Newbies in this field of solar, read it before you even start a new solar project.

[Camginger]

After investing (I should say ''wasting'') so much time trying to understand all the small details, and adding all the cost of a very complex system like this (Victron, Renogy, .. I mean inverter, solar controler, size of the wires and fuses, breakers, etc.etc...), I decided that I will send the whole bunch of stuff back that I just bought and get a refund for all that stuff ...

Last night, after SSSSSSSOOOOOOO many hours (I should say ''WEEKS and WEEKS) trying to understand everything, I thought ''f**k off''. I'm going to buy my second ''all in one'' system from MPP SOLAR again!! I made a mistake with my first one a few years ago (I shorted it out myself, my own fault..). You can see my old post asking qst about how to fix it. It still not fixed and in a closet, but I'll get it looked after later when I have some more free time on my own.

If I blew it again guys, I don't think I will this time, I'll buy another ''all in one'' system from MPPSOLAR AGAIN!!!!!

Technology evolved guys, you should go with the flow of evolution. MPP SOLAR is the answer. Don't waste your time

I'm normally trying to follow this saying in my life: ''KISS'' = Keep It Simple Stupid!!!

Good luck to everybody investing (...and WASTING) SSSOOOO MUCH TIME trying to undertand all the small details of building a VERY COMPLEX system with ALL these different brands with ALL their different components.

To me, when you understand all the small details that a very complex system like this can be, the only result is that you can try to look good when trying to explain all of it to newbies like I was...

It' just not worth wasting my precious time to understand the whole thing. And I think that it should also not worth wasting anybody else precious time either.

 

[MiSh]

From what I get, you're happy with your second MPP AIO now? Nice to hear. Building your own solar gen. system from components is not for everyone. You have to have a real desire. Being mechanically/electrically inclined doesn't hurt either. I have a friend that doesn't know what end of a hammer to hold. The aptitude to repair/fix/build things is just not in his makeup. Just the way some people are.

 

[50ShadesOfDirt]

I built my system from components ... not knowing anything, other than I couldn't have and didn't want a grid connection where I was. I did a bunch of research.

Started out with a Magnum 4024 (tier-1, LF), and RTFM'd more than a few manuals, but we got it done. The complete system (inverter/mppt, batteries, panels ...) is approaching a decade in age, and overall, it refuses to die. That's tier-1 quality, and that's the power of individual componentry.

It produces power to this day, and not a day goes by that I don't learn something new ... this is the secret to working with this stuff. Never stop reading, researching, learning ...

I do run some small projects with an MPP Solar AIO (small 24v model), to stick my toes in the water. But the design, warranty, and other aspects of it lead me to believe it won't last but a year or so, as the inverter is an HF, and with manufacturing quality these days (and most manufacturers not participating in Right to Repair), things tend to die on the very day that the warranty expires. After a year or two, I'll have a bit more confidence in them ... but I still keep a spare AIO on the shelf, as this is the only way to handle their major shortcoming ... life expectancy. You can't get around the short warranty, the forum pool of experience indicating problems with AIO, and so on ...

I would never tell someone they shouldn't go the componentry route, or the AIO route ... I can and do say that they should spend an inordinate amount of time researching the manufacturers, the warranties, the support models, and so on, and even then, test the crap out of it. And, have fallback positions (a fuel generator) ...

If someone "bought a bunch of stuff", and then tried to make sense of it, I can see where they'd go off the rails; you've got to research, plan, RTFM, and only then, buy stuff.

Alternatively, start with a very small 12v system, and wing it ... not hard to slap together, didn't cost a lot, and you learned by doing, vs reading.

Alternatively alternate ... ask for help. Get someone to show you. Find a class being taught, somewhere ...

It's a journey ...

 

[Q-Dog]

If you call every purchase you make an "investment," are not willing to spend a few dollars to learn something, and are NOT detail oriented you will likely struggle with the details it takes to get solar to work for you.

So far, I have enjoyed every cent I spent on my setup. I could have done it cheaper, but I learned something from every purchase. The first time we had a grid outage but still spent a relatively normal evening while our neighbors sat in the dark or drug out their generators was worth every penny spent. My wife even said, "I don't have any idea what all of this cost, but it was worth it."

I'll eventually have some "leftovers" that I plan on passing along to a relative that has expressed an interest in learning about solar.

 

[Camginger]

I apologyze guys, I never wanted to offend anybody here. But you and I are both right.

