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Rock solid, no bells, 48 volt inverter

I read on the midnite site that the fans are user replaceable. Did you replace yours and how was it?

Victron is great. But all in on Victron, then having back up, gets pretty pricey.
 
I read on the midnite site that the fans are user replaceable. Did you replace yours and how was it?

Victron is great. But all in on Victron, then having back up, gets pretty pricey.
I tried contacting them to get replacement and nobody ever replied.
 
I second the Exeltech, their customer support is great as I just contacted them for a low idle current and transfer switch option for my 2007 XP1100 and they responded in one day. You can purchase spares from fleebay for $300 or less.
 
This is impressive:

Just understand what "MTBF" means.

This does not mean that if you operated 100 inverters, average operating life would be 21.5 years.

It means that if you operated 215 inverters, 10 would be expected to have failed within 1 year.

They may in fact last an average of 21.5 years, or they may not.
MTBF tells about failure rate, not expected lifespan.
There is a "bathtub curve", with some infant mortality, low failure rate during operating life, increasing failure rate toward end of life due to wear-out.

Operating 5x SWR 2500U GT inverters (about 12 operating hours per day), I had one failure during 5 year warranty, repaired by replacement PCB. I had one failure outside of warranty and took it out of service (maybe at 10 years). At 17 years I took the remaining ones out of service to replace with others having different features.

I calculated that was 35 years MTBF. If I had continued operating them, MTBF would have increased until the next failure. If they started dropping like flies, it would have decreased to < 17 years, I think 6 failures in as little as 17 x 4 + 10 operating years would have been 13 years MTBF.

MTBF is usually given in hours.
35 years at 12 hours per day is 153,000 hours MTBF
13 years is 57,000 hours MTBF

SMA now gives 10 year warranty standard for residential GT PV inverters, 20 year optional.
10 year warranty on Sunny Island battery inverters (which operate 24/7)
10 year on commercial inverters.

The GT PV inverter warranty also says "or XXXX kWh, whichever comes first."
Looks to me like single orientation of PV array, usual upside down parabola for production, the warranty by years would apply. Tracker or otherwise producing high power throughout the day, warranty is shortened accordingly.
 
Not happy with my Magnum. Charger only worked one time for about 3 min then stopped. Won’t run my 120v washer. Won’t start a 1hp pump without turning off the whole house. Lights in the house flash when my 5cf freezer starts or my 7cf refrigerator. Can’t get them to return a phone call or an email to get it fixed. Can’t find another to buy as a spare.
 
I have a made in China Reliable brand inverter But it’s a 12v model. They do make 48v also. It’s been in my RV since 2016. I’ve over voltage it about 4 times and just unplug it and plug it back in and it fires right back up. Have never had any other problems other then the 4 I have created. Rock solid and always works when needed. I’ve forgotten it running for moths at a time no problem. Spares are cheap also.
 
I think I have my off grid charge controller and battery stuff covered. Ultimately, 10 or so SOK rack batteries and a Victron Smart Solar RS 450/200 (4 mppt trackers). Or maybe a midnite controller. Either way, lots of panels and plenty of juice to charge up a dead bank and run my little 2000 watt life at the same time. Mostly air con load.

Kinda going a few directions here. :)

Strictly string inverters for this analysis.

This does not make sense. "String inverter" usually refers to a grid-tie string inverter that has 1-2 high voltage strings.

No grid forming needed. No grid tie needed.

These appear to be in conflict. Did you mean "OFF GRID"?

When you're off grid, you're your own grid, so I would call it "grid forming," but I

Edit-120 volt 60 hertz pure sine output.

You have a massive amount of batteries/solar planned for 120VAC/60Hz. Why not split phase?


I see that Aimes has a 48 volt at currentconnected.com but it doesn’t appear to be in stock.

AIMS is made by Sigineer. You can find re-branded Sigineer here cheaper than AIMS:


Neighbor has the 6kW split phase unit in 24V, also available in 48V.

Magnum has some good looking units and a good rep, but Arizona Wind and Solar sold out. That probably tells me someting.

Outback has some units. But hear some mixed reviews.

I hate to throw out the term military grade but maybe that’s what I’m after.

