Simple EV conversion for older vehicles

[BlueMarblePA]

I have been bitten by the solar bug. Starting with 4 panels on my shed in September 2022, I have completed installation of Grid Tie Solaredge 7.6kw inverter, and am enjoying the harvesting of free energy!

I am now thinking about my next project, and I am thinking about how to convert ICE vehicle to electric.

This guy has a simple solution that is more my style, as I do not think I have the capabilities to create custom mounts, etc. Has anybody considered something like this?

The converted car uses a single 6kW, 72V BLDC motor connected to a 350A Kelly Controller. In the trunk, you will find the 72V 100Ah Lithium Ferrophosphate (LFP) battery.

I was wondering whether I could use EG4 48V LiFePO4 batteries.

Please be gentle, as I know nothing about EV conversions, and I recognize that home power storage is very different from the torque needed to move a vehicle!

 

[time2roll]

Voltage is probably an issue. Need to verify with Kelly and BLDC on how the components would work on low voltage. Or high voltage for that matter if two EG4s were put in series at 96v.
Certainly possible to build your own 72v battery.

 

[BlueMarblePA]

Voltage is probably an issue. Need to verify with Kelly and BLDC on how the components would work on low voltage. Or high voltage for that matter if two EG4s were put in series at 96v.
Certainly possible to build your own 72v battery.

This guy's teaching has been helpful. Seems like Voltage/Amphrs and then Capacity in Amps is all important in designing the battery. This is all dependent on the motor and the controller. Lots to learn.

 

[D71]

I think you would be better off with a used EV. The chevy volt has a used tag of $9000-$20,000 when I searched. It has a major company backing it and service parts. If you want something like an ev.
what is shown in the video was admitted carried out by a very experienced mechanic. It is most likely not practical for most needs here for power and mileage needs and concerns. If you are in listed USA - PA

There are forums and such dedicated to ppl taking Tesla ev components and adapting them to older ICE Again this is not for faint of heart, It takes skills, tools, a shop, and can be considerably more expensive then bargained for to convert.

Taking an ICE vehicle engine and applying all the drive force to front of a converted engine crankshaft is asking for trouble. I have built a couple supercharged engines that snapped the end of the crankshaft off. Cast cranks are a no no. Experience and failures are expensive. School hard knocks sucks. Granted the guy states he is only making 8 hp. But his process is using part of the former ice. Oiling system has to be run for crankshaft.

I would look at using salvage ev components. Do you have shop, tools like welders, and mechanical skills? Granted we all start somewhere. When you do things like in this video you are basically in new frontier and a steep learning curve is coming. Again the video admits an experienced automotive mech did the work. If you have decent budget and time to learn go for it.

Notice they take time to talk about 12 volt battery importance…. Most all ev have a 12 volt battery. Some like kia have a known issue with keeping 12 volt battery charged. A major company has problems so you as an individual can expect to have set backs and even more troubles. Just a heads up

if you want dependable more reliable with parts easier to get would buy used. Make sure you are not looking at a battery replacement with used…. They cost a boat load money….to replace…out of pocket

just my opinion

 

[D71]

Article on cheapest pure ev …. 2023

https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/advice/cheapest-electric-cars

It says average car price is around $50 k But a cheap ev can be had for under $30k that to my knowledge would be something like chevy bolt or a kia type. There is a post on here of a $10k ev coming from china

EV under $10k USD with Sodium Ion Batteries???

Not sure how true this is, not like we haven't had false reports before about cheap EVs or sodium batteries. The Seagull hatch is reported to launch in China in the second quarter (April to June inclusive) of 2023, starting from ¥60,000 yuan (A$12,500) with the sodium-ion battery providing up...

diysolarforum.com

 

[BlueMarblePA]

I think you would be better off with a used EV. The chevy volt has a used tag of $9000-$20,000 when I searched. It has a major company backing it and service parts. If you want something like an ev.
what is shown in the video was admitted carried out by a very experienced mechanic. It is most likely not practical for most needs here for power and mileage needs and concerns. If you are in listed USA - PA

There are forums and such dedicated to ppl taking Tesla ev components and adapting them to older ICE Again this is not for faint of heart, It takes skills, tools, a shop, and can be considerably more expensive then bargained for to convert.

Taking an ICE vehicle engine and applying all the drive force to front of a converted engine crankshaft is asking for trouble. I have built a couple supercharged engines that snapped the end of the crankshaft off. Cast cranks are a no no. Experience and failures are expensive. School hard knocks sucks. Granted the guy states he is only making 8 hp. But his process is using part of the former ice. Oiling system has to be run for crankshaft.

I would look at using salvage ev components. Do you have shop, tools like welders, and mechanical skills? Granted we all start somewhere. When you do things like in this video you are basically in new frontier and a steep learning curve is coming. Again the video admits an experienced automotive mech did the work. If you have decent budget and time to learn go for it.

