Ordered new batteries from USA/Canadian company and they are not honouring their warranty

[TomC4306]

meter said 0 volts and zero

Exactly.
It shouldn't say zero volts. When it says zero volts something has disconnected the battery from whatever meter it is that you're looking at. You're testing before declaring these batteries bad should be a little bit more sophisticated than you have displayed to date.

Edit...
But good luck

 

[740GLE]

I’d pick up a small bench top power supply set the voltage at 14v, and max of 1 amp current and let it sit and watch if the current tails off. See if the BMS hits high voltage disconnect (if all cells are balanced, it shouldn’t).

Using a stand alone Lifepo charge with high current is great if you’re cells a healthy and balanced. What I think my help your batteries is slowly bringing up the voltage or the BMS try and balance the cells out.

 

[MisterSandals]

I also checked with my solar system supplier installer I purchased most of my panels and system parts from , and this is what they recommended

That works for 2 batteries but becomes increasingly worse as you add batteries.

There is a terrific thread on this topic. Read the first 4 posts to understand the issue and what the solutions do. You can then scroll thru the pages looking at the pictures. Find one with 6 batteries and "best" in the description.

This is likely some of your issue. I think there is a moderate chance that better charge practices, described many times here, with a lower voltage and a full tail charge, are most of your other issues. Fixing these may be "good enough", and maybe not.

Calculation of parallel string battery currents

Hi, everybody! I'm a retired EE. I didn't want my EE skills to fade away after retirment, so I exercise them when I can. Whenever I see a non-trivial circuit analysis problem on one of various forums I frequent, I challenge myself to solve it. Recently I watched Will's video about current...

diysolarforum.com

 

[Chris vandette]

Exactly.
It shouldn't say zero volts. When it says zero volts something has disconnected the battery from whatever meter it is that you're looking at. You're testing before declaring these batteries bad should be a little bit more sophisticated than you have displayed to date.

Edit...
But good luck

Hello

I see your point , I should have said zero change in zolts , once it reach’s 14.6 and stops , not that I expect it to go higher anyhow as that’s what the charger is set for

if no amps are going in and the voltage does not change , there is no more power going into the battery , as no amperage is detected no more charge with a unchanged or zero change voltage

without Amperage, there is no power movement

yes I admit the testing may be crud , it’s the same testing will prowse and others do to test there batteries and go after the sellers on abilbaba when they fail

the tech at Renogy I did get to talk to said if it was up to him , he would like to test the batteries himself , but did admit the tests where valid enough for him to say something was a issue and defective

but he only deals with USA issues not Canada

anyhow , thanks for the comment

take care

 

[Chris vandette]

That works for 2 batteries but becomes increasingly worse as you add batteries.

There is a terrific thread on this topic. Read the first 4 posts to understand the issue and what the solutions do. You can then scroll thru the pages looking at the pictures. Find one with 6 batteries and "best" in the description.

This is likely some of your issue. I think there is a moderate chance that better charge practices, described many times here, with a lower voltage and a full tail charge, are most of your other issues. Fixing these may be "good enough", and maybe not.

Calculation of parallel string battery currents

Hi, everybody! I'm a retired EE. I didn't want my EE skills to fade away after retirment, so I exercise them when I can. Whenever I see a non-trivial circuit analysis problem on one of various forums I frequent, I challenge myself to solve it. Recently I watched Will's video about current...

diysolarforum.com

Hello

thank you so much for the link

i will give it a look and see what I can change

thanks again

 

[MisterSandals]

if no amps are going in and the voltage does not change , there is no more power going into the battery , as no amperage is detected no more charge with a unchanged or zero change voltage

Thats the crux of what everybody is trying to tell you. At 14.6V its a near certainty that charging is stopped by the BMS disconnect. There is no tail current or time for any balancing to occur. Its an incomplete charge and an out of balance charge. This will get worse and worse and the perceived capacity of your battery will decrease until remedied with proper charging. It might take a few cycles, but it definitely will help.

 

[Chris vandette]

Hello

thank you for your answer

I get the message

but please note in this thread alone i have been told at least 4 different voltages to charge at and just about as many if not more different ways to fix the issue

so where do I stand especially -when you say that’s what everyone has been telling me - its just as bad as the movie he said she said , lol

At least 4 different versions if not more of what to charge at and fix the issue

the battery manufacture says charge the battery from 14.2 to 14.6

so why say that when it should only be 14.6

I have cycled the battery several times using a 14.6 volt charger and nothing seems to be getting better

I will keep at it and take a look at the video

cheers

 

[MisterSandals]

the battery manufacture says charge the battery from 14.2 to 14.6

so why say that when it should only be 14.6

I have cycled the battery several times using a 14.6 volt charger and nothing seems to be getting better

I understand how many different things that have been said.

Most of the recommendations are for well balanced batteries in good order. Yours need some help getting the cells in balance. In order to get your cells behaving, you need to take the advice that allows the BMS time enough to do some balancing, and let your cells absorb as evenly as possible.

