Off grid incinerating toilets. Who uses one?

[OM617YOTA]

That's gotta smell pretty bad, or does it?

Edit: Should have read the rest of the thread before responding! Ignore my prattle below, actual experienced user chimed in.

No clue, no personal experience. Curious myself.

The Ambition Strikes folks have their incinerating toilet venting right next to their patio, and haven't mentioned anything. I believe most incinerating toilets run a fan continuously at low power, and at higher power when incinerating, and that might be key. As the saying goes, the solution to pollution is dilution - burn/evaporate waste slowly and dilute it in enough clean air.

It'll also only be actively burning for a few minutes, a few times per day, not a continuous stench emitter. Looks like human bladder capacity is 16oz or a little less. If you stuck 16oz of water in a pot on a stove and turned it to high, it wouldn't take long to evaporate all the water away. Most incinerating toilets are more powerful than the average stove top, so even less time, in theory.

I'd definitely have a care where it was vented to. Obviously only the paper liner, TP, and human waste goes in the toilet. No tampons, condoms, or wipes.

 

[Madcodger]

Edit: Should have read the rest of the thread before responding! Ignore my prattle below, actual experienced user chimed in.

You weren't far off. They just don't use any power at all when not in a burn cycle (no continuous fan). I'd never install one near a patio or deck, but I wouldn't vent a fireplace or stove there, either. Basically, you'd never guess it was waste burning if you didn't know it. It smells like paper/wood/campfire, with only modest amounts of actual smoke, in our experience. Works great for the situation.

 

[SunDave]

For another data point. At an off-grid cabin, we used a poly septic tank. Around 2000 gal I believe, and we just have it pumped occasionally. Has been about once every 3 years, and that is without a drain field. Would be different if we lived there.

Another potential option though if your area allows it. Doesn't require power for pumps, etc.

 

[Nan_wpg]

If you can accomadate a septic tank these toilets are not for you. Just put in a tank and have it pumped out.

They are perfect for us (no grid no nothing, remote boat access,property).

 

[SSC00]

A part of me wonders why there hasn't been a bigger push for the use of incinerating toilets in desert areas where they don't have much water. There is far more solar energy in a desert than there is water so it would sort of make sense to do it. I doubt that it would increase total energy use all that much - like maybe by 5%+ or something.

 

[littleharbor2]

A part of me wonders why there hasn't been a bigger push for the use of incinerating toilets in desert areas where they don't have much water. There is far more solar energy in a desert than there is water so it would sort of make sense to do it. I doubt that it would increase total energy use all that much - like maybe by 5%+ or something.

Wise thinking. I lived on Catalina Island for 48 years. There isn't a lot of fresh water over there either. There are 2 desalinization plants there but the wisest thing they ever did over there was to implement a salt water system for toilet flushing. If they could do this worldwide many of our water problems would cease.

 

[KITROBASKIN]

Composting is cheaper than incinerating, right?

 

[fatjay]

Does it work with a bidet?

 

[SSC00]

Wise thinking. I lived on Catalina Island for 48 years. There isn't a lot of fresh water over there either. There are 2 desalinization plants there but the wisest thing they ever did over there was to implement a salt water system for toilet flushing. If they could do this worldwide many of our water problems would cease.

right. Its not that there is a resource problem with water, its that the solutions are more expensive than an alternative like this. Most people want to frame it like its some giant climate debacle or some conspiracy to hold back access to water when its really just that water/sewer infrastructure is really expensive. Sewer is very expensive and if the gov stopped essentially subsidizing it you would see more things like incinerating toilets come about. It honestly wouldn't be too difficult to make an incinerating toilet that people would want to use.

 

[SSC00]

Composting is cheaper than incinerating, right?

Yes, but its easier to mess up the composting process, which could result in disease. Its a lot easier to get more universally consistent results with an incinerating toilet than a composting toilet.

 

[SSC00]

Does it work with a bidet?

It probably wouldn't work well with current designs, but it may be possible to design one where it works well with it

 

[Checkthisout]

Following this thread.

Looking at properties which may be off grid entirely, or not have a septic system. An incinerating toilet is a lot less expensive than a septic system.

What happened to digging a hole?

 

[SSC00]

What happened to digging a hole?

you still have to either pump those out or you have to bury it properly and move on to another location once the level gets high enough.

 

[HalfBaked]

Another off-grid toilet option is a vermicomposting toilet. It's essentially a standard flush toilet plumbed to a 275gal ibc tote with woodchips and worms. Cost maybe $100 to build, no electricity, gas or pumping. See vermicompostingtoilets.net

 

[justgary]

We started our solar journey because we bought an Envirotet composting toilet almost twenty years ago. It wants a fan running full time to "dry the mass," so I put in a 12v solar system.

It is a bit big, but we have never smelled it at all. We don't stay there more than a dozen days a year, so it goes several years before I empty it.

 

[Checkthisout]

you still have to either pump those out or you have to bury it properly and move on to another location once the level gets high enough.

Yeah, so?