YOU:
What I really meant was that if someone is willing to put the hours (and I mean MANY MANY hours) to build a very complex system, and have a passion and a real desire to build it PROPERLY a good system (like Mish said), then you'll have A LOT OF FUN for sure.


ME:
I guess I realized that I DID NOT HAVE that kind passion to build it. At first, after reading MANY comments here, and watched MANY YT videos, it all looked so easy and fun. I was also very excited at first.

But I realized that I'm more like the type of guy who love to build something THAT WILL LAST FOR A LONG TIME I just do not want to investigate every little problem that arises. I personally saw people having problems with their systems during a cold winter or a hot summer. Believe me, they DIDN'T like it (I don't know why...LOL).

And be honest guys, after your system is built, problems WILL happen (small or big, cheap or expensive).

Probably that problems can also happen with an ''All In One system'', I'm not denying it. Shits happen sometimes...

But as a newbie, you should put down on paper ALL THE COST of building the system you want to build before you start building it.
I mean:
-all the parts ($$, and still more $$$ to come in the future)
-all your hours to concieve your system
-all your time to go to the store to buy some parts
-all the time to go BACK to the store because you bought the wrong part(s)
-all the time you will spend to go back to the store because the part you just bought is not working (that also happens)
-all the gas you'll spend to go to the store to get those parts
-all the hours you will spend reading and watching YT videos (and some videos are just not right, some are totally wrong)
-all the nights you will stay awake thinking about it (because you'll be sssooo excited, like a kid dreaming of a new toy...)
-etc.

CONCLUSION:
If you're like me, and you are really busy, and you really DO NOT have that kind of real passion to build that kind of complex systems, guys, have a look at the ''All In One system''.

Even Will Prowse says it: If you want a very good system, a really easy system to install, just go for the ''All In One system''.

Personally, I have many passions in my life. But I just do not have a passion for that kind of stuff. At least I realized AFTER that I'm not that passionned for that kind of stuff. Because IT NEVER ENDS! And it WILL NEVER END...!! LOL

Be honnest guys. You will always have to fix a little something here and there. It's a ''never-ending'' kind of complex project.

When you have kids, believe me, you really do not want to wake-up in the middle of a cold winter night with no heating inside.... or during a very hot summer day, with a full fridge full of good stuff with ... no more electricity

And normally, that kind of shyyt happens when you do not have time to spare to figure out what the problem is..... RRRRRRrrrrrr

Anyway, to each his or her passion!

Good day and also... good luck guys with your projects..

 

[Tulex]

I'm an all in one guy for at least 4 reasons.
1 - It's hard to figure it all out, and know you've really built the most compatible system. The best of each component my not be the best at working together. Even getting help on here is difficult because there is so much more customization when piecing it together, much of which isn't really needed.
2 - My mind says the manufacture knows better than me what works together. Sol-Ark, in my case, has one software to deal with all the components.
3 - It's all covered by the same warranty and service.
4 - No component blame game. Sol-Ark can argue with themselves about which component is to blame.

 

[Q-Dog]

There are plenty of things I have no desire or patience or aptitude for. And, there is nothing wrong with admitting you don't have the desire or patience or aptitude for doing those things.

BUT, my system was born out of a desire to keep the fridge and freezer going, and have a few lights and maybe a small amount of climate control after a disaster; and to gain a bit more self-sufficiency along the way. If I am going to rely on this stuff to get me through bad times, I want to know how it all works, how to fix it, and how to work around the possibility a main component fails.

Cost-wise, I still feel like I am in hobby territory. I've certainly spent a lot more $$$s on my car and tool hobby.

 

[Camginger]

I'm an all in one guy for at least 4 reasons.
1 - It's hard to figure it all out, and know you've really built the most compatible system. The best of each component my not be the best at working together. Even getting help on here is difficult because there is so much more customization when piecing it together, much of which isn't really needed.
2 - My mind says the manufacture knows better than me what works together. Sol-Ark, in my case, has one software to deal with all the components.
3 - It's all covered by the same warranty and service.
4 - No component blame game. Sol-Ark can argue with themselves about which component is to blame.E

 

[Camginger]

It's like you put in words exactly what I couldn't. With all the help you can get here, you will never beat a big company!! Exactly.

Also, I want to be clear: I also keep a gas generator and a smaller inverter ready just in case my ''All In One system'' fails..

