Why not CIGS?

[Will Prowse]

What a piece of garbage. Cigs are supposed to be much stronger than other flex panels. I'm removing them from my site and the link on the video. This pisses me off.

Mine is in Vegas sun and no delamination yet. Not sure why mine are holding up so well. Very strange.

 

[curiouscarbon]

check it out. rich solar 80W.

What a piece of garbage. Cigs are supposed to be much stronger than other flex panels. I'm removing them from my site and the link on the video. This pisses me off.

this is after not even a full year outside. admittedly they are not attached to a surface with the adhesive backing, but that's not what failed.

Mine is in Vegas sun and no delamination yet. Not sure why mine are holding up so well. Very strange.

of four 80 W panels, the ones exposed to water the most have the worst delamination.

water seems to wick into the sides and then evaporates and delamination occurs.

in vegas sun, i conjecture that the panels might dry off faster and be dry for more time, which might imply less water intrusion delamination effect.

sealing the edges and wiping flush seems like an obvious way i could mitigate this.. disappointed given the claims and the price.

unfortunately it has already progressed far enough on two that i might prophylactically decommission it. second and third photo.

 

[curiouscarbon]

source :

RICH SOLAR MEGA 80 Watt CIGS Flexible Solar Panel

Integrates with roofing surface No mounting hardware No roof penetrations No wind load Low profile Flexible Solar Panels Fits many roof types Conforms to the shape of your roof No glass or metal frame, durable, hail-resistant, non-breakable Can be worked on Adhesive Mounting System With adhesive...

richsolar.com

it is not ambiguous to me what claim was made about the nature of resistance to water exposure.

?

 

[curiouscarbon]

Not sure why mine are holding up so well.

may I ask, have the panels been exposed to water at all? rain, etc.

 

[Will Prowse]

Just added this to my site

 

[Will Prowse]

may I ask, have the panels been exposed to water at all? rain, etc.

It has rained multiple times on my panel. And is in the Las Vegas sun everyday.

 

[curiouscarbon]

Thanks for the info.

mine only receive a few hours of direct sun a day, and are exposed to some amount of water almost every day. the water often does not fully evaporate by the end of day.

 

[eXodus]

Just added this to my site
View attachment 84315

Very sad that CIGS get a bad rap through flexible panels. But I had flexible panels, and they all failed within 2-4 years.

The rigid glass CIGS I got are 12 years old and work perfectly.

 

[curiouscarbon]

Very sad that CIGS get a bad rap through flexible panels. But I had flexible panels, and they all failed within 2-4 years.

for sure. the packaging failed, but that's not specific to CIGS of course.

The rigid glass CIGS I got are 12 years old and work perfectly.

good to know! in the future, Rigid CIGS is what I'll try. Lately all the CIGS panels I've found are flex type.

Pros:

1. Durable

while not specific to CIGS, the packaging on flexible rich solar 80W CIGS panels is poor.

I still fully believe in CIGS as a technology, even with slightly less power density per area.


anyone got recent recomendation for Rigid CIGS panel?

 

[Swagon]

There is another thread on this site about the delamination and also burn spots.

 

[curiouscarbon]

CIGS panels are shorting, melting, and delaminating

Hi all, Purchased an 80-watt CIGS from Rich Solar in March '21 after seeing Will's video. It worked perfectly for my application atop my cartop box and charging a Bluetti AC50. After a few months, I noticed some delamination along the edges along and what appeared to be burn marks near the...

diysolarforum.com

wow!

my gut told me to execute a protective preemptive decommissioning of my deployed 80W CIGS rich solar panels.

this thread cemented it!!!

 

[curiouscarbon]

my takeaway.

use rigid panels if at all possible.

if using flex panels, INSPECT INSPECT INSPECT regularly!

 

[Will Prowse]

You need to get your money back. Let me know how they respond. Ask for Andy and show them this thread.

 

[curiouscarbon]

so glad that these were installed for everyday inspection. it's so early in the failure mode.

the other thread mentions that rich solar might have become aware of the manufacturing issue around October 2021

Update: Latest response from Rich Solar says they originally didn’t understand the severity of the problem and they are now contacting the manufacturer.

for reference, the rich solar 80W CIGS flex panels in the photos i shared were delivered around May 2021.

it's so early in the failure mode that shipping them back is undesirable for me. much less than 1% of the area has been compromised from a casual visual inspection. have gasket maker around and would happily apply it and skip the shipping. anyways. yeah, it is a letdown given the MSRP.

i'll try to update with outcome of communication.

 

[eXodus]

good to know! in the future, Rigid CIGS is what I'll try.

like I said early in this thread, great low light performance. Work actually best when you got a lot of scattered light, with clouds.

Rigid CIGS panel?

The panels I got are from Würth Solar, in Germany. But they got bought out a while ago.

Würth Solar – | AEET Energy Group GmbH | Ihr Großhandelspartner in Deutschland

großhandel, handel, ansprechpartner, verlässlich Solarmodule von Würth Solar erhältlich bei AEET Energy Group GmbH - WürthSolar - tagesaktuelle Angebote sowie Informationen und Datenblätter der Marke Würth Solar - Kaufen - Bestellen - Reklamieren - Reklamation - deutschland - germany - Reparatur...

www.aeet-energy.com

You can still get the panels second hand, but probably not worth shipping depending where you are on the globe.

CIS / CIGS Würth Solar - WS11007

WSG0036 und WS11007 gebraucht ca. 12 Jahre alt, Alurahmen

www.secondsol.com

I just looked at the racking system just remembered- it's a really cool design - the panels are sitting inside the rail they get pushed in from the side. They are not screwed down. Only laying in the the rack channels and both ends are getting closed.

I just googled around and found those:

CIGS technology solar technology - Introduction - hjtpv.com

CIGS photovoltaic technology is dedicated to BIPV projects. Thin-film photovoltaics, solar tiles and CIGS solar panels.

hjtpv.com

No idea if they are any good.

 

[curiouscarbon]

thank you! ??

fun tidbit from one link

 

[curiouscarbon]

a week ago, rich solar published this video instructing users of their weatherproof CIGS flex panels to affix "outdoor weatherproof tape" to "create a proper seal"

 

[Will Prowse]

I saw that, and I didn't seal it properly at all. Mine looks fine. Lots of heat out here, but no moisture. Maybe moisture is the culprit?

 

[curiouscarbon]

i never sealed any of mine due to the weatherproof claim. i mistakenly assumed their adhesive would stand up to regular moisture.

having operated four of the 80W panels, two were sprayed lightly on by sprinklers regularly, experienced severe failure of seal, actually exposing the PV material to outside world. those two are decommissioned for safety right now.

the two that did not get sprayed on by sprinklers have experienced practically no failure of the edge seal.

as far as i am concerned, the failure mode is directly related to how long the panel is exposed to water/moisture.

it is not weatherproof if being lightly rained on once a day causes the panel to become unsafe and failing within a year.

now operating two of the 160W CIGS in place of the four 80W. they work great. i know if they are exposed to weather that involves water, the edges MUST be retrofitted with supplementary sealant if lasting more than a year is the goal.

cheers

 

[eXodus]

I saw that, and I didn't seal it properly at all. Mine looks fine. Lots of heat out here, but no moisture. Maybe moisture is the culprit?

Florida here, lot's of rain and humid. Panels didn't last 3 years.

My glass Cgis panels in Germany are getting rained on every other week. A decade later no problem.

The flexibility nature and two different materials makes a seal really hard. So I can see why they fail. Sure when you are in the dessert that process is slower. That's why people store aircraft and old cars in that climate. Water deteriorates everything faster.