set my charge parameters correctly so as to not damage my shiny new battery. I'd like help on absorb times, float if any, and what I can disharge down to. Any and all information would be super helpful.

 

[BrandonFenn]

I also want to add that my fm60 Mppt charge controller is very manual and you have to set charge voltages, how long it charges in absorb and float. Pretty much everything. Also want to add that i bought the 30 dollar battery monitor that was recommended for lithium. So I should have everything I need. My current charge parameters are 14.6 charging voltage, 13.6 float. absorb time of 2 hours, and float of 2 hours for my agm batteries.

 

[MisterSandals]

Lots of discussions regarding this. Also, consult the Sok charging docs and recommendations.

Search results for query: sok battery charge settings

diysolarforum.com

 

[RVLiFe]

Don’t over complicate it. I have an SOK battery as well and the first few times I charged it I was able to charge to 14.6v and then hold it there for about 10 minutes until the current dropped to about 2 amps and I’d kill the charger. Now I can only get about 14.3v out of it before the current starts dropping. SOK says this is normal.
Honestly, charge and discharge to the knees. With my SOK, I’d say it’s right around 13.8v to 14v and stop. No need to let it absorb. You won’t experience any real benefit in charging it higher. And on the discharge side, let it get down to about 12.6-12.5v and start charging again. You can run it down to 12v it you need but it will drop extremely quick once it gets to about 12.5v. If you stick with this plan, you will be extremely happy with the battery. You will probably be able to draw close to 200Ah or a little more out of it with this strategy. Plus you will get the added benefit of longer battery life.

That is my new system that I’m currently using and things are working great. I might decide to charge once or twice a year to 14.4 or 14.5v and then hold the voltage there and let it “absorb” until the current drops to a couple of amps(about 10-15 min) but no need to do this every time. It just over taxes the battery in my opinion. It won’t hurt it, it just doesn’t need to be done very often.

 

[Tecnodave]

I have a very simular charge controller designed by the same team that created Outback so I have researched this a bit

Set battery type to custom
Set bulk to specs of battery manufacturer
set adsorb voltage to same voltage
set adsorb time to 5 minutes (minimum on mine is 3 minutes)
set float to same voltage
set float time to minimum value less than 10 minutes
set equalize off
set temp comp off


This works well for older controllers that were designed with total programmability

Steve_S on this forum works with older designs as well, he has some very good info on this matter

 

[BrandonFenn]

I have a very simular charge controller designed by the same team that created Outback so I have researched this a bit

Set battery type to custom
Set bulk to specs of battery manufacturer
set adsorb voltage to same voltage
set adsorb time to 5 minutes (minimum on mine is 3 minutes)
set float to same voltage
set float time to minimum value less than 10 minutes
set equalize off
set temp comp off


This works well for older controllers that were designed with total programmability

Steve_S on this forum works with older designs as well, he has some very good info on this matter

What do you mean set absorb voltage to same voltage? 14.6?

 

[Tecnodave]

set bulk, adsorb to same voltage....(the voltage recommended by YOUR battery manufacturer, not some one size fits all setting........your Outback is a bit different than my MidNite Classic, both were designed by Robin and Bob Gudgel so they both are “fully programmable” and similar in design,

Lithium's were not widely used then

Basically lithium does not need a bulk, adsorb,float,equilize charge parameters.

Bring them up to the manufacturers set point , let them continue to adsorb for 10-15 minutes then shut off all charging

Lithium batteries do not like floating.....bring them up to the set point is all you will need to do

It will be a workaround of the 4 stage charging that is programmed into the Outback programming.

Unfortunely it is not a good idea to remove the output of the charge controller from the battery when there is solar input. That will kill many controllers, it pains me to admit how i discovered that. If you must shut off the controller do it at the solar input.

Steve_S on this forum does have FLA batteries and Lithium batteries charged (not at the same time) with a Classic 250
He down loads a script to the Classic to do that. You might want to look at his system description and in there he explains lithium charging with the Classic.....again the Classic is the next evolution of the Outback....they were both designed before lithiums took off.....

 

[Tecnodave]

For some good articles on this go to midniteftp.com, scroll down to the support tickets, you will find many articles on how to do what you need to. There are at least 3 good articles on programming a Classic to charge lithium batteries

Unfortunetly Outback support is not in the ballpark with MidNite support, not that Outback is bad, they are great units. I chose MidNite due to design and the best support that i have seen

MidNite, Outback, and Morningstar were the finalists in my choosing which to purchase,

I had asian.krap....no support, none, nada......
its gone now, don't want to hear about it sold with a 30/30 warranty....30 seconds, 30 feet

unfortunately that is typical asian support 30/30

 

[BrandonFenn]

set bulk, adsorb to same voltage....(the voltage recommended by YOUR battery manufacturer, not some one size fits all setting........your Outback is a bit different than my MidNite Classic, both were designed by Robin and Bob Gudgel so they both are “fully programmable” and similar in design,

Lithium's were not widely used then

Basically lithium does not need a bulk, adsorb,float,equilize charge parameters.

Bring them up to the manufacturers set point , let them continue to adsorb for 10-15 minutes then shut off all charging

Lithium batteries do not like floating.....bring them up to the set point is all you will need to do

It will be a workaround of the 4 stage charging that is programmed into the Outback programming.

