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Half price electric cars

The only reason that EV's are not the better option in all cases is because the whole Charging part of the roll out has been Bungled.
The Europeans have the right idea for the future. You drive the car up to a Charging station and a door opens up below the car and a device removes your dead battery pack and replaces it with a fully charged one. You are in and out within about 3 minutes.

No other system will work unless charging times drop down to under 10 Minutes.
I was listening to some analysis on the current disaster with charging stations and what could be the best outcome with the current tech.
If we built out the system using the current system the numbers showed that we would need so many charging stations in a large city that it would be impossible to accomplish it. Also the lost Productivity of people waiting to get a charge would cost the economy hundreds of billions of dollars per year. Basically it just cannot work!

In order for EV's to make the next leap the Charging time has to decrease to under 10 Minutes or we change the system completely and start making vehicles with Packs that can be removed and replaced in under 5 minutes. In both cases it still requires that lot more charging stations have to be built and standards on Battery packs have to be set.
buy brand new car
drive it a few days and drive to your buddy's house
go to charge it on your drive back home
get someones 20 year old battery
don't make it home and get stranded in the middle of aussie desert
kangaroo comes and beats you up

not to mention the maintenance nightmare of the machines lifting those batteries constantly
 
buy brand new car
drive it a few days and drive to your buddy's house
go to charge it on your drive back home
get someones 20 year old battery
don't make it home and get stranded in the middle of aussie desert
kangaroo comes and beats you up

not to mention the maintenance nightmare of the machines lifting those batteries constantly
🤣
 
Stored energy in general is the issue. I have a truck that had sat for over a year. Put the battery in that I had taken out, cranked it over, and it started up. I can leave my car sitting outside in below zero weather for weeks and go out and start it right up. Can't do those things with an EV
Storage really isn't the issue. the batteries now go further than any of the gas tanks do (excluding a semi tractor/trailer with hundreds of gallons of gas tank)

We have lithium sulfur and solid state which will help the distance with smaller size and the charging issues..
The battery dev is going nuts right now. We'll see what happens

Charging is definitely the issue. The way to counter that right now is just give them longer distance, but that is not a great way to do it in the end. The ideal would be match the gas tank at ~300miles and just have faster charging.

I want a LIGHTER car but currently it's going backwards and they are getting heavier and heavier


Pure BS. Some EVs can already get to 80% charge in 20 minutes on high speed chargers.

But, the truth is, most car drivers park their car in a garage every night and go to a gas station once or twice a week. If 20 minutes at a charger is too inconvenient, plug the car in at home.
are there ones that can be plugged into regular 15-20 amp outlets?
I think it's weird to be so eager to fast charge, when slow is better for battery.. Talking of course about the 8-14 hours someone parks their car at home every day
 
Storage really isn't the issue. the batteries now go further than any of the gas tanks do (excluding a semi tractor/trailer with hundreds of gallons of gas tank)

We have lithium sulfur and solid state which will help the distance with smaller size and the charging issues..
The battery dev is going nuts right now. We'll see what happens

Charging is definitely the issue. The way to counter that right now is just give them longer distance, but that is not a great way to do it in the end. The ideal would be match the gas tank at ~300miles and just have faster charging.
My point is, a tank of gas doesn't have the same issue as a tank of batteries. A huge part of the population lives where weather isn't kind to batteries. Keeping these batteries in their ideal state takes energy, either from the grid or themselves.

To be fair, I don't know a lot about EVs. I'm not against them, and in fact, one would probably fit my driving in a couple years when I retire, as I don't plan on doing a lot of long distance driving. Issue is, any long distance driving I would do is traveling with my 4000 pound camper.
 
