diy solar

diy solar

Problem with 280Ah pack - did I toast these batteries?

Thank you! Interesting - so I also have a Victron BMV - battery monitor - I was thinking that the BMV indication was less accurate than the BMS - but maybe I'm wrong?

BTW - full charge cycles are very low - like 5-7 cycles - these batteries are basically brand new.
On the two DALY 250 amp BMS I have they will not register amperage below about 3 amps, I figured that out when my compressor frig drew the battery down to about 10% while the BMS still showed 80% soc.
 
Good point - to my knowledge - the answer is NO. Max I can see from my screenshots is 3.616. Maybe the 3.97 is from another poster?

But coming back to the max capacity for the battery - has anyone seen the BMS (overkill solar) "reset" capacity to a lower number - by itself?

thanks, C
Sorry, I thought for sure you had said 3.97
Where did I get that?!

I see now it was [SIZE=17px]llubi[/SIZE] in post #14.

Sorry for th distraction.
 
Btw - here is my install - to tell the truth - if i pull these batteries to top balance them again - i’m likely to just order 2 x SOK 206ah and just call it good. It was fun to build these - and I’m pretty sure i did this by the book - but i want something that is not going to let me down when I’m on the road. :(

C
 

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Corbury, I don't think you have a failed battery. Top balanced cells are well balanced at the top, not so much at the bottom. Give the cells a few charge/discharge cycles to see if they come back in line at the top.

That's a sweet build you have there. A set of SOK batteries may not fit as well. Where are you located?
 
I would put an active balancer on before I stripped it down and re did the parallel top balance.

Have the charging voltages been posted? Consider 13.80 maximum until this is sorted out.
 
We use a Heltec 4s 5a active balancer on our cells. Works relatively quickly to reduce imbalances.

Couple of questions:

If you leave a Heltec active balancer actively working on cells that are not fully charged, say 50%, will it undue a top-balance?

Is it better to only activate the Heltec when cell voltages are above a certain threshold (i.e., 3.4v)?
You don't want to balance when the battery voltage is in the "flat" portion of the charge/discharge curve. It balances voltage, not capacity. You want to balance in the steeper portion of the curve where a small SOC change results in a large voltage change.

I'll only use mine when charging above 3.5V
 
I got the active balancers from china. check!

Here are my suggested next steps:
1. reconfigure the multi-plus to charge less aggressively from shore power - maybe 20A?
2. reset the BMV-712 to 100% once the batteries are fully charged. The BMV is the most accurate indicator of SOC for the batteries - correct? Not the BMS as I had previously supposed.
3. test with some actual loads
4. do 5-6 full cycles - are things actually working as planned?

if not - remove batteries and probably:
1. new bus bars (as suggested earlier).
2. add active load balancers - with some kind of switch? recommendations?
3. re-assemble (currently holding my head at the thought of this).
4. test

Thoughts? Thanks,

C
 
You don't want to balance when the battery voltage is in the "flat" portion of the charge/discharge curve. It balances voltage, not capacity. You want to balance in the steeper portion of the curve where a small SOC change results in a large voltage change.

I'll only use mine when charging above 3.5V
How are you controlling the Heltec's? Can you simply open the positive lead and they stop working or do you need a 5PST switch or relay to totally shut them down?
 
How are you controlling the Heltec's? Can you simply open the positive lead and they stop working or do you need a 5PST switch or relay to totally shut them down?
I mounted my 4S Heltec’s on the outside of my battery cases, so that I can disconnect them easily.

If you have PCB soldering skills (I do not), there is a place on the board where I assume you can install a connector, and then a switch.
 
I silicone glued mine to the top of the battery where I could slide off the connector but I wanted to remotely switch them off. So opening the negative stops any inter-cell current from the rest of the legs and is proven as well?
 
So opening the negative stops any inter-cell current from the rest of the legs and is proven as well?
One would hope so but battery level negative is available from the B- so its "possible" that opening wire 1 does not do what you want. That's on the BMS maker whether there are shenanigans inside.
 
its "possible" that opening wire 1 does not do what you want.
If anyone figures this out, how to shut down the whole function of the Heltec by disconnecting only one wire, then please post it here. (I could do it by disconnecting either/or the pos/neg and doing a clamp-meter amp-test during a heavy charge but I am about 6 months behind now on my task schedule.) I have been running with my Helecs disconnected after I assume finally getting them top balanced. To repeat the story, the cells I purchased were sold as top balanced but weren't. I'd already mounted them, way over budget and didn't want to order a shop power supply, so while the BMS had the top cut-off at 3.65, I just set the low resume voltage up from 3.45 to 3.63 and after a day on a 14.6 camper lead/acid charger the low-lagging cell that would never go over 3.5V finally slowly crept up to 3.63, which I offically called "done". This charge-fest was also with the assistance of 10A worth of Heltek activine balancing (2 in parallel). So after getting my problem lagging voltage cell up to this new almost-perfect balance, I found that after only one cycle they are close enough together to show I no longer have a problem. Right now I unplugged the Heltecs and am running without them because the cells are all staying remarkably balanced through a cycle but that's just with 30A worth of solar. It may be a different story when I hit them again with the 70A 14.6V to do an almost-quick boost-charge.
 
If anyone figures this out, how to shut down the whole function of the Heltec by disconnecting only one wire, then please post it here.
I read back up a ways and think I may have misspoken. I think my comments would only apply to how a BMS might work without the negative balance lead connected because a BMS also has a B- wire.

Your Heltec, 4S with only 5 wires, would definitely stop doing anything with the negative open/switched off.
 
I thought Heltech had a jumper for switching the function off. I would far prefer to used the designed feature to shut down.
Then again maybe the negative wire connects across the jumper and is the exact same.
 
UPDATE - i changed the settings for the Multiplus down from 100A charging to 40A charging - and the batteries like it much much better. I'm going to wait on the active load balancers until I use the system a while. Thanks everyone.
 
UPDATE - i changed the settings for the Multiplus down from 100A charging to 40A charging - and the batteries like it much much better. I'm going to wait on the active load balancers until I use the system a while. Thanks everyone.
It is a bit ironic that those bullet points for going to "lithium" seem to decrease as we get further along into our builds. At the top of the list for recent years has been "charge at 1x output and be done in no time" to what we see today, "add an expensive B2B converter and be happy with 40A", which is hard to take if you just disconnected a lead/acid bank that was charging at 60A LOL.
 
Thank you! Interesting - so I also have a Victron BMV - battery monitor - I was thinking that the BMV indication was less accurate than the BMS - but maybe I'm wrong?

BTW - full charge cycles are very low - like 5-7 cycles - these batteries are basically brand new.
I have a Victron bmv-700, a Victron Smart solar 150/100 cc, and 2 jbd BMS on two 280ah packs@12v in parallel. Right this second, at low pv input, they are all within .03v of each other, but at other times, they seem to vary widely. During initial setup, I adjusted my settings to compensate for these variances, but now that I have no real inconsistencies, I guess I will have to pay more attention, and possibly adjust my settings again:/ Regardless, my cc is my primary control. It shuts off charging so that the BMS does not have to. Previously, I had a lesser charge controller, and a 100ah LiFePo4 pack, and the Daly BMS did all charging cutoffs, and that thing was switching on and off constantly through the day, and it was a non-issue.
 
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