What can we do for heat?

[SamDeleted]

I know people make gas bottle stoves for a few hundred but I guess they would be more inclined to smoke up the living space being less high tech?

You'd be surprised, it's more about the design of the chimney than the fire itself. Modern chimneys don't draw like they did in the good old days

I grew up in a Victorian house, 2 big well designed chimney with proper cranks in them, they drew like MAD. Even in summer with no fire lit, if you threw a piece of paper on , WHOOSH straight up and out the top of the 3 story high chimney (we never struggled with smoke in that house, a good chimney draw PULLS the smoke away)

 

[SamDeleted]

I think that is an over simplification. It isnt about the fuel but how well the burning device is contained, in any case, regardless of fuel source. Paraffin is refined as you say but known to stink because the fumes are expelled in the living space when speaking of the old style paraffin heaters.

Diesel heaters, popular today, are said to be good because they combust in a chamber which doesnt come in the living space and expel the bad smells and other nastiness. I imagine, and have read, that good wood burners work in a similar fashion, isolating the burning from the living space. Not totally the same since you have to add fuel as you go which will allow some to come out, but it is not the same case you are stating about fuel refinement being the only consideration.

If you haven't already, you should spend some time caring for a real fire, a relatives house? Or an airb&b , see how you handle it ??

I'd invite you over, but if you can't stand smoke you're not going to have much fun at my house ?

 

[Gueyog8a7]

Its a tough call, and ultimately one you will have to make for yourself



If you are sensitive to smoke you might struggle... Have you spent time with a real fire? Although a good chimney takes 99% of all smoke out the room, you will ALWAYS get some into the room, often a little puff when you open the door. Do keep in mind, wood smoke is a lot nicer smell than cigarettes smoke , a lot less pervasive

You also get plenty of dust. For me , I am happy with it all this, I've never lived with anything else but a real fire, and the benefits outway the costs . Fire is essentially our only the traditional heat source, Humans have lived with fires for 1,000s of years, every other source of heat is new & novel in the grand scheme


Ask yourself this, do you really want to have to light a fire everytime you want to boil a kettle? or cook beans on toast? Cooking with a real fire forces you to take a more holistic, slow approach to life, no 'on demand' convenience like we are so used to..

Price for a log burner install is anywhere from £500 DIY to a couple of grand professionally installed.




I mean no offense, don't mean to sound rude, but after reading your post, I really don't think a log fire is for you. go for LPG , I think it's a much better option for someone with your particular needs. LPG is almost completely odourless, and so long as you have adequate ventilation the fumes shouldn't be an issue either



Btw a propex LPG heater is often a better option than a desiel night heater, similar idea but cleaner burning, more reliable - they come up cheap second hand on eBay

HS2000 blown air heater C/W Digital thermostat • Propex Leisure

HS2000 blown air heater fuelled from Propane, Butane or LPG gas

www.propexleisure.co.uk

I have no issue at all with it taking longer and less convenience. That is part and parcel of vanlife is it not? I know there are a lot of glampers who would say no but for me I am a super minimalist. I am in a transit connect which should give you a good idea of that!

If smoke is indeed still an issue, no matter the design quality, that does rule it out for me.

What is wrong with other heat sources being novel? Traditional doesnt mean better. I know there is the romanticism aspect but a lot of things are traditional which are also barbaric - murdering other tribes, slavery and on and on.

We are also on a solar forum so I presume you embrace novel things to some degree?

I am only playing devils advocate and indeed do agree a simpler life is a lot better in a lot of cases but traditional doesnt mean better as a rule.

Yea I have seen propex ones too. I am not that interested in gas really due to lack of space again and costly installtion of lpg/autogas tankj and lack of availaibility. It just seems simpler to have all in one fuel source since the van already runs on diesel and I would just fill an extra jerry can for the heating and cooking.

Diesel is not clean but it is contained, as mentioned in previous post, so comparing wood vs diesel heaters is not like for like there in terms of being dirty. The fumes should not enter the living compartment at all, well minute amounts maybe, with diesel heaters whereas with wood it is gonna come in when adding to it.

 

[Gueyog8a7]

If you haven't already, you should spend some time caring for a real fire, a relatives house? Or an airb&b , see how you handle it ??

I'd invite you over, but if you can't stand smoke you're not going to have much fun at my house ?

Funnily enough I did grow up in a B&B which my mum ran in the 80/90s in rural wales. 3 stories probably victorian as you say so probably very similar to you and the newspaper in the unlit fire does ring a bell.

So I suppose I have more experience than most on that. We also had a big rayburn in the back for central heating and I would sit on the stove tops (covered of course) much to my mums protesting.

 

[SamDeleted]

What is wrong with other heat sources being novel? Traditional doesnt mean better. I know there is the romanticism aspect but a lot of things are traditional which are also barbaric - murdering other tribes, slavery and on and on.

We are also on a solar forum so I presume you embrace novel things to some degree?

