diy solar

diy solar

Sol-ark damaged by small generator?

H

hautions11

New Member
Joined
Mar 9, 2022
Messages
59
Location
Western Indiana Terre Haute
I have heard that the 15k can be damaged by the use of smaller generators due to surges from quick loads etc. ( highest Sol-ark failure rate is associated with small generator issues) I also heard that Sol-ark recommends a 22k minimum generator. In reading lots of threads it appears a lot of you are running small under 10k generators as back up.

I do have a 30 KWh battery bank for a bit of load buffering, but what is the bottom line? Thx
 
I have never heard that, but I'm new to the game.

I noticed that my 7kWh continuous generator would trip easier when putting power "through" the sol-ark than when I used it stand-alone. However, I just worked around the minor inconvenience by only using it to charge the battery, rather than running it when doing laundry and other high draw tasks.

Works pretty well. I just avoid the quick loads now when using the small generator. The inverter must just pull a lot of power quickly, tripping the generator when it otherwise wouldn't have. That's my guess.

If I was fully off-grid, I would get a better generator for sure. I like the one I have though, the 8750 harbor freight inverter. Good for the money.
 
2.4 Integrating a Generator
Generators Smaller than 19.2kW → On “GEN” Terminal
1. Supports 120/240V generators only.
2. Connect the generator output to the “GEN” input terminal of the Sol-Ark. You must select the
correct grid type before connecting the generator.
3. A THD (Total Harmonic Distortion) of less than 15% is preferred.
4. “GEN” terminal DOES NOT support 120/208V 3-Phase generators.


Generators Bigger than 19.2kW → On “GRID” Terminal
1. Supports 220V Single phase, 120/240V Split phase, 120/208V 3-Phase (2 of 3 phases). The correct
grid type must be selected before connecting the generator.
2. Off-Grid systems with whole-home generators on ATS (Automatic Transfer Switch) or manual
transfer switch connected to the
“GRID” input, require selecting “? GEN Connect to Grid Input”.
a. Home Screen → → “Limiter” → “Other” → “? GEN Connect to Grid Input” → “OK”
3. An Off-Grid system should NOT use “Grid sell”. CT sensors on generator lines are only needed if
using “Grid Peak Shaving” to peak-shave the generator.

I don't see any reference to a 22KW generator.
 
Do you happen to have a source from where you heard this info?

A crap generator could damage the inverter in the same way it could damage any connected device. I am not aware of any minimum gen size for the sol ark 15k.
 
I heard all of this from another Sol-ark owner. I read the under 19.2k info in the manual, saw lots of people on the forum running smaller generators and could not find a solid reference to the 22k minimum. He told me he got the recommendation from Sol-ark. I think the real world uses a lot of smaller generator. I have a ES 6500 inverter generator that is pretty clean. I am debating using a chargeverter directly to the battery to avoid inverter issues, but it sounds like I do not have to.
 
Using the limit feature, the sol-ark can draw a pretty stable load from the generator. I still would go the chargeverter route.
 
DIYrich said:
Using the limit feature, the sol-ark can draw a pretty stable load from the generator. I still would go the chargeverter route.
Click to expand...
I am just wondering why use the EG4 charger?
It seems like the all of the Generator integration is already in the Sol-Ark.
I have never heard of a 22KWh requirement, I have heard of 12KWh being required but maybe that changed..
 
I would run a Gen->EG4 Chargeverter to charge the battery bank and not run loads directly from the genny.
Much cleaner power this way and no overloading the gen.
 
robby said:
I am just wondering why use the EG4 charger?
It seems like the all of the Generator integration is already in the Sol-Ark.
I have never heard of a 22KWh requirement, I have heard of 12KWh being required but maybe that changed..
Click to expand...
I can use a cheap $400 generator to recharge the battery. The CV cleans up the power from the cheap dirty generator. Sol-ark is good if you have a good stand-by auto start generator. If you are going cheap with Plan C, CV is the way to go.
 
same here on an external charger

get 2 chargeverters and use them to charge the battery directly from the generator and totally bypass the solark

in my build thread, post #1 I layout my schematic what I have done, down a page or 2

and here for some pictures
 
robby said:
I am just wondering why use the EG4 charger?
It seems like the all of the Generator integration is already in the Sol-Ark.
I have never heard of a 22KWh requirement, I have heard of 12KWh being required but maybe that changed..
Click to expand...
Few reasons actually.

The chargeverter will handle really dirty generators (output wise) where most inverters won't.

If the generator goes bananas you lose a $400 chargeverter and not a god awful expensive inverter.

You can run multiple chargeverters which means you have spares AND you can run multiple generators at once.

The chargeverter can even be run from an inverter that's mounted in a vehicle (handy for my stuff)
 
robby said:
I am just wondering why use the EG4 charger?
Click to expand...
robby said:
It seems like the all of the Generator integration is already in the Sol-Ark.
I have never heard of a 22KWh requirement, I have heard of 12KWh being required but maybe that changed..
Click to expand...

the rule of thumb is TWICE the inverter size

it has to run the house loads in BYPASS mode, while at the same time the inverter/charger is in charger mode charging the battery
 
DIYrich said:
Using the limit feature, the sol-ark can draw a pretty stable load from the generator. I still would go the chargeverter route.
Click to expand...
Hi Rich, I can set the amp limit for charging, but it seems it will still default to pulling loads from the generator as well. That's why I started limiting gen charging time to low loads time.