 

[Camginger]

There are plenty of things I have no desire or patience or aptitude for. And, there is nothing wrong with admitting you don't have the desire or patience or aptitude for doing those things.

BUT, my system was born out of a desire to keep the fridge and freezer going, and have a few lights and maybe a small amount of climate control after a disaster; and to gain a bit more self-sufficiency along the way. If I am going to rely on this stuff to get me through bad times, I want to know how it all works, how to fix it, and how to work around the possibility a main component fails.

Cost-wise, I still feel like I am in hobby territory. I've certainly spent a lot more $$$s on my car and tool hobby.

At the end, it is all a personal choice. But I just wanted to be sure that newbies would go through the pros and before making the jump. And for many people, the solar choice is NOT JUST A HOBBY. This is a calculated choice. I just wanted to tell them that, very often, BE HONEST GUYS, it can be a real pain in the ...

And as for a hobby with cars and tools, like Q-Dog, I've been through that same choice too years ago. I spent some time and money on this so called hobby. That was just all fun at the time. But today, when I buy a car or truck, I just wanna be absolutely sure that it will be reliable and take me from point A to point B EVERY TIME I need it, without any potential problem because I miscalculated the wire size, or the fuse size, or any other small thing . No more expensive hobby for me today. I will never be as good as a whole bunch of engineers working together on a reliable system.

Also, with kids, the budget is tighter. And , I DO NOT WANT TO PUT MY KIDS IN DANGER because I did even the smallest mistakes when building a VERY COMPLEX solar system.

So newbies,watch Will Prowse video on the ''All In One systems''. Have a look on ebay for MPP SOLAR, these systems are not that expensive. Amazon do not have as much choise on these ''All In One systems'', I don't know why though... Anyway, these are REALLY EASY TO INSTALL, compare to the other way!!! I warned you!!

 

[JRH]

I apologyze guys, I never wanted to offend anybody here. But you and I are both right.

YOU:
What I really meant was that if someone is willing to put the hours (and I mean MANY MANY hours) to build a very complex system, and have a passion and a real desire to build it PROPERLY a good system (like Mish said), then you'll have A LOT OF FUN for sure.


ME:
I guess I realized that I DID NOT HAVE that kind passion to build it. At first, after reading MANY comments here, and watched MANY YT videos, it all looked so easy and fun. I was also very excited at first.

But I realized that I'm more like the type of guy who love to build something THAT WILL LAST FOR A LONG TIME I just do not want to investigate every little problem that arises. I personally saw people having problems with their systems during a cold winter or a hot summer. Believe me, they DIDN'T like it (I don't know why...LOL).

And be honest guys, after your system is built, problems WILL happen (small or big, cheap or expensive).

Probably that problems can also happen with an ''All In One system'', I'm not denying it. Shits happen sometimes...

But as a newbie, you should put down on paper ALL THE COST of building the system you want to build before you start building it.
I mean:
-all the parts ($$, and still more $$$ to come in the future)
-all your hours to concieve your system
-all your time to go to the store to buy some parts
-all the time to go BACK to the store because you bought the wrong part(s)
-all the time you will spend to go back to the store because the part you just bought is not working (that also happens)
-all the gas you'll spend to go to the store to get those parts
-all the hours you will spend reading and watching YT videos (and some videos are just not right, some are totally wrong)
-all the nights you will stay awake thinking about it (because you'll be sssooo excited, like a kid dreaming of a new toy...)
-etc.

CONCLUSION:
If you're like me, and you are really busy, and you really DO NOT have that kind of real passion to build that kind of complex systems, guys, have a look at the ''All In One system''.

Even Will Prowse says it: If you want a very good system, a really easy system to install, just go for the ''All In One system''.

Personally, I have many passions in my life. But I just do not have a passion for that kind of stuff. At least I realized AFTER that I'm not that passionned for that kind of stuff. Because IT NEVER ENDS! And it WILL NEVER END...!! LOL

Be honnest guys. You will always have to fix a little something here and there. It's a ''never-ending'' kind of complex project.

When you have kids, believe me, you really do not want to wake-up in the middle of a cold winter night with no heating inside.... or during a very hot summer day, with a full fridge full of good stuff with ... no more electricity

And normally, that kind of shyyt happens when you do not have time to spare to figure out what the problem is..... RRRRRRrrrrrr

Anyway, to each his or her passion!

