New 152Ah LiFePo4 3.2 A-Grade cells for $42

[Frank in Thailand]

I just ordered 16 x 152Ah "A-Grade" cells from Alibaba, for just $43 per cell. (+ connector / bus bar)
Door to door transport, all tax, customs clearance and handling paid $ 12 per cell. (and we live in so-called "remote area")

886 USD for 16X 3.2V 152Ah.
51.2x152= 7.782,4 Watts.
that is per watt $ 0,11385

The specification sheet was made in august 2018. (see next post).
This could be that the cells are made in august 2018, but are never used.
It also can be that the cells are newer... I won't know till I receive them!

Link to product page: 3.2V 152Ah LiFePO4 lithium batteries for $43 !!
-- Sold out -- -- Sold out -- -- Sold out --
Hard to keep up with those guys, new stock, priced even little better $ 42

Link to new offer from this seller: 120Ah for $37.50, 280Ah for $73.80

some pictures of the product:





I can't find a way to upload the PDF, the 8 pages as jpeg go in next post.


I also ordered the $72 BMS Will showed in one of his videos.

The $72 BMS (temporary out of stock??)

16 string, 320A ...
I'm sure it will be fine for my solar system (But I won't try to get 320A!!)

 

[Frank in Thailand]

pages from the specification sheet:










I really hope they are the real deal.

To test I've ordered this 150W Battery tester

It was the cheapest link I could find

The next weeks is waiting for the products to arrive.

When they arrived, I'll update you of the test results!!

 

[nwillitts]

will be watching.

 

[JoeHam]

Be careful to stay below 150W with the battery tester. It will take you a little while with those batteries, just be patient!

 

[Bob B]

There are so many good deals now days it makes your head spin ..... Please keep us informed how the shipping works out and how they test.

 

[Turd Furguson]

wow. This kills the BLS deal for the same cells... although those are 2019 vs. these 2018 cells. Be sure to test thoroughly and report back.

Thanks for posting the spec sheet.

 

[upnorthandpersonal]

I just asked them a quote to deliver 64 to Finland. Let's see, if that's not too silly and I can get a sample that tests ok I'll have my new set of batteries.
Thanks for the heads up!

 

[nwillitts]

link to BMS please?
never mind. i found it.

 

[upnorthandpersonal]

Ok, so I asked for a quote for 64 cells. Cost: $2752 with additional shipping/customs/taxes of $980, delivered to my door. Total: $3732 or €3455 at current exchange rate.

I might just take a chance and just order them for that price...

 

[ghostwriter66]

link to BMS please?
never mind. i found it.

While initially I was supportive of the $72 BMS that Will had posted -- it was difficult for me to get working -- and didn't provide the amperage pass-thrus that I require ... I think that you should be looking at the Chargery 8T or 16T models ... These are only a few bucks more and a night and day difference in ease of use and capabilities ... There has been a ton of stuff on this forum posted about the Chargery so you just need to do a little SEARCH ...

 

[Frank in Thailand]

62 cells for $3732 ? That is a good price, considering the distance.

I tried to change my order to 280Ah cells, as they have good price also. (and paid for it)
(Link to the 280Ah for $82,-)
2 days later I receive message that the 152 where already shipped and at Thai customs.
After some talks he'll send an other set of 16*152Ah, for the price agreed.
that is 32* 152Ah for $1602,- include ddp door to door transport, all costs paid.
normally that would be higher.

I'm not sure about their production date. Can be 2018, can be 2019.
The test sheet is from 2018

Chargery s16 is double the price, and needs relays, what adds an other $ 70,-
I would expect that you will get additional features for $140 extra

For me, I don't realy need to see the amperage, but I did order this volt- ampere meter
Volt - Ampere meter --- and shunt
max 99.99 volt and 99.99 amp .
Total price? $ 2.50 + $ 2 = $4.50

Today fly back to Bangkok, next day to Udon Thani and few hours later we are home again!
The first set of the batteries should have arrived, next set next week.