No such thing, but Magnum, Outback, Xantrax, Schnieder, etc. are going to be the closest.

This gentleman deserves some recognition.

He imports Chinesium Power-Jack LF inverters "hardens" them and resells them.

He gets an A+ for enthusiasm in my book.

GenetrySolar

Agree with the sentiment, but I wouldn't consider. Might as well just get a Sigineer from ECPC.

@Bluedog225 HAVE YOU ACTUALLY CONDUCTED AN ENERGY AUDIT?
 
Kinda going a few directions here. :)
Agreed. This was a placeholder so as not to distract from the inverter discussion.
This does not make sense. "String inverter" usually refers to a grid-tie string inverter that has 1-2 high voltage strings.
Ok. I thought a string inverter simply meant an inverter fed by a string of panels. Distinct from micros.
These appear to be in conflict. Did you mean "OFF GRID"?
Yes. Off grid. And trying to avoid getting off topic with the needs of microinverters.
When you're off grid, you're your own grid, so I would call it "grid forming," but I



You have a massive amount of batteries/solar planned for 120VAC/60Hz. Why not split phase?
Split phase is an option. The mini-splits come in 120 and 240. I was exploring a setup where the minisplit is fed by a stand-alone inverter. And the rest of the loads would be fed by a similar inverter. E.g. 2000 watts each.

My loads are small for my 25’x25’ place. I need the large array and battery bank to carry the air con during the day, fully charge the battery bank, and maximize ability to stay at the place when production is poor.
AIMS is made by Sigineer. You can find re-branded Sigineer here cheaper than AIMS:


Neighbor has the 6kW split phase unit in 24V, also available in 48V.



No such thing, but Magnum, Outback, Xantrax, Schnieder, etc. are going to be the closest.



Agree with the sentiment, but I wouldn't consider. Might as well just get a Sigineer from ECPC.

@Bluedog225 HAVE YOU ACTUALLY CONDUCTED AN ENERGY AUDIT?
Thanks for the tips. And yes, as described above, I have a pretty good handle on my needs. There are challenges as I don’t have a good way of estimating the duty cycle of an air conditioner when it’s 110 F during the day and 90 F in the morning. This inquiry was to explore the option of running multiple small inverters gives me redundancy. And it will be relatively simple for me to balance lighting/misc with air con, appliances, etc over the inverters as separate circuits.

A couple of years of lived experience will give me more info and I can upgrade to a more centralized system.
 
I tried contacting them to get replacement and nobody ever replied.
Victron is a great idea for the MPPT. But I don't think it's risky to use a Classic.

I had a midnite classic 200 with a noisy failing fan, installed in 2015... It's still running the same installation, something tells me the fan has probably failed entirely by now and it's just derating its production capability since it had apparently failing fans years ago. I no longer have access to the installation but I do hear about it if it goes down. It's a small farm with a fridge and freezer and they suffer major losses if they lose refrigeration. The Outback FM series and Midnite Classic are both ridiculously bulletproof MPPTs from what I've seen, but they just don't share data in a modern way like a Victron does.

I also have nothing but good things to say about the Reliable WZRELB 3000w 48v inverter (It's my backup if my MultiplusII goes down). I'd probably buy 6 of them over one exeltech personally, but I'd also agree that the exeltech is an awesome and much more robust option.
 
Agreed. This was a placeholder so as not to distract from the inverter discussion.

Ok. I thought a string inverter simply meant an inverter fed by a string of panels. Distinct from micros.

The only inverters that are fed with panels are grid-tie inverters.

Non grid-tie inverters are fed from AC or batteries. Solar charge controllers are fed from PV. you might be confusing All-in-Ones that have inverters and MPPT built in with "inverters"

Yes. Off grid. And trying to avoid getting off topic with the needs of microinverters.

"Off grid" is the best way to refer to your needs then.

Split phase is an option. The mini-splits come in 120 and 240. I was exploring a setup where the minisplit is fed by a stand-alone inverter. And the rest of the loads would be fed by a similar inverter. E.g. 2000 watts each.

240V mini-splits can get to crazy high SEER numbers.

My loads are small for my 25’x25’ place. I need the large array and battery bank to carry the air con during the day, fully charge the battery bank, and maximize ability to stay at the place when production is poor.