Good day and also... good luck guys with your projects..

If you think that solar expense , complexity, time invested and troubles are bad, go buy a 30 + ft BOAT ….and dock it in a decent marina….. ?

 

[Camginger]

If you think that solar expense , complexity, time invested and troubles are bad, go buy a 30 + ft BOAT ….and dock it in a decent marina….. ?

Let's not talk about boats either... I've looked at boats before. That is another big money pit! If you have that kind of money, good for you. But for me, and for many other people, we don't. If you had a 30 + ft boat, would you prefere to install an ''All In One system'' on it, or put a system with a zillion wires with many fuses and breakers and ... Personally, I would go for the easier and more reliable one!!

 

[Checkthisout]

If you call every purchase you make an "investment," are not willing to spend a few dollars to learn something, and are NOT detail oriented you will likely struggle with the details it takes to get solar to work for you.

This. This right here. This is the way of the do-it-yourselfer.

 

[JRH]

Let's not talk about boats either... I've looked at boats before. That is another big money pit! If you have that kind of money, good for you. But for me, and for many other people, we don't. If you had a 30 + ft boat, would you prefere to install an ''All In One system'' on it, or put a system with a zillion wires with many fuses and breakers and ... Personally, I would go for the easier and more reliable one!!

On any boat I have owned or would own, ( 40 ft +) I will always have every wire, circuit, fuse, pump and important device accessible to fast tracing, locating removing ,replacing or fixing or it won’t be on my boat long ….
As far as reliability ,a stick built solar system “CAN “ far outweigh any AOI I am aware of. On a stick built system you did every step and chose each part…connected every wire, ran each wire and fitting…. just like a boat you grow to know every last thing about it , what sounds like when it’s purring ….and also when it’s not feeling well …it becomes part of you .

as far as being easier, well that’s not a consideration for what I do in life that’s important …it was when I was a youngster but I learned better through the years…

J.

 

[yodamota]

personally I am lost as to how a AIO makes life easier. Having not dealt with one I might not know what is so special about them. To me they are just an inverter/charge controller combined. I was under the impression you still need to figure out wire size, fuses, bus bars, circuit breakers. again I am lost how AIO make life easier. It seems most manuals list the fuse/circuit breakers for the inverters/charge controllers

 

[AmpD]

Wife, vehicle, mega yacht it's all complicated. Throw kids in that mix and triple the cost of whatever you thought it was going to be.

As for a solar system. Yeah I didn't understand the animal I was tracking at first. I still don't. I'm glad I started educating myself on it. I think it will be fun. I also appreciate that I will have built it myself from the ground up and know what does what. Why this is covered. Why I shouldn't touch that to that without doing this first and the like.

Ever replace siding in your house? Outlets? Roofing? Fencing...Mow the lawn?

Life is "work". Some work you are willing to pay others to do. Some you will do yourself out of enjoyment or necessity. It is for an individual to decide which is which and what level of work they desire.

But yes and avid warning about various costs and complexities is well warranted.

If I could go back already I would have looked at those copper backed sungold panels instead. In a mobile setup it is all about watts per square foot imo!

Best advice I could give to anyone new to the solar game. Educate Yourself! That goes for life too. It is something of value that can rarely be taken from you.

 

[Checkthisout]

personally I am lost as to how a AIO makes life easier. Having not dealt with one I might not know what is so special about them. To me they are just an inverter/charge controller combined. I was under the impression you still need to figure out wire size, fuses, bus bars, circuit breakers. again I am lost how AIO make life easier. It seems most manuals list the fuse/circuit breakers for the inverters/charge controllers

Only need one battery connection and fuse. One thing to mount on wall.

Etc.

Mine isn't an aio but yeah, considerable time and money is spent when using multiple components.

 

[JRH]

Only need one battery connection and fuse. One thing to mount on wall.

Etc.

Mine isn't an aio but yeah, considerable time and money is spent when using multiple components.

I will agree that there is good merit to your point…

 

[Camginger]

Only need one battery connection and fuse. One thing to mount on wall.

Etc.

Mine isn't an aio but yeah, considerable time and money is spent when using multiple components.

LOL. Actually, my backup system is as simple as what you are describing: One inverter and my gas gen. LOL It's a small system with no fuse (but the fuse already on my batteries) and no breaker. But that's just a basic system just in case. But my bigger system is a bit more complex though.