Renogy 3000W Inverter Charger cooked my AGM batteries

[Beeb1]

I have a school bus conversion. I installed solar and a 12v system about 5 years ago. I recently upgraded to 1350 watts and installed a Renogy 3000W inverter charger and ran AC wiring through the bus. I've turned on the Renogy a few times before to test everything, and everything seemed fine. The plan has been to move back into our bus and leave town this coming weekend to travel out West full-time. Today was my first day working in the bus on my desktop computer.

My system:
375Ah AGM batteries (3 125Ah batteries connected in parallel)
1300W solar with 2 MPPT charge controllers
3000W Renogy inverter charger

The batteries were at 70% this morning due to a lot of rain the last few days. I plugged into shore power and turned on my desktop. No other loads were on AC power, and the DC power was only powering some LED lights, a small 12v fridge, and Starlink (no more than a 10A draw total when the fridge cycled). Everything seemed fine until around 4pm.

At 4pm, the propane detector started to beep. It has given me false alarms before, so I checked for propane leaks, decided there were none, shut it off and ordered a new one online. About an hour later, my wife came in and noticed she smelled a rotten egg smell toward the front of the bus (where the electrical system is). I was working in the back of the bus, so I hadn't noticed it. We tracked it down and realized it was coming from the battery compartment, and the compartment itself was warm to the touch.

I quickly checked the battery monitor (Victron BM700). It said the batteries were 100% full with a voltage of 14-something. But it also said it still had a net-gain of 500+ watts (it was already dark out, so this must have been coming from the Renogy). I don't understand why the Renogy was still putting in 500+ watts when the batteries were already charged to 100%. I shut everything down immediately. I opened the battery compartment and felt the batteries. They were warm to the touch, borderline hot. The rotten egg smell was much stronger when I opened the compartment. After 20 minutes or so, I had grabbed my laser thermometer and checked the battery temps. They were at around 130 degrees Fahrenheit.

Now I have the batteries completely disconnected and sitting outside.

I'm wondering what to do from here. I don't know why the Renogy over-charged the batteries. I want to confirm that I had it on the correct setting (I'm 99% sure I did), but I'm going to let the batteries cool down overnight before connecting the Renogy to one of them to power it up and check the setting.

Questions:

• Are my batteries toast? (I assume they are)
• Is my Renogy going to do that again?
• What should I do going forward? I'm assuming I need new batteries and possibly a new inverter charger. I want one that is reliable and safe and not going to burn our bus down with us in it.
• What batteries and inverter charger do I get?
• Where can I get them so I can have them as soon as possible? (again, we were planning to move into the bus full-time in 4 days)

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I don't understand why the Renogy was still putting in 500+ watts when the batteries were already charged to 100%.

Likely because it has no idea the batteries were at 100% since there's no communication between the devices, and it was charging based on its own criteria.

I shut everything down immediately. I opened the battery compartment and felt the batteries. They were warm to the touch, borderline hot. The rotten egg smell was much stronger when I opened the compartment. After 20 minutes or so, I had grabbed my laser thermometer and checked the battery temps. They were at around 130 degrees Fahrenheit.

Your AGM have almost certainly sustained damage in the form of electrolyte loss, reduced capacity and increased internal resistance. I wouldn't write them off, but the outlook isn't good.

I'm wondering what to do from here. I don't know why the Renogy over-charged the batteries. I want to confirm that I had it on the correct setting (I'm 99% sure I did), but I'm going to let the batteries cool down overnight before connecting the Renogy to one of them to power it up and check the setting.

If you do not have AC connected to the input of the inverter, it can't charge.

Questions:

• Are my batteries toast? (I assume they are)

probably

• Is my Renogy going to do that again?

Probably, but that may not be its fault.

• What should I do going forward? I'm assuming I need new batteries and possibly a new inverter charger. I want one that is reliable and safe and not going to burn our bus down with us in it.

The likely explanation is that the inverter/charger wasn't configured properly.

A link to the charger manual would be very helpful.

 

[pollenface]

Damn, once you smell rotten eggs there's no coming back

Batteries can usually handle some light over charging and still be somewhat functional, my 150ah AGMs saw nearly 17v each for 1.5 days when my Victron PWM controller malfunctioned. I'm still using those batteries. My guess is something went majorly wrong with the renogy.

A link to the charger manual would be very helpful.

Setup Battery Type - Renogy PCL Series Manual [Page 21]

Renogy PCL Series Manual Online: Setup Battery Type. The PCL inverter charger series is fully programmable. The minimum programming needed to get started would be to set the battery type. Press and hold the parameter setting key to enter parameter setting mode. Use the arrow keys to go...

www.manualslib.com

 

[Tomthumb62]

Sorry to hear of your loss. Glad to hear no fire was started.

Long story short, I started with a full Renogy setup and have since replaced every piece except for a couple of solar panels.

I wasted so much time, energy and money trying to get Renogy things to work right. Cheap price+poor design = expensive lessons.

Replace with Victron and you’ll have no regrets. The Multiplus line is exactly that, shore charger plus solar charge controller. Or it’s cheaper to go individual units and add your own switch.

 

[Beeb1]

Thanks everyone.

How easy is the Victron Multiplus to setup? And which one is the correct one? I see a bunch of different Victron Multipluses online.

