Off grid people ill-prepared

[MurphyGuy]

And ... I think we're back to the usual issues in politics, the differences between the two dominant parties.

Huh?

 

[JeepHammer]

It's the learning curve that gets most people...

OFF GRID...
1. You produce (panels) in DC.
You store (Batteries) in DC.

You had better have a grasp of how to COMPLETE a DC circuit...
Seeing just battery cable terminals on every solar forum tells me most people don't have a grasp on DC circuits.

2. You produce & store in DC, it makes a crap load of sense to USE the power as DC instead of running it through an inverter with losses.

I'm aware this isn't always possible or practical since appliances are commonly AC and the DC versions are either crap or insanely expensive.

3. Spare parts are life for off grid systems.
When I expanded, got a bigger inverter, the old, smaller inverter is still bolted to the wall in parallel...
WHEN (not 'if') the primary inverter fails, it's a few wires, or the flip of a transfer switch to have power.
Reduced power is still power... The beer & bologna stays cold.

I install modular charge controllers in parallel sets that match the battery they are hooked to. Flip a switch and it's up and running again, THEN I can wait on a replacment to be delivered.

Amazon *May* deliver in 24 hours, but that's enough time for pipes to freeze and food to spoil, and no one wants to leave the toilet 24 hours before they can flush...

Modular components are SO MUCH CHEAPER, and non-propritary.
As long as it works for the function the manufacturer doesn't matter.

You battery won't care if the two charge controllers are different brands over time.
The inverter *May* come with a 'Cool' charge controller, but if that fails you have to send the entire inverter back...
That's a 6 week to 6 month turn around on warrenty work, *IF* it's still under warrenty...
A decent charge controller is $50-$125, that's pretty cheap insurance for the next 10 to 30 years.

'One Cool Box' with a 'Designer' name is something to show off to your geek friends.

A fully capable, modular system where every component can be replaced is reliability, and doubling is redundancy.
Reliability and redundancy beats 'Cool' every time when you will sit in the dark while all the food spoils without reliability and redundancy...

You all do what you think is best, I just want you to think it through for OFF GRID since YOU are the backup...

 

[ksmithaz1]

But in the US real life people are still being shot dead in huge numbers.
And no doubt even larger numbers are very severely wounded or crippled.

I doubt. Citation please. And correlate the numbers against total deaths in the statistical population. Define 'huge'. In Australia a huge number of people are killed by crocodiles. . . as compared to the US? Per capita? As compared to the number of crocodiles? If you want to make an argument I need solid numbers, and how they relate to the argument. In the US the handgun is the preferred method of suicide. There are just as many if not more suicides in other countries with more gun laws, people just do it without using a gun. So if I go off grid and live in the boonies with my Solar I'm going to want protection from things that may want to harm me. I could use a crossbow (I think they are actually illegal for hunting in Arizona) or build a laser, or a rail gun, but, I think I'd rather tear a page out of my ancestors books... A shotgun, and maybe a long gun or carbine.

It is a different mindset, and it's just a tool like any other tool.

 

[Warpspeed]

Gunshot deaths in USA 45,000 (2020). Population US 337 million (2020).
https://www.thetrace.org/2022/01/gun-violence-homicide-suicide-cdc-data-2020/
https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/us-population/
Population 3370 x 100,000. 45,000 divided by 3370 = 13.35 deaths per 100,000.

Australia gun deaths (2019) 229. Population 25.4 million (2021).
https://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/compareyears/10/total_number_of_gun_deaths
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/population/population-census/latest-release
Population 254 x 100,000. 229 divided by 254 = 1.02

So Americans are shooting each other (and themselves) dead at a rate about thirteen times higher than in Australia.
The Australian numbers have been falling for a number of years, and has now leveled off, even though the population is rising.

The numbers of shooting deaths in the US are rising ever more steeply.

The numbers are out there, pretty easy to look up.

 

[ksmithaz1]

2. You produce & store in DC, it makes a crap load of sense to USE the power as DC instead of running it through an inverter with losses.