Don't overbuild the system by a factor of 2-4X to avoid running a $500 generator a couple days a year. ;)

That's why it's very important that you should actually have all of your loads listed and energy needs computed.


Thanks for the tips. And yes, as described above, I have a pretty good handle on my needs. There are challenges as I don’t have a good way of estimating the duty cycle of an air conditioner when it’s 110 F during the day and 90 F in the morning.

Get a kill-a-watt to record your daily kWh needs. Some wifi power plugs actually log usage on a daily basis. I have several around the house for fun, and I now know my little soda fridge uses about 0.4kWh/day. If you care about daytime/night time use, check at sunrise and sunset to get the current tally.

This inquiry was to explore the option of running multiple small inverters gives me redundancy. And it will be relatively simple for me to balance lighting/misc with air con, appliances, etc over the inverters as separate circuits.

Redundancy can take many forms. Mine is the fact that I will have two Quattros operating in parallel for split phase (both hung but only one operating). If one takes a crap, I can reconfigure for 120VAC only. If that takes a crap, I have a cheap 3600W genny. If that takes a crap, I have a 3000W Coleman genny. If that takes a crap, I have a whole secondary system - 24V/2000W inverter, 215Ah of AGM, and a spare 60A charge controller, and I could reconfigure my 14S Lithium NMC battery to 7S if I really wanted to.

Oh, and one of the 5th wheels has its own propane generator with a 420# dedicated propane tank.

I don't even live there yet. :)

Do you need auto-failover redundancy, or can you tolerate an hour or two of tweaking to restore limited service?

A couple of years of lived experience will give me more info and I can upgrade to a more centralized system.

Note how I have a complete spare system. It was due to poor planning. :)
 
I also have nothing but good things to say about the Reliable WZRELB 3000w 48v inverter (It's my backup if my MultiplusII goes down). I'd probably buy 6 of them over one exeltech personally, but I'd also agree that the exeltech is an awesome and much more robust option.

I have the same WZRELB inverter in 24V/2000W form. I had no complaints when it was the only option.
 
Redundancy can take many forms. Mine is the fact that I will have two Quattros operating in parallel for split phase (both hung but only one operating). If one takes a crap, I can reconfigure for 120VAC only. If that takes a crap, I have a cheap 3600W genny. If that takes a crap, I have a 3000W Coleman genny. If that takes a crap, I have a whole secondary system - 24V/2000W inverter, 215Ah of AGM, and a spare 60A charge controller, and I could reconfigure my 14S Lithium NMC battery to 7S if I really wanted to.

Oh, and one of the 5th wheels has its own propane generator with a 420# dedicated propane tank.

I don't even live there yet. :)

Wow! That's awesome!

Are you rich, or just lots of debt?
 
Taking to heart the good advice here. Looking at 48 volt/240 volt for the minisplit.

My research keeps leading me back to the Schneider 4048 for Tier 1.

And I’m looking at various cheap 48/240 inverters at the electric car parts company (thanks for that).

Is there an equivalent victron product that gives me 48/240 in this price range. I don’t see it. As far as I can tell, the Mulitplus 2 will not provide 240 unless fed by 240. This seems unfortunate.


Thanks


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Is there an equivalent victron product that gives me 48/240 in this price range. I don’t see it. As far as I can tell, the Mulitplus 2 will not provide 240 unless fed by 240. This seems unfortunate.
Some have reported success pairing a 230v/50hz european quattro/Multiplus with Victron’s autotransformer, yielding US style split phase 120+120. I believe the adjustment to 60hz, 240v only involves a software tweak.

It might be worth reaching out to Victron or a competent dealer (alte, naws, etc) to determine if this is a supported configuration.

(nb - I’m quite happy with my Victron MPPT,shunt,etc but don’t own any of their larger systems)
 
Samlex just came out with a new model, the 4248, which is a 4200 watt 48 volt inverter, 120/240 split phase out. They're top quality products, I have been running two of their 24 volt models and love them. I have one on the way and will be converting my 4 x 15 kWh 24 volt batteries to a single 48 volt 1200 amp hour system with the new unit.
 