Notice they take time to talk about 12 volt battery importance…. Most all ev have a 12 volt battery. Some like kia have a known issue with keeping 12 volt battery charged. A major company has problems so you as an individual can expect to have set backs and even more troubles. Just a heads up

if you want dependable more reliable with parts easier to get would buy used. Make sure you are not looking at a battery replacement with used…. They cost a boat load money….to replace…out of pocket

just my opinion

I am completely a newbie, and I am completely in over my head! I should heed your warning and abandon the project idea.

However,... this is exactly how I felt when I started thinking about drilling holes in my roof and wiring solar into my panel. Of course, I am recognizing some serious differences (very high voltage DC batteries with lots of potential) and major torque/force through heavy vehicles.

I will keep reading and learning and hoping somebody can make this easier.

 

[D71]

I am completely a newbie, and I am completely in over my head! I should heed your warning and abandon the project idea.

However,... this is exactly how I felt when I started thinking about drilling holes in my roof and wiring solar into my panel. Of course, I am recognizing some serious differences (very high voltage DC batteries with lots of potential) and major torque/force through heavy vehicles.

I will keep reading and learning and hoping somebody can make this easier.

Make sure you will be able to operate it on you roads if that is the intent. There were laws passed in some states to limit and restrict bicycle converted ev. So if they went after bicycle conversions might be auto restrictions too. Vehicles have to meet certain safety standards to operate on public roads ….. India or where ever he was is much more relaxed.
I had to have a motorcycle State inspected after I assembled it from parts to get it certified by the State where I lived at that time.… component like engine, frame and transmission had to be run for serial numbers too. Just another heads up for your State to check. Keep receipts.

by reusing the ice block you retain the serial number as done in your video. Make sure the title for vehicle is clean. If it requires cert due to salvage title you will probably never pass with an ev conversion.

the ev makers don’t want competition

 

[aenyc]

What you are attempting to do is likely not feasible, unless you have years of experience working with high voltage electrical systems and specifically batteries and charge controllers.
Lithium Batteries (of all kinds) need special software to manage charge and discharge cycles, and these are highly customized to the load (motor et all) that ride on these batteries. Small mistake, and your batteries will have a thermal runaway (improperly managed charge or discharge) which will result in a pretty bad fire or worse.
In other words, unless you are a pro (which if you were, you would not be asking questions here), is simply not feasible.

 

[BlueMarblePA]

What you are attempting to do is likely not feasible, unless you have years of experience working with high voltage electrical systems and specifically batteries and charge controllers.
Lithium Batteries (of all kinds) need special software to manage charge and discharge cycles, and these are highly customized to the load (motor et all) that ride on these batteries. Small mistake, and your batteries will have a thermal runaway (improperly managed charge or discharge) which will result in a pretty bad fire or worse.
In other words, unless you are a pro (which if you were, you would not be asking questions here), is simply not feasible.

Yeah. The more I read and learn, the more I realize how difficult this is. Maybe I will start with just a golf cart

 

[teal95]

Good idea. Start by converting a golf cart to lithium.

 

[BlueMarblePA]

Good idea. Start by converting a golf cart to lithium.

Another thought is to convert a vw beetle to ev, using the complete kits that are available from ev west, for example. Has anyone done this?

 

[D71]

Another thought is to convert a vw beetle to ev, using the complete kits that are available from ev west, for example. Has anyone done this?

You are getting warmer. Usually a kit means you can get support and are in a herd mentality for group problem solving. Other ppl will be in same boat. Again you will need shop and tools.

Do you already have an old VW?
Most ppl don’t know history behind the vw beetle. It was a simple yet Great auto design Probably one of the longest running production cars on planet. It was made in South America up to around year 2000 or so. Hitler was a genius for assigning……Ferdinand Porsche to make the people’s car and thus out did himself. The VW Beetle became an automotive ICON loved around the World.

The VW Beetle: How Hitler’s idea became a design icon

An idea that came from Hitler would become the best-selling car of all time. Jonathan Glancey explains our enduring love for the Volkswagen Beetle.

www.bbc.com

””Volkswagen VW Beetle/Bug EV Conversion Complete Kit, Regen Brakes, Battery Packs 1956-1977
[EVW-BTL-KIT]

Price: $19,278.64​

The EV West VW Super Beetle Kit is very unique in the fact that it truly is a turn-key kit. The components were carefully picked out to be the best available for the Beetle, and fit and finish have been refined. This kit comes with everything you need right down to the heat shrink tubing, and fuse holders. Battery enclosures sold separately. This complete kit will deliver 90 miles safe driving distance, and will charge to full in a little under 8 hours. The power delivery is about 173 pounds of instant torque, and its top speed is 100 mph, definitely fun to drive.”’