(We are in Europe, The Neterlands now)

My Revo II MPPT Inverter (highly recommended!) can do 50A charging for lithium per unit.
I use 3 x the 3.2kw model.
The 27 (3 * 9 ) 330w poly panels provide enough to charge them.

I need to play to find the good balance for "slow" charging, and be sure they are fully charged if it rains in the afternoon.
To my understanding charging at 0.2C increases the life cycle of the LiFePo4
2 * 152 = 304Ah, that would make each Revo II set to 20A charging speed. (= 60A)

First fly to BKK!

 

[upnorthandpersonal]

Have a nice trip! I'll wait for your reply with info here before pressing the trigger and buying the 64 I got a quote for

Edit: asked for a quote for 32 x 280Ah cells: $2624 plus $968 for transport/customs/etc. So that is $3592 or €3257. I might just do that one instead...

 

[Frank in Thailand]

At my house a big bag with in it 3 boxes was waiting for me to unwrap.

All cells are safely individual packed.
All cells have original QR code.
(I have no idea how to use this QR code. My standard QR code app does not recognise them. Is there a special app?)

the cells look unused. No scratches on the poles. A few have straight scratch from rasor blade (not by me)

they look genuine new cells.

they all are 3.29-3.30 volt.
sometimes my multimeter go between 29 and 30... I guess they are 3.295

All 16, maybe 0.005- 0.01 volt difference

my discharge unit from AliExpress did not yet arrived.
it will take a few extra days or weeks due to Corona.
same goes for my BMS, and my voltage/current meters..

Even my lifepo4 charger is still on its way to Thailand!

Yes, the 280 look nice.
If you don't have a space issue...
Take the 152Ah.

You can serie and parallel them, and still use one BMS.

64 battery is 4 in parallel, and 16*4 in series.

If it is for solar, your discharge probably will stay below 150A
(Roughly 7500watt)

Most BMS have 50A charge, what should be enough.
Even with 64*152Ah (+/- 32Kw) or
32*280Ah (+/- 29Kw)

280Ah is higher price and 3Kw less.

Just be patient.
That it looks good on the outside, doesn't have to be good on the inside!!

I expect to give full update next week.

For now I am carefully positive.

Link to product page: 3.2V 152Ah LiFePO4 lithium batteries for $43 !!

 

[Supervstech]

Ooh... I am not a fan of using pan head machine screws. I really like studs, and nuts... so much safer, and easier to assemble, also, less chance of overtightening them and damaging the cells.
Looks awesome though!

 

[Supervstech]

Ooh... I am not a fan of using pan head machine screws. I really like studs, and nuts... so much safer, and easier to assemble, also, less chance of overtightening them and damaging the cells.
Looks awesome though!

God... re reading that, it could really be a porn dialog... jeez, what were men thinking when we named these things?
I work with gas lines all the time... you should hear the names for those parts!

 

[ghostwriter66]

God... re reading that, it could really be a porn dialog... jeez, what were men thinking when we named these things?
I work with gas lines all the time... you should hear the names for those parts!

I work with over 250 oil-hands at this site alone -- - EVERY job, part, system, employee-status, etc has a name that probably could be taken the wrong way ... you just try not to laugh out loud ... A few times a week you hear someone yell to go get one of those Fingers to do this or that ... A Finger is a person that has been in the field long enough to no longer be a worm but is not smart enough to be considered a Hand. ie. Drill Finger, Frac Finger, etc .. so basically a clueless Rookie ... BUT still everytime we have someone from Corporate come down that is either female or over-sensitive - or just a snowflake we have to give them a "trigger warning" of what they are about to walk into but i am pretty sure that I will never be able to go work in a corporate environment again after this ...

 

[Frank in Thailand]

Yes, don't worry about it.

Thanks for the heads up.
It made me look more careful to the bolts provided, together with the supplied connectors.

I can't just agree.