No other system will work unless charging times drop down to under 10 Minutes.
If we built out the system using the current system the numbers showed that we would need so many charging stations in a large city that it would be impossible to accomplish it.
I repect your opinion but I disagree. My daughter worked at a Hospital in San Francisco and EV drivers got free parking with Valets that moved the cars to charging stations when one was finished charging. I most cases it took less than an hour to add 100 miles of range and that means eight or more cars can charge at one charging station in a day. It still takes the same number of overall parking places but the Hospital met their goals to reduce emissions by incentivizing EVs and everyone was happy.
In order for EV's to make the next leap the Charging time has to decrease to under 10 Minutes ......
That is a gas car mentality. Most EVs can put several hundred miles on them overnight parked in a garage or the driveway at a home. I own an apartment building and SCE has incentives for adding charging stations at multifamily dwellings. Tesla Superchargers have been very reliable. It is the Electrify America stations and some Blink stations that have been the issue that is getting all the press. Most manufacturers have adopted the Tesla connector and the protocol is very similar. My son in law has already ordered an adaptor for his Ford Lightning and the new models will not need an adaptor because the vehicle receptacle will use the Tesla form factor.
 
buy brand new car
drive it a few days and drive to your buddy's house
go to charge it on your drive back home
get someones 20 year old battery
don't make it home and get stranded in the middle of aussie desert
kangaroo comes and beats you up

not to mention the maintenance nightmare of the machines lifting those batteries constantly
It's not an issue, the battery you get has roughly the same SOH and age as the one that is being removed.
After your battery has been changed a few dozen times you will not even think about the battery anymore.
Also my understanding is that your battery changes (serial numbers) are recorded in the cars computer. You get the full warranty on the battery as though it is the original and the charging companies will remove packs from the system that are showing low capacity or issues.

 
My brother has had three EV’s - and loves them!

The first two were Nisson Leaf’s. He got them cheap for his kids to have a car during teen years - no gas expense and the teenagers did not need massive ranges- they could go all over the area. Being used they were cheap! Think disposable for teens.

Then after kids left he got him a used Telsa 3. It is super cheap to run - no gas and he just plugs it in at night - always a full tank. He has taken it on several long trips. What he says is by the time you need a meal or a bathroom break, the car needs a 20 min charge - do them at the same time. He stops more for humans than for electrons.
He told me on a long trip, start in the morning full, recharge at lunch, recharge at dinner, fill the car when sleeping- rinse and repeat. No issues…

Power from home is MUCH cheaper than gasoline or diesel.
 
I repect your opinion but I disagree. My daughter worked at a Hospital in San Francisco and EV drivers got free parking with Valets that moved the cars to charging stations when one was finished charging. I most cases it took less than an hour to add 100 miles of range and that means eight or more cars can charge at one charging station in a day. It still takes the same number of overall parking places but the Hospital met their goals to reduce emissions by incentivizing EVs and everyone was happy.

That is a gas car mentality. Most EVs can put several hundred miles on them overnight parked in a garage or the driveway at a home. I own an apartment building and SCE has incentives for adding charging stations at multifamily dwellings. Tesla Superchargers have been very reliable. It is the Electrify America stations and some Blink stations that have been the issue that is getting all the press. Most manufacturers have adopted the Tesla connector and the protocol is very similar. My son in law has already ordered an adaptor for his Ford Lightning and the new models will not need an adaptor because the vehicle receptacle will use the Tesla form factor.
Why shouldn't it be? That's part of the issue. Until EV's are a better option, they aren't going to be willingly accepted.
Anyone telling us that we need to take steps backward to go forward has an uphill battle on their end.
 
Stored energy in general is the issue. I have a truck that had sat for over a year. Put the battery in that I had taken out, cranked it over, and it started up. I can leave my car sitting outside in below zero weather for weeks and go out and start it right up. Can't do those things with an EV
Why not?
 
My point is, a tank of gas doesn't have the same issue as a tank of batteries. A huge part of the population lives where weather isn't kind to batteries. Keeping these batteries in their ideal state takes energy, either from the grid or themselves.

To be fair, I don't know a lot about EVs. I'm not against them, and in fact, one would probably fit my driving in a couple years when I retire, as I don't plan on doing a lot of long distance driving. Issue is, any long distance driving I would do is traveling with my 4000 pound camper.
yea you aren't wrong about batteries. There's a reason the labs working on them out number pretty much every other type of technology currently.
- We got lithium sulfur which was worked on like 30 years. Right around the corner
- solid state batteries worked on since the dawn of time also coming. Some exist already, poor charging and or really tiny
- sodium ion, you can actually buy it now, also worked on 30+ years

It's cool to see. The perfect theoretical solid state will be near instant charging. That's the top for EV
sodium ion is probably the best for grid storage as it's insanely abundant.
lithium sulfur is good middle man as sulfur is very abundant too. It should help capacity and charging speed of batteries.

