Unboxing of Deye 16K Hybrid Inverter

[robby]

I have a SunnyBoy 2500U 240VAC inverter here. The line connections are made like this:
L1 -> L inverter
L2 -> N label on inverter but manual says to connect L2 to N labeled connector
Gnd -> Gnd on inverter.

This inverter does not need a neutral.

So how is the circuit completed without a Neutral from the input side to the output side when using grid power?

 

[Sebanavila]

Here's how I intend to wire up for Split-Phase 120V~240V 60 HZ application.

View attachment 121002
16K LOAD output L N wired to the Victron 100A Autotransformer L N 100A double pole circuit breaker
View attachment 120996
Victron 100A Autotransformer ?


Earlier this year, there's a big discussion about installing of the Growatt ES500 with SolarEdge 5KW Autotransformer and the issues of Ground Bonding issues. Questions of Losing the Neutral when the Autotransformer is down and damages that will be cause to all 120Vs circuit breaker on the LOAD panel, suddenly becoming 240V and damage/frying to all 120V connected appliance. There were suggestions of using 2 Autotransformer and using relays to monitor the Neutral line and so on. Just a complex mess and no real solution to the problem when loosing the Neutral wire.

Well, in my application, with a larger 24K Autotransformer load balancing the LOAD output of the Deye 16K's 16KW, The LOAD panel will be wired directly from the Victron's output L1, L2 and N terminals. As such if the Victron or the Deye 16K is down, all circuits on the LOAD panel will be down automatically, period. No damage will be caused to both the 240V and 120V circuits. The Victron has a built in Earth/Ground relay, allowing for Neutral to Ground bonding. Simple and Elegant solution to a Chicken or an Egg problem ???

That is the way to go, BIG OR GO HOME!!!! Nice set up, and you can always add more.

 

[Cheap 4-life]

Most state rebate, and SREC programs require 1 UL listing and 2 an inverter on the California approved inverter list and Deye isn’t on the list. So factor those programs in and the Deye isn’t saving a dime and if you do this your leaving money on the table.

Still $1600 saved at the very very least

 

[Cheap 4-life]

Deye is best for offgrid/grid assisted with no feedback/selling.
Sol-Ark is best for On-Grid/GridTied with feedback.

How are the 2 inverters any different in this regard. My understanding is that the features are the same

 

[Cheap 4-life]

That it is not Split Face, that is called biphase. Those two 120 volts legs are (correction 90 degrees and not 180) apart so between the two you have 240 VAC.

How do you know the legs are not 180 degrees apart?

 

[Lt.Dan]

How are the 2 inverters any different in this regard. My understanding is that the features are the same

I guess geologically, my answer would differ. In the US, the Deye is not allowed to backfeed the grid, since it does not have the UL certifications required to pass inspections. So in this case, absolutely save the money, and buy one if you are not planning on backfeeding the grid, and only using it as an "off-grid" inverter.

The Sol-Ark can give you everything you need with certifications, so it is best in that regard.

I think this distinction puts the 2 inverters in different classes, even though they can "technically" do the same thing, they cannot legally.

If my understanding is incorrect, please let me know, as I am here to learn. This is just my point of view.

 

[robby]

Still $1600 saved at the very very least

$1600 Saved but whats lost.

You cannot Grid Tie it Legally so you lose all of those benefits.
No Customer Support vs Great Customer support with Sol-Ark.
No Warranty vs a 10 Year Warranty.
Firmware that is Reliable and Updated Monthly.
Really Good Monitoring Software.
Additional Firmware features that Sol-Ark has added.

Anyway it all depends on much value you put on a $1600 saving on this size of an investment.
For me the Warranty and Customer Support alone are worth the money.

 

[Cheap 4-life]

I guess geologically, my answer would differ. In the US, the Deye is not allowed to backfeed the grid, since it does not have the UL certifications required to pass inspections. So in this case, absolutely save the money, and buy one if you are not planning on backfeeding the grid, and only using it as an "off-grid" inverter.

The Sol-Ark can give you everything you need with certifications, so it is best in that regard.

I think this distinction puts the 2 inverters in different classes, even though they can "technically" do the same thing, they cannot legally.

If my understanding is incorrect, please let me know, as I am here to learn. This is just my point of view.

I suppose if the individual already passed inspection with a previous inverter and wanted a new inverter then there wouldn’t necessarily be a reinspection. but yeah not recommended

 

[Cheap 4-life]

$1600 Saved but whats lost.

You cannot Grid Tie it Legally so you lose all of those benefits.
No Customer Support vs Great Customer support with Sol-Ark.
No Warranty vs a 10 Year Warranty.
Firmware that is Reliable and Updated Monthly.
Really Good Monitoring Software.
Additional Firmware features that Sol-Ark has added.

Anyway it all depends on much value you put on a $1600 saving on this size of an investment.
For me the Warranty and Customer Support alone are worth the money.

Agreed, but when we could get the splitphase version a lot of what you said didnt apply.. it’s a shame

 

[robby]

Agreed, but when we could get the splitphase version a lot of what you said didnt apply.. it’s a shame

Actually every point I made still applies. Go down the list and point out one thing that is different.
Even the Grid tie ability would still be useless because the inverter cannot pass inspection. Getting rid of the Transformer expense might be the only benefit.

 

[Cheap 4-life]

$1600 Saved but whats lost.

You cannot Grid Tie it Legally so you lose all of those benefits.
No Customer Support vs Great Customer support with Sol-Ark.
No Warranty vs a 10 Year Warranty.
Firmware that is Reliable and Updated Monthly.
Really Good Monitoring Software.
Additional Firmware features that Sol-Ark has added.

Anyway it all depends on much value you put on a $1600 saving on this size of an investment.
For me the Warranty and Customer Support alone are worth the money.