Maybe. Say you get a solar powered mini-split. Now you are dedicating panels to it that may produce more than it needs. That energy is then lost. partially to your point things need to be 'modular', but that generally means compromising effiiciency somewhere.

'One Cool Box' with a 'Designer' name is something to show off to your geek friends.

Not necessarily. TCO is sometimes hard to calculate. I just spent $12K on a pair of 18K/12K fully integrated units. I had to rip out 5 5.6K cheaper units that simply were not up to the task, so $5000->$12000. Funny thing is it simplified the wiring and reduced the complexity dramatically. I'm glad now I ended up where I am. Something else I mentioned before, the more components you have the more likely it is one will fail, perhaps with less impact. If this were critical, I would buy a 3rd unit, and wire it in with a cross panel on the PV to allow me to move the inputs. Spending extra money to get esoteric DC appliances vs just beefing up the systems behind the AC loads. I think the latter is easier, less prone to failure, and requires fewer discrete components to make things work.

A fully capable, modular system where every component can be replaced is reliability, and doubling is redundancy.
Reliability and redundancy beats 'Cool' every time when you will sit in the dark while all the food spoils without reliability and redundancy...

You all do what you think is best, I just want you to think it through for OFF GRID since YOU are the backup...

This actually speaks more to buying the exact same thing and scaling it out. You start playing mix-n-match with components, something will trip you up. Plus the newer integrated stuff that is coming out now, is much better, and often less expensive than individual components to get the same job done. It's actually kind of exciting to see. I'd much rather manage a rack mounted 5KW battery with built in BMC, than 5K worth of batteries with a custom BMC connected to each cell, blah, blah. 5 years ago that was not a good option. Today, while it may cost you $1500 or so, you are going to end up with something likely to be much more reliable... At least once all the firmware is stable.

This stuff is really starting to get plug-n-chug.

 

[wattmatters]

The numbers are out there, pretty easy to look up.

Hey Warp - I wouldn't bother attempting to debate guns with Americans. It's lost cause. Leave 'em be.

We all know correlation is not causation. /sarcasm

 

[ksmithaz1]

The numbers of shooting deaths in the US are rising ever more steeply.

The numbers are out there, pretty easy to look up.

Death rate - The World Factbook

www.cia.gov

2023 Death rate / 1000 people:
Australia: 6.76
Canada: 8.17
United States: 8.42
UK: 9.12

The problem is you only look up one number, and these numbers invariably include suicide. In the use close to 1/2 of all suicides are by firearms, as are the majority of firearm related deaths. This is not typical for the rest of the world. The number of suicides has exploded in the US (well worldwide actually) since the COVID lockdowns. You've got to have a more detailed analysis, than just firearm related deaths / 100,000 vs other countries. More people died in the UK in 2023 than in the US, in fact in much of Europe. How about crime related death, disregarding the methodology? You can't just look at one method.

 

[Warpspeed]

I doubt if those 45,000 dead Americans with gunshot wounds were mostly suicides !!!

2023 has not been a normal year for any death statistics as you very well know.
For anything close to reality, you need to go back to before all this Covid nonsense.

And as we all know, the CIA would never possibly stretch the truth about anything.

 

[MurphyGuy]

Hey Warp - I wouldn't bother attempting to debate guns with Americans. It's lost cause. Leave 'em be.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Gunshot deaths in USA 45,000 (2020). Population US 337 million (2020).
https://www.thetrace.org/2022/01/gun-violence-homicide-suicide-cdc-data-2020/
https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/us-population/
Population 3370 x 100,000. 45,000 divided by 3370 = 13.35 deaths per 100,000.

Australia gun deaths (2019) 229. Population 25.4 million (2021).
https://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/compareyears/10/total_number_of_gun_deaths
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/population/population-census/latest-release
Population 254 x 100,000. 229 divided by 254 = 1.02

So Americans are shooting each other (and themselves) dead at a rate about thirteen times higher than in Australia.
The Australian numbers have been falling for a number of years, and has now leveled off, even though the population is rising.