Volkswagen VW Beetle/Bug EV Conversion Complete Kit, Regen Brakes, Battery Packs 1956-1977, EV West - Electric Vehicle Parts, Components, EVSE Charging Stations, Electric Car Conversion Kits

Those are interesting specs.
One of the videos states it takes 1-2 weeks to convert. I think it would be an interesting conversion - old car gets a new life. I do not see any heat or cooling features…. so creature comforts are not there. Of course cooling and heating were skinny on old vw. I bet in PA you will need a heater and defroster.

I think some new EV are in ~$30,000 range. That kit is listed at $19,278.64 and I bet you will still need other things and materials - it is estimated take 1-2 weeks to convert.

I considered doing an old VW Beetle Van engine swap with a Subaru engine but it is costly and takes time too. The original VW air cooled engine were only around 36hp or so. Of course hp went up over the years but not drastically. So a Subaru or that electric conversion would be significant improvement for original power. The Subaru engine converted VW Vans actually go up in value because ppl want to drive them everywhere. Van Life culture caused prices to soar.

it is interesting for an EV conversion. I would not build it nor depend on it as my daily driver

 

[BlueMarblePA]

You are getting warmer. Usually a kit means you can get support and are in a herd mentality for group problem solving. Other ppl will be in same boat. Again you will need shop and tools.

Do you already have an old VW?
Most ppl don’t know history behind the vw beetle. It was a simple yet Great auto design Probably one of the longest running production cars on planet. It was made in South America up to around year 2000 or so. Hitler was a genius for assigning……Ferdinand Porsche to make the people’s car and thus out did himself. The VW Beetle became an automotive ICON loved around the World.

The VW Beetle: How Hitler’s idea became a design icon

An idea that came from Hitler would become the best-selling car of all time. Jonathan Glancey explains our enduring love for the Volkswagen Beetle.

www.bbc.com

””Volkswagen VW Beetle/Bug EV Conversion Complete Kit, Regen Brakes, Battery Packs 1956-1977
[EVW-BTL-KIT]

Price: $19,278.64​

The EV West VW Super Beetle Kit is very unique in the fact that it truly is a turn-key kit. The components were carefully picked out to be the best available for the Beetle, and fit and finish have been refined. This kit comes with everything you need right down to the heat shrink tubing, and fuse holders. Battery enclosures sold separately. This complete kit will deliver 90 miles safe driving distance, and will charge to full in a little under 8 hours. The power delivery is about 173 pounds of instant torque, and its top speed is 100 mph, definitely fun to drive.”’

Volkswagen VW Beetle/Bug EV Conversion Complete Kit, Regen Brakes, Battery Packs 1956-1977, EV West - Electric Vehicle Parts, Components, EVSE Charging Stations, Electric Car Conversion Kits

Those are interesting specs.
One of the videos states it takes 1-2 weeks to convert. I think it would be an interesting conversion - old car gets a new life. I do not see any heat or cooling features…. so creature comforts are not there. Of course cooling and heating were skinny on old vw. I bet in PA you will need a heater and defroster.

I think some new EV are in ~$30,000 range. That kit is listed at $19,278.64 and I bet you will still need other things and materials - it is estimated take 1-2 weeks to convert.

I considered doing an old VW Beetle Van engine swap with a Subaru engine but it is costly and takes time too. The original VW air cooled engine were only around 36hp or so. Of course hp went up over the years but not drastically. So a Subaru or that electric conversion would be significant improvement for original power. The Subaru engine converted VW Vans actually go up in value because ppl want to drive them everywhere. Van Life culture caused prices to soar.

it is interesting for an EV conversion. I would not build it nor depend on it as my daily driver

Yes. This is exactly the road that I am going down.
Many problems that I can foresee

1. I don't have a garage/lift/shop. I may try to erect a temporary carport and do work outside. I have friends with lifts and tools who will become my best friends if I do this In fact, one of my friends owns https://www.whittamengineering.com/ who specializes in Land Rover EV conversions, and so I will have to lean on him quite a bit.
2. I am going to spend some time studying batteries in the next few weeks. I realize this is the biggest expense of an EV, and it is the most dangerous part. I need to understand C rates and how to build batteries from cells, even if I just buy the EVwest kit.
3. I am interested in some special unique ideas, including heat pump rather than conventional AC/heater.
4. I want to see if I can add some kind of vehicle to grid charging capability to the EVWest kit.

Lots to keep learning and researching and planning. I doubt I will jump into this for a few months -- maybe a full year.

Also, I don't have a VW for conversion either. Am carefully thinking about super beetle (larger but McPherson struts and better handling) versus classic VW (conversion kit fits right in without modifications).