Biologically sulfur is used for electron transfer which is pretty similar (as far as my limited understanding of the batteries) to how they're doing with the batteries. So it's nice to see us using some stuff being used how it is in living creatures.
Obviously the pinnacle of battery technology is having something you feed a hamburger to and it can run for 3 days like a dog can.
 
It's not an issue, the battery you get has roughly the same SOH and age as the one that is being removed.
After your battery has been changed a few dozen times you will not even think about the battery anymore.
Also my understanding is that your battery changes (serial numbers) are recorded in the cars computer. You get the full warranty on the battery as though it is the original and the charging companies will remove packs from the system that are showing low capacity or issues.

Nio EV is a chinese car, not "European."
 
Why shouldn't it be? That's part of the issue. Until EV's are a better option, they aren't going to be willingly accepted.
Anyone telling us that we need to take steps backward to go forward has an uphill battle on their end.
If we had approached cars with a horse and buggy mentality we would still be feeding horses and sweeping up horse crap in our streets.
 
I repect your opinion but I disagree. My daughter worked at a Hospital in San Francisco and EV drivers got free parking with Valets that moved the cars to charging stations when one was finished charging. I most cases it took less than an hour to add 100 miles of range and that means eight or more cars can charge at one charging station in a day. It still takes the same number of overall parking places but the Hospital met their goals to reduce emissions by incentivizing EVs and everyone was happy.
I agree on that point but the problem is that they cannot bank on companies having charging systems at work places.
You lucky if you do but it is not even close to being the Norm.
That is a gas car mentality. Most EVs can put several hundred miles on them overnight parked in a garage or the driveway at a home. I own an apartment building and SCE has incentives for adding charging stations at multifamily dwellings. Tesla Superchargers have been very reliable. It is the Electrify America stations and some Blink stations that have been the issue that is getting all the press. Most manufacturers have adopted the Tesla connector and the protocol is very similar. My son in law has already ordered an adaptor for his Ford Lightning and the new models will not need an adaptor because the vehicle receptacle will use the Tesla form factor.
Yes the Gas station Mentality is the problem. I know what your talking about but it's not going to change the general public's perception on the issue. People saw what happened during the Blizzard and they freaked out. People want full tanks and they want them whenever they feel like getting them. Most big cities do not have the ability to put charging stations near everyone's home.
 
yea you aren't wrong about batteries. There's a reason the labs working on them out number pretty much every other type of technology currently.
- We got lithium sulfur which was worked on like 30 years. Right around the corner
- solid state batteries worked on since the dawn of time also coming. Some exist already, poor charging and or really tiny
- sodium ion, you can actually buy it now, also worked on 30+ years

It's cool to see. The perfect theoretical solid state will be near instant charging. That's the top for EV
sodium ion is probably the best for grid storage as it's insanely abundant.
lithium sulfur is good middle man as sulfur is very abundant too. It should help capacity and charging speed of batteries.

Biologically sulfur is used for electron transfer which is pretty similar (as far as my limited understanding of the batteries) to how they're doing with the batteries. So it's nice to see us using some stuff being used how it is in living creatures.
Obviously the pinnacle of battery technology is having something you feed a hamburger to and it can run for 3 days like a dog can.
So maybe EVs in the future make sense. For me, the real issue is that the mandates with them on both federal and state levels are before the EVs time. Wouldn't even need mandates if they just let the product sell itself.
 
It's not an issue, the battery you get has roughly the same SOH and age as the one that is being removed.
After your battery has been changed a few dozen times you will not even think about the battery anymore.
Also my understanding is that your battery changes (serial numbers) are recorded in the cars computer. You get the full warranty on the battery as though it is the original and the charging companies will remove packs from the system that are showing low capacity or issues.

So you don't even need to worry about the mechanics of the lifting mechanism
You have a 2 story building under the ground that has every range of battery for the EV and types of EV and checks and logs in a database all of their statistics so it knows to grab the same exact battery

My money is on solid state / lithium sulfur / straight lithium being able to charge in a few minutes before any of that gets built..
 
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