Chargeverter is a possible work-around for sure, and frees up the gen port for other input, or a smart load shed.

Dave
 
OK this makes a lot of sense. My Honda produces very clean power, but it is just for grid down situations in winter, cloudy, rainy, snowy. while building the house I have a dedicated line from a generator pad to the utility room. A CV could mount right next to the battery rack. I do like the simplicity of that set-up.
 
dougbert said:
the rule of thumb is TWICE the inverter size

it has to run the house loads in BYPASS mode, while at the same time the inverter/charger is in charger mode charging the battery
Click to expand...

Hi dougbert,

The bypass explanation makes a lot of sense. It is charging the battery, so the inverter can't simultaneously charge, AND pull power from the battery at the same time. The generator has all of the work to do. If someone runs into this problem, you could get a huge generator, like you say 2x the size of the inverter, or just limit charging to times when you are not pulling big loads, and set the gen charge number to allow for some headroom. In my case, charge at 4kW and keep 3kW on standby for minimal usage while charging.
 
SunDave said:
Hi dougbert,

The bypass explanation makes a lot of sense. It is charging the battery, so the inverter can't simultaneously charge, AND pull power from the battery at the same time. The generator has all of the work to do. If someone runs into this problem, you could get a huge generator, like you say 2x the size of the inverter, or just limit charging to times when you are not pulling big loads, and set the gen charge number to allow for some headroom. In my case, charge at 4kW and keep 3kW on standby for minimal usage while charging.
Click to expand...

yep, options
the tech today is orders of magnitude of where it was just a few years ago - wonderful time to "play"
 
SolArk like most other Top Tier products should also be able to limit the draw from the GenSet by controlling the Max Charge Amp Output. Now if the Genset can only provide say 120V/40A that is your input limit, what exactly that is for charging @ 48V in Amps I'm not sure. But if the Inverter demands more & the genset can't deliver it, all sorts of nasty starts to happen.

I happen to run 24V Battery. Charger @ 80A is pulling 120V/23-25A (floats due to passthrough). The Inverter Genny handles the surge demands really well (it maxes at 4650W). My system will take the Passthrough and if its not enough the Inverter will make up the difference even while charging concurrently. Not All Inverter/Charger can do that though, Samlex is one of those that does, a Big Point when I was looking at them.

Hope it helps a bit.
 
Just ordered a CV. Actually back ordered until Mid Jan. No problem for my schedule. The inverter is just a pass through at the moment and batteries are not hooked up. I have 26 panels for the roof, waiting on standing seam mini rails. Before we move in, I really want to run the system for a bit to work out any kinks. I will add a few ground mounts on the south side to get 36 panels for 14kw of PV. Etimate for the all electric house is 18-21 KWH per day. We will be short in the winter. Thanks for all the input.
0be8164f-0ec1-44e6-a0f1-7b3c8b165147__41596.jpg
 
DIYrich said:
I can use a cheap $400 generator to recharge the battery. The CV cleans up the power from the cheap dirty generator. Sol-ark is good if you have a good stand-by auto start generator. If you are going cheap with Plan C, CV is the way to go.
Click to expand...
Very true, I had not thought about the kind of generator the OP might be using.
Sol-Arks are pretty tolerant of dirty power, but of course there is a limit.

BTW I had mentioned the EG4 Charger to Sol-Ark a long time ago and they said the only issue to watch for is the power being delivered by the charger and the PV charging should be considered in the equation.
IOW you could overload your batteries if the Sun comes out and the EG4 Charger is running.
 
Last edited:
Highly doubtful. When grid drops out when inverter is in pass through there is a momentary overload on inverter before it detects overcurrent and releases pass-through relay connection to grid. Unlikely a generator would be worse than a grid drop out.

Worse situation is having an automatic input transfer switch and immediately switching from a live generator feed by auto transfer switch with priority grid feed source immediate switch over when the generator/inverter happens to be 180 degrees out of phase with grid. When automatic transfer switch immediately jumps from generator to grid, the inverter and grid will be 180 degrees out of phase for this situation so effectively you are throwing inverter across 480 vac voltage delta from a grid source capable of high momentary current before AC input circuit breaker pops.

You must always ensure inverter's pass-through relay releases from AC input before applying a different asynchronous AC source input to inverter.

If you use Sol-Ark separate generator input, the Sol-Ark will manage the cross-over from generator to grid gracefully by first opening generator pass-through relay, and resync'g inverter to grid, before closing the grid input pass-through relay.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

R
Possible to use Sol Ark Gen terminals with a 3 Phase Generator ? Sol Ark techs said NO !
2
Replies
36
Views
1K
Cmiller
C
M
Sol-Ark with generator ATS on LOAD?
Replies
2
Views
208
timselectric
T
R
Sol - Ark 12 x2 - Absolyte GP Battery Bank x5 - 22KW Generator
Replies
2
Views
86
Ryan93
R
Tulex
Sol-Ark 15K Generator Transfer Time
Replies
8
Views
609
Tulex
Tulex
byteharmony
Relay automation of Grid and Generator - Sol Ark and AC Coupling
Replies
14
Views
716
RCinFLA
RCinFLA

diy solar

diy solar
Back
Top