Unfortunely it is not a good idea to remove the output of the charge controller from the battery when there is solar input. That will kill many controllers, it pains me to admit how i discovered that. If you must shut off the controller do it at the solar input.

Steve_S on this forum does have FLA batteries and Lithium batteries charged (not at the same time) with a Classic 250
He down loads a script to the Classic to do that. You might want to look at his system description and in there he explains lithium charging with the Classic.....again the Classic is the next evolution of the Outback....they were both designed before lithiums took off.....

Is there an mppt that can do this automatically and not require constant monitoring of the system. Id like to be able to live life lol.

 

[Tecnodave]

Have you done what i suggested?

 

[BrandonFenn]

Have you done what i suggested?

I have not. I am trying to get all my information together before hooking it up. I have gone through the settings and found everything i should change. But im still concerned of how i should deal with stopping charge when its full. Will my Mppt do this? As I said I am a complete novice when it comes to these fine settings. I spent alot of money on my Outback and feel like it was a waste. Id hate for one 400 dollar piece of equipment to destroy a 570 dollar battery.

 

[Tecnodave]

There is an Outback users forum, they would have more hands on.

Midnite does have an in/out port for remote control, capable of shutting off charging.

I have 5 MidNite controllers, no Outback, 2 MorningStar, 16 Trace

There are MPPT controllers out there that will work as is out of the box, but you would be throwing a Cadillac out for a Yugo

Check out the Outback users on the Outback forum, someone has to be doing that, mostly off shore users on this forum

forum.outbackpower.com

I was just on the outback users forum and there are several users posting there, please go read that thread BUT use the charge parameters from your manufacturer for the exact model battery.

The Outback can be set for a float voltage less than bulk/adsorb...

 

[BrandonFenn]

There is an Outback users forum, they would have more hands on.

Midnite does have an in/out port for remote control, capable of shutting off charging.

I have 4 MidNite controllers, no Outback, 2 MorningStar, 16 Trace

There are MPPT controllers out there that will work as is but you would be throwing a Cadillac out for a Yugo

Check out the Outback users on the Outback forum, someone has to be doing that, mostly off shore users on this forum

I tried looking around but I was only finding 24 volt configurations and Im 12 volt. I will keep searching however

 

[MisterSandals]

I tried looking around but I was only finding 24 volt configurations and Im 12 volt. I will keep searching however

I don't get what you're still looking for. All the info that you need is in post #4 and #5.

What settings, specifically, are you having trouble with?

 

[Tecnodave]

I think it will translate.....dont use the 24 volt values. Generic values are suggestions, get the charge profile for your exact battery, I have two sets of L-16 batteries but the charge voltages are different

Interstate (Rebadged U.S.Battery) L-16 426 a.h. 28.8 bulk
Rolls Surette L-16 428 a.h. 30.0 bulk

different manufacturer, different cell construction, different voltages

 

[BrandonFenn]

I don't get what you're still looking for. All the info that you need is in post #4 and #5.

What settings, specifically, are you having trouble with?

Trouble understanding how I should stop charging. After I have set all the setting recommended by you what do I have to do to protect my battery if im not around during the charging process? It will be charging from solar while im gone most days so all I want to know is if it will stop charging on its own? Or if it will be fine with the settings you told me about and i should have no other worries. Pretend im a complete moron and explain it to me in lamens lmao.

 

[Tecnodave]

I don't get what you're still looking for. All the info that you need is in post #4 and #5.

What settings, specifically, are you having trouble with?

MisterSandals,

answer #4 assumes a portable charger, just disconnect when at set point.....(not exactly)
OP is using a fixed MPPT controller which should not be disconnected

 

[BrandonFenn]

So in short. My 12 volt battery should be charged at 14.6 and all other voltages should be the 14.6? No float time should happen. and only 5 mins of absorbing should occur? And no equalize? As long as that is all done I should be good to go yes? My main concern at this point after the battery is charged is how i should stop charging? I cant just disconnect my solar panels all willy nilly at the turn of a dime. So i am concerned of damaging bettery if i set all the perameters mentioned and just walk away for a few days.

 

[Tecnodave]

Log into Outback support, They will be the authority, I have no Outback equipment but when i call them about a specific model with the serial number I got good support.

Im a MidNite guy, 5 controllers, and about a hundred other MidNite items I have no experience setting up an Outback System with lithium batteries but I have worked on a dozen Systems but all with FLA battery

 

[MisterSandals]

My 12 volt battery should be charged at 14.6 and all other voltages should be the 14.6?

With my SOK, I’d say it’s right around 13.8v to 14v and stop.

RVLiFe has experience with the battery you have. His numbers sound spot on to me. I am a conservative charger and only charge to 13.8V but he says 14V works great so go with that.

Set your top charge voltage (is it called absorb?) to 14.0V (this is a nice conservative charge).
Set your float to 13.5V (this is conservative too). You can always adjust these is 15 seconds, 20 times a day if you like to tinker.
Set equalization to off if it has that ability. Many systems you have to set equalization time to 0 (zero minutes).

What else ya got that you're not sure about?

These numbers tell your charger when to stop. Your BMS values should cover the battery voltage extremes (cell top 3.65V bottom 2.5V). A little conservative can be 3.60V top and 2.8V bottom. This is the safety disconnect to protect your batteries.