At 14.6V, thats 3.65Vpc which is nearly impossible for any battery to achieve. It would require every cell reach 3.65Vpc at exactly the same time. I've done many hundreds of charge cycles with half a dozen batteries and i would be surprised if ANY of them were ever this balanced.

I charge to 13.8V and absorb for an hour on my chargers that allow it. I get 99+% Soc.

I understand that your charger only charges to 14.6V. This is a big part of your problem. It <nearly> guarantees your BMS abruptly stops the charging.

 

[740GLE]

A cheap bench top power supply would be able to provide you with enough flexibility to try and revive one battery.

If you’re able to walk the voltage up slowly and notice current isn’t falling off, that means the BMS is trying to balance the cells. Let is bake and cross your fingers.

Do a capacity test (same method as before) and see if it provided any change.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

I get the message

but please note in this thread alone i have been told at least 4 different voltages to charge at and just about as many if not more different ways to fix the issue

Not being mean or unkind but you didn’t get the message- basically any top-value voltage that’s 14.55 or below will continue supplying current without the BMS’s stopping the charge is the message.
But a lower charging voltage (13.8) than max charge spec over a longer time period keeps the bms closed so cells can continue to charge rather than the bms opening the circuit.

charge to 13.8V and absorb for an hour on my chargers that allow it. I get 99+% Soc

That is the advice I’d follow. Not that other people are wrong or whatever but that ain’t going shut down your bms. Actually fully charging will happen. 14.6 would do the trick for fla however.

 

[740GLE]

12V 20A AC-to-DC LFP Portable Battery Charger

The Renogy 20A AC-to-DC Battery charger is an automated, portable battery charger intended for 12V Lithium-iron phosphate (LFP) batteries. 10% off: Renogy10off

www.renogy.com

Is this the charger? Can you test the voltage at the battery terminals once the light turns solid green?

 

[400bird]

Do you have the ability to read cell voltages on these batteries? If so, you should be able to watch the cell voltages and see how out of balance the cells are.

At 14.6V, thats 3.65Vpc which is nearly impossible for any battery to achieve. It would require every cell reach 3.65Vpc at exactly the same time. I've done many hundreds of charge cycles with half a dozen batteries and i would be surprised if ANY of them were ever this balanced.

Have you ever seen a pack where two cells hit 3.65 at the same time? My lifepo4 experience is different with more cells in series, but even then we always have one single cell hit 3.65 before the rest, even when well balanced.

My point is that trying to charge to any set battery voltage can be problematic when you don't understand the problem/process behind the scenes. Charging current should start to tail off as a single cell starts to climb closer to 3.65. Once the first cell hits 3.65, ideal charging current would equal balance current.
This is why recommendations are all over the place, no one knows what's going on with your cells.

Also, Renogy is a North American company. Their product line fooled me.

 

[JeepHammer]

Hello

I purchased 4 batteries from brand x - they are 170 amp hrs with a 5 yr warranty , 1- year full warranty then prorated post that

I will try and make this mess brief

i ordered 3 batteries then a week or so later I ordered a 4th battery , the price was good so why not

they shipped me 2 from the first ordered and a week later the one from the second order arrived , hey where is the 3rd battery from my first order

it took them a month or so to get me the last one ( battery number 3) from the first order , and it involved mega amounts of emails and getting the bbb involved , find out brand x needed to resign there license to ship with purolator

just days before i get the last battery from the first order brand x is panic emailing and calling me to refuse 3 of the batteries being delivered

I have no clue what’s going on ,delivery day , purolator just drops off 4 batteries and there gone , it’s covid and they don’t want any contact with customers and I didn’t see them anyhow

so in the end I find out that someone at brand x had resent the first order of 3 batteries to the warehouse and also the request for the missing battery to be shipped once brand x got permission to ship batteries again

i email brand x they say keep the extra 3 it’s to much to ship back to the warehouse , also they didn’t tell me but canada law says that a shipping mistake like this I get to keep the items

so I use 6 of the batteries in my solar system on my Rv , I have to reconfigure the space for the seventh battery so I never use it and keep it at home and play with it now and then

so the end of the season I want to test the capacity to make sure the setting on the charge control is okay , set for 14.2

well argh , all 7 batteries are well below capacity , anywhere from 50-70 percent of capacity, I do. 2 different tests like will prouse

contact brand x and it has been a month of email tag , as they don’t have a Canada support number just a USA one and I don’t have a plan and I have heard of people on hold for hours , email is my only option

they admit the batteries are defective but are stalling at doing anything , plus insist on only replacing the 4

what do you think I should do and should they replace all 7

About the only protections you have across borders is,
Use a credit card with good claw back policies.

Many credit cards provide insurance on purchases, look into this. You obviously got damaged or used batteries. If you bought 'New', the credit card company may get involved.

Get the dispute process started.

Once the seller gets the dispute notification, you will get their attention since they don't want to be cut off from payment streams.

See if your state, or federal government has consumer protection services. Official looking letters from governments always get the attention of crooked sellers.

Don't know if you will get proper cells, or full/partial refund offer, but they usually open conversation/make contact when that stuff rolls in...