If the correct combination of bolt /panhead screws and connectors (+ springwashers) is provided, there is no additional risk.

Most studs are " headless Bolts"
Long thread that are inserted with (or without) sealant.

You place a connector (+ springwasher) and nut on this stud (or headless bolt)

When you tighten, the force on the aluminium thread is the same as with the panhead screw.
Danger of damage stay the same!

If the bolts / panhead screws you use have a thread longer then the thread in the aluminium...
Yes, you are "screwed"

In my situation, the panhead screws with one connector and no washer is a problem. (!!!)
(Thanks for the heads up)

The screw inserted by hand without connector leaves too much space.
The connector can slide in from the side, making it a just not right enough fit.

For sure, if I would use screwdriver to try to have the connector a "strong" fit, it probably will damage the aluminium thread.

Using a simple springwasher (not provided) will prevent this danger. (Or where needed 2 connectors)

Thread that would have been 0.5 mm deeper (or less long panhead) would have prevented this from becoming an issue.

This might be a reason for the low price??

I will always suggest to use springwasher, especially if the battery endure fibrations!

Using studs or screws...
The amount of force stay the same.

The studs ain't aluminium, but the battery pole is.

 

[Bob B]

It sure seems to me that the threads would have more chance of failure if a bolt / screw is driven in under increasing pressure than if a stainless steel rod is threaded in under little to no pressure apply a thread lock and allow to set ....and then pressure is applied externally with a nut .... to say it another way .....twisting the aluminum threads with pressure seems to be more risky than applying the pressure after the rod is threaded in.

 

[Supervstech]

Yes, don't worry about it.

Thanks for the heads up.
It made me look more careful to the bolts provided, together with the supplied connectors.

I can't just agree.

If the correct combination of bolt /panhead screws and connectors (+ springwashers) is provided, there is no additional risk.

Most studs are " headless Bolts"
Long thread that are inserted with (or without) sealant.

You place a connector (+ springwasher) and nut on this stud (or headless bolt)

When you tighten, the force on the aluminium thread is the same as with the panhead screw.
Danger of damage stay the same!

If the bolts / panhead screws you use have a thread longer then the thread in the aluminium...
Yes, you are "screwed"

In my situation, the panhead screws with one connector and no washer is a problem. (!!!)
(Thanks for the heads up)

The screw inserted by hand without connector leaves too much space.
The connector can slide in from the side, making it a just not right enough fit.

For sure, if I would use screwdriver to try to have the connector a "strong" fit, it probably will damage the aluminium thread.

Using a simple springwasher (not provided) will prevent this danger. (Or where needed 2 connectors)

Thread that would have been 0.5 mm deeper (or less long panhead) would have prevented this from becoming an issue.

This might be a reason for the low price??

I will always suggest to use springwasher, especially if the battery endure fibrations!

Using studs or screws...
The amount of force stay the same.

The studs ain't aluminium, but the battery pole is.

Oh, absolutely, if care is taken of the thread depth, pan head screws can be fine.
I like studs, because they can be set in place by hand, then you know what thickness the bussbars can be, also, when assembling, the studs all stick up, and the bussbars CANNOT spin around shorting something out.

 

[BiduleOhm]

When you tighten, the force on the aluminium thread is the same as with the panhead screw.
Danger of damage stay the same!

Actually no, studs are often used instead of bolts when you want less chances to damage the thing you're threading them in (for example to fasten the exhaust header to the head in a car), especially if said thing is of a softer material than the bolt/stud (again, heads are often aluminium, like our cells terminals).

Also, when you torque a nut on a stud the torque is more precise than with a bolt (less surface to create friction).

There's other advantages too but they have been posted already (mainly no risk of bolt being too long and no sliding of bus bars).

Personally I'd always put studs instead of bolts on cells terminals. It's basically the same cost and it can save an expensive cell...

I will always suggest to use springwasher, especially if the battery endure fibrations!

Spring washers are the lowest tech if you want vibrations mitigation. Nord-lock washers are far better, Loctite is too, the best being safety wire.