Actually every point I made still applies. Go down the list and point out one thing that is different.
Even the Grid tie ability would still be useless because the inverter cannot pass inspection. Getting rid of the Transformer expense might be the only benefit.

Can the split phase deye not be legally Grid tied? It’s the same as the SolArk for every reason that would make a difference for being grid tied..
Is there not any length of warranty For the deye?
I have heard of a few people having fruitful conversations/customer support from over seas.
does deye not have monitoring capabilities?
which firmware features does SolArk have that deye doesn’t?

regardless it’s still a shame. The deye splitphase would work perfectly fine for many circumstances and ALOT cheaper..

 

[Danke]

$1600 Saved but whats lost.

You cannot Grid Tie it Legally so you lose all of those benefits.
No Customer Support vs Great Customer support with Sol-Ark.
No Warranty vs a 10 Year Warranty.
Firmware that is Reliable and Updated Monthly.
Really Good Monitoring Software.
Additional Firmware features that Sol-Ark has added.

Anyway it all depends on much value you put on a $1600 saving on this size of an investment.
For me the Warranty and Customer Support alone are worth the money.

I think the Deye w/transformer is around $3K cheaper.

+Transformer $660 with shipping.


I received a Sol-Ark for $8,100, no sales tax or shipping charge. So $5670 after FTC.

So for 16K: ($3298 + $660) -30% = $2842

So difference for me would be $2828.

 

[robby]

Can the split phase deye not be legally Grid tied? It’s the same as the SolArk for every reason that would make a difference for being grid tied..
Is there not any length of warranty For the deye?

It's not UL Listed so a Split Phase Deye would have the same issues as a Victron.

I have heard of a few people having fruitful conversations/customer support from over seas.

I have been told that Deye won't even get into a conversation about the Inverter if it is in the USA. Warranty service from them is hard enough when your in Africa or other areas they are allowed to distribute in. Outside of those areas your on your own. I guess if you can ship it to a friend in China he can then send it to them and they will be none the wiser.

does deye not have monitoring capabilities?

Yes it does but it's not nearly as comprehensive as Powerview.

which firmware features does SolArk have that deye doesn’t?

Sol-Ark has been updating their Firmware with new features and bug fixes at least once if not twice per month. You can count the number of total Deye updates on one hand over the last 2 years. As for the features, you asked me this in another thread and I listed some of them. Seasonal Shifting of TOU usage is one, I think Generator exercising was another, Support for Numerous other LFP batteries manufactures was another. I cannot remember all the stuff they have added off the top of my head.

regardless it’s still a shame. The deye splitphase would work perfectly fine for many circumstances and ALOT cheaper..

Cheaper with no customer support is great until the day comes when you do need customer support. It's been my experience that day is inevitable. When it does come you will sit there pounding sand just hoping that someone on a Forum can fix your problem.

 

[Cheap 4-life]

It's not UL Listed so a Split Phase Deye would have the same issues as a Victron.

Thread 'DEYE Inverter UL Listed available in US'
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/deye-inverter-ul-listed-available-in-us.13942/
maybe my mistake. I thought they were UL listed

 

[Cheap 4-life]

I have been told that Deye won't even get into a conversation about the Inverter if it is in the USA. Warranty service from them is hard enough when your in Africa or other areas they are allowed to distribute in. Outside of those areas your on your own. I guess if you can ship it to a friend in China he can then send it to them and they will be none the wiser.

I have heard both ways, good and bad communication. But I guess knowing chinglish would help

 

[Cheap 4-life]

Yes it does but it's not nearly as comprehensive as Powerview.

Might be good enough for most people? And like myself I use iotawatt

 

[Cheap 4-life]

Sol-Ark has been updating their Firmware with new features and bug fixes at least once if not twice per month. You can count the number of total Deye updates on one hand over the last 2 years. As for the features, you asked me this in another thread and I listed some of them. Seasonal Shifting of TOU usage is one, I think Generator exercising was another, Support for Numerous other LFP batteries manufactures was another. I cannot remember all the stuff they have added off the top of my head.

are all those updates necessary? Many have the Deye and have no complaints. TOU is of no use to me and probably no use to most users but I can see how for some it’s absolutely needed.. I wouldn’t be interested in generator stuff either. Doesn’t the deye/SolArk already allow all battery chemistries to be used? Or are you just referring to communications between the battery/inverter, which again I dont think is absolutely necessary, I wouldn’t need it..

 

[Cheap 4-life]

But for the record I’d pay $1600 more and get a SolArk, but not if it would be much more of a difference than that. But maybe that’s because I’m Cheap

 

[robby]

Thread 'DEYE Inverter UL Listed available in US'
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/deye-inverter-ul-listed-available-in-us.13942/
maybe my mistake. I thought they were UL listed

Nah it's not UL listed. They have no intention of selling them in the States so it would make no sense to spend all that money.

 

[robby]

are all those updates necessary? Many have the Deye and have no complaints. TOU is of no use to me and probably no use to most users but I can see how for some it’s absolutely needed.. I wouldn’t be interested in generator stuff either. Doesn’t the deye/SolArk already allow all battery chemistries to be used? Or are you just referring to communications between the battery/inverter, which again I dont think is absolutely necessary, I wouldn’t need it..

My system would be severely crippled without TOU. It is probably one of the number one features that attracted me to SA.

As for Battery communication, yes I am talking about batteries that have full two way communication in closed loop mode with the SA.
This means that SA has actually written code inside the Firmware that speaks only to this Mfg Battery Pack and will allow the battery to make realtime changes to the SA charging and discharging parameters. With EG4, SOK etc it's just a generic link where the Battery just sends it's SOC and Voltage to the Inverter.