Novel means new, new means unreliable, they could shut the taps on petroleum products today, a lot people in this country would freeze to death by the end winter . But so long as there's trees growing & God gives me strength, me & family be warm in winter sat by a ranging fire



"traditional which are also barbaric - murdering other tribes, slavery and on and on."

Sadly still happens to this day all over the world, we still murder other tribes , it just happens our weapons are now a lot bigger, more sophisticated and more deadly



"We are also on a solar forum so I presume you embrace novel things to some degree?"

I'm a bit of a solar luddite, lead acid batteries, PWM controller. Proven old technology, nothing cutting edge

Funnily enough I did grow up in a B&B which my mum ran in the 90s in rural wales. 3 stories probably victorian as you say so probably very similar to you and the newpaper in the unlight fire does ring a bell.

So I suppose I have more experience than most on that. We also had a big rayburn in the back for central heating and I would sit on the stove tops (covered of course) much to my mums protesting.

Hmm , a properly fitted fire isn't an issue 99% of the time , you might well be able to live with one ?? of course it's up to you

 

[Gueyog8a7]

Novel means new, new means unreliable, they could shut the taps on petroleum products today, a lot people in this country would freeze to death by the end winter . But so long as there's trees growing & God gives me strength, me & family be warm in winter sat by a ranging fire



"traditional which are also barbaric - murdering other tribes, slavery and on and on."

Sadly still happens to this day all over the world, we still murder other tribes , it just happens our weapons are now a lot bigger, more sophisticated and more deadly



"We are also on a solar forum so I presume you embrace novel things to some degree?"

I'm a bit of a solar luddite, lead acid batteries, PWM controller. Proven old technology, nothing cutting edge




Hmm , a properly fitted fire isn't an issue 99% of the time , you might well be able to live with one ?? of course it's up to you

Going into philosophy now but..

I have been down this thought process before too, in a quest for ultimate self sufficiency, but at some point you have to accept some interaction with humans no?

Someone made a good point that being a "prepper" style survivalist requires you to be in peak fitness and if you had an accident while out in the wilds you are pretty much going to have to rely on some support. Or you plan to have everything sources in house? No reliance of pharmaceuticals or densitry or the like? That pretty much puts you back to victorian era or further and just looking at victorian health standards doesnt paint a pretty picture.

Just the other month a filling of mine broke and I was really annoyed at letting it happen and how I was going to have to rely on a dentist to fix it.

 

[SamDeleted]

That pretty much puts you back to victorian era or further and just looking at victorian health standards doesnt paint a pretty picture.

Packed in tightly to smokey coal powered cities, eating nothing but bread and sugar , no wonder they had poor health outcomes ?

Someone made a good point that being a "prepper" style survivalist requires you to be in peak fitness and if you had an accident while out in the wilds you are pretty much going to have to rely on some support. Or you plan to have everything sources in house? No reliance of pharmaceuticals or densitry or the like? That pretty much puts you back to victorian era or further and just looking at victorian health standards doesnt paint a pretty picture.

All very good points, I'm certainly not at peak fitness ? and no where near prepared at all..

when SHTF I think everyone is in trouble no matter how prepped you are



But we are a big household with 5 adults & with good wide ranging skill sets, also out of town which is a big bonus

What I am missing is dentistry , I keep telling my brother to marry a vet or dentist cause I need their talents ... But NO he wants to marry for 'love' and 'attraction' ,(urgh). Apparently the ability to lance a boil & pull a wisdom tooth isn't 'attractive' anymore ?

 

[SamDeleted]

Just the other month a filling of mine broke and I was really annoyed at letting it happen and how I was going to have to rely on a dentist to fix it.

Its bad enough finding a dentist now BEFORE shtf ?

 

[65NW]

I've always love that , what a positive and upbeat way to say 'homeless'

Tiny homes are cool. Mobile homes are not.

Why is this?

 

[OffGridForGood]

Tiny homes are cool. Mobile homes are not.

Why is this?

"Charactor"

 

[hugemoth]

They are great but be careful


Run it high or choke it up , they are your only two options

That's the rumor going around but it is false. If the heater is tuned correctly it won't clog up on any setting.

 

[hugemoth]

Run high or choke them is an internet myth.. Have run one 24/7 to heat a room off the house for 4 winter seasons.. Leave it on setting #2 which is a lower setting. and run it from Dec 1st to march 15th non stop.. At the end of the 3rd season had to replace glow plug and clean out the burn chamber but for the serious amount of hours run it was not that dirty. That myth has been busted along time ago. They are a pwm controlled pump, I think you call it. The lower the setting the lower the pump pulses and the lower the fan runs.
You will get carbon problems when people start adding waste motor oil into the mix.. It may have to do with whatever cheapo china heater you buy. Some are better than others.. YMMV

I have 2 Chinese diesel heaters in my small house. One runs 24/7 during the winter months, 99% of the time on the lowest setting. I disassemble and clean it every year and find very little soot, it runs very clean. It's snowing here right now and I'm enjoying the warm air from the heater on the lowest setting.