No Victron product offers split phase output. Only 120VAC (North America) or 230VAC (EU). The only way you get split phase with Victron is:

1) multiple inverters operating in parallel. directly outputting 120/240V with one inverter providing power to each leg.
2) 230VAC unit reconfig to 240V/60Hz feeding an autotransformer to provide 120/240VAC split phase.

Even the unit you linked is only 120VAC. It just has built-in features to simplify powering a 50A RV and allow for the flexibility of powering via 30A w/o any change in configuration.

Lastly, very few Victron are UL 1741 listed, so use under NEC compliance is sketchy and depends on your AHJ.
 
No Victron product offers split phase output. Only 120VAC (North America) or 230VAC (EU). The only way you get split phase with Victron is:

1) multiple inverters operating in parallel. directly outputting 120/240V with one inverter providing power to each leg.
2) 230VAC unit reconfig to 240V/60Hz feeding an autotransformer to provide 120/240VAC split phase.

Even the unit you linked is only 120VAC. It just has built-in features to simplify powering a 50A RV and allow for the flexibility of powering via 30A w/o any change in configuration.

Lastly, very few Victron are UL 1741 listed, so use under NEC compliance is sketchy and depends on your AHJ.
This is the exact reason all my equipment is Victron other then my inverter. It’s a Magnum and at this point I wouldn’t recommend a Magnum to anyone. Broke on day one and can’t get it repaired.
 
I live in San Antonio where the high so far this year (that ive noticed from checking my phone, not official by any means) is 108F and heat index 111F. I’m living off grid with no grid connection whatsoever in a ~900sqft structure with very unimpressive insulation and ZERO shade on the structure after about 8am. I can tell you that i am using about 3kw running window units to keep this structure comfortable in these conditions during the heat of the day, roughly 10-6. From 6-10pm i am compromising my comfort desires a bit and curbing my ac ‘consumption’ down to 1000-1500w which doesnt keep the whole house cool. From 10pm to 8am i run only one 8000btu midea inverter window unit in a bedroom which averages <250w on lowest settings set to 73f in a ~160sqft room, and that time is covered by batteries.

So my ac power draw ranges from 250w for 160sqft overnight to 3000w for 900sqft during the day.

I also have a 20x25 metal building with firberglass insulation (not sure R value), and a 12x12 uninsulated poorly sealed roll up door. I can keep that cool with 2000w during the day.

In my opinion, if you insulate a 25x25 well and buy an efficient mini split, you can probably cool it with 1000w or less continuous during the hottest part of the day, and at night your power draw for cooling should be no real issue even with smallish battery. I would encourage you to go 240 on the mini split because it’s more efficient and the wiring is cheaper. All my numbers would be better with mini splits but the fact that everything already ‘works’ on free power and paid-for batteries is undercutting my motivation to improve. ?

Im sure someone would rather i express all this in kwh but i rarely look at it. I put a power meter on the old 5000btu window unit i used to have in my room before i went off grid, and once i found out it was using <2 kwh overnight, i said ‘oh, no big deal then because i can easily cover that with batteries, my next ac unit will be more efficient, and my 10kw array will cover everything during the day’ and stopped really tracking any kwh and since then im just ‘spot checking’ the wattage on my inverter screens.
 
Howdy neighbor. Your numbers are in line with mine. I am going to insulate the carp out of the place. R49 in the ceilings. And I’ve got foam polyiso foil reflective on all the plywood (with an air gap). I figured a good mini-split running 24/7 will keep me cool with 1000 watts/hour. This is a max. May come in lower overnight.

I was just watching videos on how to install a split system diy. It’s a pain not doable.

Hang in there. August is going to be rough.
 
Neither. My only debt is my home. Staying out of unnecessary debt can make one feel "rich" even when they're not. :)
Did without the unnecessary stuff. Debt free since 38. If you are in debt, 25%-50% of your income can go to interest. Plus you can never have just liability insurance, so there is another 50% more for insurance. Then you set goals, save money faster for what you want. It is all about self control.
 
In that price range you are going to get a medium grade inverter. I thought you were looking at something bulletproof hence the latronics recommendation.

You need to work out if you want bulletproof - or cheap.
 

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