The numbers of shooting deaths in the US are rising ever more steeply.

The numbers are out there, pretty easy to look up.

I just looked at your first “Reference “

Our Team

www.thetrace.org

Everyone a SJW.

This is your editor of GunPolicy.org
Hosted by Sydney University.

Edited by another Government stooge and SJW.

Staff Profile

www.sydney.edu.au

Anyone can manipulate date to look Ike what they want.


Where are your stats for Homicide, Suicide and ever other form of death in Australia.

So they don’t use a gun. Did they use a Knife, Hammer, lawnmower or did everyone suddenly become good moral people since the ban?

Provisional Mortality Statistics, Jan - Mar 2023

Provisional deaths data for measuring changes in patterns of mortality

www.abs.gov.au

There were 190,775 deaths which occurred in 2022. This is significantly higher than usual and is not considered to be a typical year for mortality in Australia. Therefore 2022 has not been included in the baseline average and is instead presented separately in graphs and tables.

Manipulating data. Hiding it in the larger pattern.

They also claim a higher death from Cardiac problems.
Wonder what would have caused that?

 

[Warpspeed]

This is all just so funny, keep it up guys.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

I doubt if those 45,000 dead Americans with gunshot wounds were mostly suicides !!!

Doubt all you want.

45,000 is 0.000136363636364 % total population.

You also ignore gang violence.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

This is all just so funny, keep it up guys.

No rebuttal eh? That’s what I thought.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Hey Warp - I wouldn't bother attempting to debate guns with Americans. It's lost cause. Leave 'em be.

We all know correlation is not causation. /sarcasm

View attachment 156181

One question.

Did everyone suddenly become upstanding citizens after the ban?

Homicides, Suicides just went away.

No more violence in Australia right?

Perfectly peaceful now. Right?

Nonsense.

And you have the Gall to quote statistics from CNN. Sure.

 

[Warpspeed]

Rebuttal of what ?
Are you saying that if some outlaw biker gang shoots you dead, that is somehow different than some little old lady patriot shooting you dead ?

 

[ksmithaz1]

I doubt if those 45,000 dead Americans with gunshot wounds were mostly suicides !!!

2023 has not been a normal year for any death statistics as you very well know.
For anything close to reality, you need to go back to before all this Covid nonsense.

And as we all know, the CIA would never possibly stretch the truth about anything.

Similar numbers on multiple web sites. Just overall deaths period. CDC and Johns hopkins raw data is interesting as well. Look at total deaths over the covid years vs previous years. Statistics are fun. They put in light rail here in phoenix, I don't remember exact dates but I do remember the intervals. The line was finished in January. The March headline in the local rag showed light rail ridership up over 300% from the prior month. One would hope so going from nothing. Perception is always the name of the game. Every year one or two kids drowns in this area. Tragic, but they have these huge campaigns about preventing needless drownings. Doesn't hold a candle to auto accidents but hey.... A million people died from covid. Average death rate only went up about 1/2 million, but I'm sure the overall rate was going to decline 1/2 million. It doesn't sell newspapers or clicks or whatever if you can't sensationalize it. Always follow the money.

 

[Bluedog225]

outrage porn

 

[ksmithaz1]

People who want to go completely off-grid have a tendancy to be more anarchist.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Rebuttal of what ?
Are you saying that if some outlaw biker gang shoots you dead, that is somehow different than some little old lady patriot shooting you dead ?

Good lord. How often is some old lady shooting up the town?

Gangs shoot each other and other people.
That all gets put in the statistics.

Most Law abiding US citizens are not out having a yee haw and racking up body count on the weekends for fun.

I haven’t shot anyone since I was in the army 100 years ago.

 

[Warpspeed]

You will NEVER understand the Australian mentality about preferring a safer quieter less violent society.

Aussies will NEVER understand the love affair Americans have with weapons of all types.