 

[Frank in Thailand]

Yes, lowest tech, but widely available.
I live in Isaan Thailand, close to Laos border.

All you can find is low tech!!
(And the rest you order from China)

Yes, you are correct.
Studs are better in this situation.
I didn't look at it this way.

Sadly..
Stainless steel rods need to be ordered from China if I like to have them.

Or modify a bolt with a grinder
(If stainless steel can be found.)
Our hardware stores have 99% low tech / low quality.
Probably the stuff to low quality to sell to Europe or USA...

Amazing Thailand.
Zero warranty and low cost low quality.

The first few months here I was surprised so many things where broken, and people don't bother to repair.
Now I understand why.
No use.
The next one you buy will die also fast.
If not mandatory, you don't need it!

In Thailand product tests are done at the store.
Printers, chainsaws, pumps...
The store opens the box, put all parts together and tests it for you.
And when it works, that is all the warranty you have.

Nord-lock washers?
I found one hardware store that have them, if you are lucky even in the size you need
Stainless steel ones?
Don't push your luck..?

 

[Supervstech]

Chevrolet vehicles have batteries with threaded side terminals.
Most batteries now have poorly cast threads, and shallow depth holes.
A VERY common scenario is the bolt gets loose, so we tighten it more... this usually results in the threads stripping out, or in the case of dual batteries, there is a lead spacer between two cables, and the spacer crushes under tightening force, and the cables get loose... using a stud prevents the battery failure, and prevents the bolt from spinning out the threads, also prevents the overtightened bolt from going through the terminal into the acid and leaking out...

 

[Frank in Thailand]

AU.... Chevrolet...
Painful topic in Thailand!!
My brother in law bought a Chevrolet last year... He ain't happy!!!
(Chevrolet closed the main factory in Thailand and sold the remaining stock for 1/2 price)

Actually, he have big problems.
In Thailand many (poor) Thai take a huge loan to buy a car. (and look wealthy)
But if the market value of the car drops, you need to pay that difference..
in this situation, he was requested to pay the difference, $15.000 this year..
He can't, he can hardly make the payments as the are..

But good to know his batteries have threaded side terminals

I stand corrected. Using studs is the better way to go.

For me, for now..
I need to wait for the BMS to arrive, like the Ah capacity tester, and the second batch of the 152Ah (link)

 

[BiduleOhm]

Yes, lowest tech, but widely available.
I live in Isaan Thailand, close to Laos border.

All you can find is low tech!!
(And the rest you order from China)

I can definitely understand finding proper stuff in Thailand is a problem.

Can you order online for most of the small stuff?

 

[Frank in Thailand]

I can definitely understand finding proper stuff in Thailand is a problem.

Can you order online for most of the small stuff?

Luckily, Yes. Via a site called Lazada (Thai variant of Alibaba like aliexpress with own transport line to Thailand) or Shopee.
And if you are extra lucky, the seller have stock in Thailand, making delivery only a few days.
Most (but not all) have higher price than Aliexpress.

Apparently the Chargery BMS16T does have external communication possible via RS232 !!!
Cool, as I have one DB9 Interface RS232 Bluetooth left over from previous project

Now only find matching software

I have contacted them, if it can work, and they know compatible software,
the BMS wil be the Chargery BMS16T 300A, for $136.95

For relay (Contactor) I'll use the 200A DC contactor MZJ-200A (+/- $ 25), or the NO 12V \ 400A DC Contactor (+/-$ 40)
(the same 400A relay is at the chargery store $ 60.59 !!)
Probably the $ 40,- 400A Contactor.
I already use them (48 volt type) since august 2019 for my emergency power cut (the red mushroom) Together with their little brother of 50A for the solar panels and wind turbines, one button make a full dead stop of all power in the house.
They don't get hot and work just fine!
Apparently they can do 20.000 times, I hope not even to reach the 100.
Connect one time and never need to release!