 

[littleharbor2]

right. Its not that there is a resource problem with water, its that the solutions are more expensive than an alternative like this. Most people want to frame it like its some giant climate debacle or some conspiracy to hold back access to water when its really just that water/sewer infrastructure is really expensive. Sewer is very expensive and if the gov stopped essentially subsidizing it you would see more things like incinerating toilets come about. It honestly wouldn't be too difficult to make an incinerating toilet that people would want to use.

Where in the USA are you? The Desert Southwest doesn't have an abundance of water. The Colorado River is virtually used up before it reaches the sea. This has turned the vast Colorado River Delta from a lush ecosystem into a dead moonscape and has caused huge problems with the marine life in the upper Sea of Cortez. Of course, lawns need water, pools need to be filled and every toilet needs fresh water. This mindset needs to change.

 

[SSC00]

Where in the USA are you? The Desert Southwest doesn't have an abundance of water. The Colorado River is virtually used up before it reaches the sea. This has turned the vast Colorado River Delta from a lush ecosystem into a dead moonscape and has caused huge problems with the marine life in the upper Sea of Cortez. Of course, lawns need water, pools need to be filled and every toilet needs fresh water. This mindset needs to change.

Realistically, if people wanted to, its possible to desalinate water and pump it inland. Or could create very large underground reservoirs that could collect what little storm water comes around out there and collect water from the river or from treated wastewater and store it in a location where evaporation losses are at a minimum. Both would be extremely expensive to do, so an alternative like incinerating toilets is more feasible. This is why I said that water access is more of an issue of expense than it is a loss of resource. The west has FAR more solar resources than water, hence why using PV to have incinerating toilets makes sense. The designs on those things aren't even optimized yet, so its possible to make them more efficient. Take this concept too - https://showerloop.org/ - and also apply it to laundry water and it would basically reduce indoor water use by almost 70% - maybe more. It would initially be really expensive to do it, but it might come down in price enough in the future if it gets advanced. I personally would not mind advancing the design of either (mostly incinerating toilet first) but I don't have the funds or the marketing skills to help promote anything. Would even be an uphill battle too because environmentalists will only accept composting toilets as an alternative because they have this inflated idea of a circular economy with the waste but don't understand that most people don't want to mess with their own poo and that enough failure would cause a public health crisis.


Few people out west - especially in Las Vegas - actually have lawns that they water. You probably only see that in California by far uses the most water from the Colorado river. I think a huge part of the river is diverted to go into the Salton Sea anyways and the justification is that its a bird sanctuary even though the sea was created by mistake.

 

[offgridandy]

Hi, I run a small off grid glamping operation and have a Cinderella toilet LPG fired unit for visitors to use. The unit has been operating for 3 years faultlessly.

The LPG fired incinerator requires a dc power supply for the ignition circuit, a small battery will do although i actually have 240vAC to the glamping dome so I have a small transformer.
Yes you must use the paper bags or the stainless steel bowl will get spoilt.
Yes you can pee in the Cinderella although I actually have a urinal alongside.
It takes about 2 hrs to burn off crap and pee and you must or should fire the loo every time it is used.
Once it is firing, if you open the toilet lid, the firing stops so the loo can be used again, don't have to wait 2 hrs. Shut the lid again and reignite.
The back of the Cindrella has a 110mm vent pipe to outside to remnove smells, never had any comments from visitors
Empty the ashes about every 3 weeks or so with my visitors usage, Couples only, no kids.
Gas consumption is minimal. Can't measure accuratley as the same gas bottle also provides for my visitors cooker. 1 18Kg bottle a year maximum.

Cinderella is a Norwegian brand and the build quality is excellent. Would 100% recomend, cost effective compared with a septic tank and in the UK you need no permit. I tend not to tell authorites anything as it only causes problems. Benefit of being off grid, nobody knows.

Cost in the UK to purchase in the UK in 2021 was £3000 stirling.

 

[SSC00]

Hi, I run a small off grid glamping operation and have a Cinderella toilet LPG fired unit for visitors to use. The unit has been operating for 3 years faultlessly.

The LPG fired incinerator requires a dc power supply for the ignition circuit, a small battery will do although i actually have 240vAC to the glamping dome so I have a small transformer.
Yes you must use the paper bags or the stainless steel bowl will get spoilt.
Yes you can pee in the Cinderella although I actually have a urinal alongside.
It takes about 2 hrs to burn off crap and pee and you must or should fire the loo every time it is used.
Once it is firing, if you open the toilet lid, the firing stops so the loo can be used again, don't have to wait 2 hrs. Shut the lid again and reignite.
The back of the Cindrella has a 110mm vent pipe to outside to remnove smells, never had any comments from visitors
Empty the ashes about every 3 weeks or so with my visitors usage, Couples only, no kids.
Gas consumption is minimal. Can't measure accuratley as the same gas bottle also provides for my visitors cooker. 1 18Kg bottle a year maximum.

Cinderella is a Norwegian brand and the build quality is excellent. Would 100% recomend, cost effective compared with a septic tank and in the UK you need no permit. I tend not to tell authorites anything as it only causes problems. Benefit of being off grid, nobody knows.

Cost in the UK to purchase in the UK in 2021 was £3000 stirling.

How many uses can each toilet handle in one day?