Yeah, I'm ready to go on a marketing campaign just to destroy Renogy's reputation and make them go out of business. What garbage products. This is all AFTER I already had to deal with their lousy customer support for weeks because they don't provide a neutral to ground bond in the inverter (even though it's advertised as having one, and the manual says it has one). They kept telling me it was my fault until they ran out of excuses and finally admitted that it doesn't have it.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Thanks everyone.

How easy is the Victron Multiplus to setup?

Easy-ish. You will need an MK3-USB adapter.

And which one is the correct one? I see a bunch of different Victron Multipluses online.

Depends on what you need.

Make sure you get it from a reputable seller that supports them well. I'd recommend CurrentConnected because, like I always say, @HighTechLab doesn't suck!

 

[Beeb1]

Easy-ish. You will need an MK3-USB adapter.



Depends on what you need.

Make sure you get it from a reputable seller that supports them well. I'd recommend CurrentConnected because, like I always say, @HighTechLab doesn't suck!

Sounds good. I already have the MK3-USB adapter because I have a couple other Victron devices (MPPT and BMV).

I'd be looking for one that works for a 12v system with AGM batteries, 1300 watts of solar, and can invert to 120v. Also one that actually charges the batteries correctly without cooking them!!

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Sounds good. I already have the MK3-USB adapter because I have a couple other Victron devices (MPPT and BMV).

The MK3-USB adapter is only used to connect to VE.Bus devices (Inverters) and can't be used to connect to either MPPT or BMV, so I'm a little confused by what you have and why you have it.

I'd be looking for one that works for a 12v system with AGM batteries, 1300 watts of solar, and can invert to 120v. Also one that actually charges the batteries correctly without cooking them!!

None of the 120V Victron inverters accept PV, so 1300W will have to be put on a separate MPPT with 100A total output.

The Multiplus II 12/3000VA unit is probably your best bet. It has very low idle consumption (arguably among the lowest in the world), is very efficient and has robust surge capability for starting motors.

Charging the batteries correctly requires you to program it correctly for your batteries. For lead-acid, they have an adaptive absorption algorithm that's designed to extend battery life by reducing absorption time for shallow discharges, and you'll need to make sure equalization is disabled or tailored specifically to your AGM batteries.

 

[Partimewages]

Charging the batteries correctly requires you to program it correctly for your batteries. For lead-acid, they have an adaptive absorption algorithm that's designed to extend battery life by reducing absorption time for shallow discharges, and you'll need to make sure equalization is disabled or tailored specifically to your AGM babatteries.

I believe I read that Current Connected will setup the settings for you if you purchase from them.

 

[Beeb1]

The MK3-USB adapter is only used to connect to VE.Bus devices (Inverters) and can't be used to connect to either MPPT or BMV, so I'm a little confused by what you have and why you have it.

Oh. I have this. I guess that's not what you meant.

None of the 120V Victron inverters accept PV, so 1300W will have to be put on a separate MPPT with 100A total output.

The Multiplus II 12/3000VA unit is probably your best bet. It has very low idle consumption (arguably among the lowest in the world), is very efficient and has robust surge capability for starting motors.

Charging the batteries correctly requires you to program it correctly for your batteries. For lead-acid, they have an adaptive absorption algorithm that's designed to extend battery life by reducing absorption time for shallow discharges, and you'll need to make sure equalization is disabled or tailored specifically to your AGM batteries.

Thanks! That makes sense. I didn't think the multiplus handled PV; just wanted to make sure all information was accounted for!

Why do I want to disable equalization? I believe (iirc) I have equalization turned on for my BMV-700. Should I turn that off? Or is that something different?

Likely because it has no idea the batteries were at 100% since there's no communication between the devices, and it was charging based on its own criteria.

Does the multiplus communicate with other devices? I have a Victron MPPT and a Victron BMV-700. I also have another non-Victron MPPT which probably doesn't communicate. But I would think if the multiplus could communicate with the battery monitor, it should get all the info it needs... right?

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Oh. I have this. I guess that's not what you meant.

Nope. MK3-USB has a RJ-45 plug to connect an ethernet cable between the adapter and the inverter.

It's available in USB A and USB C. Around $75.

Thanks! That makes sense. I didn't think the multiplus handled PV; just wanted to make sure all information was accounted for!

Why do I want to disable equalization?

Because equalizing AGM or GEL batteries destroys them.

I believe (iirc) I have equalization turned on for my BMV-700.

BMV-700 is a monitor. You're probably thinking of the MPPT.

Should I turn that off?

yes. AGM and GEL are destroyed by equalization UNLESS you follow the manufacturer's instructions for your specific model of battery, and they are always dramatically different from equalization for flooded lead acid.

Or is that something different?

Are we possibly discovering that your Renogy charger was set to equalize your batteries, and that's what cooked them?

Does the multiplus communicate with other devices?

Not by itself. It can connect to a GX device via VE.Bus connection.

There is a VE.Bus smart dongle that allows a limited bluetooth connection for monitoring via Victron Connect and limited functionality in a VE.smart bluetooth network.

I have a Victron MPPT and a Victron BMV-700. I also have another non-Victron MPPT which probably doesn't communicate. But I would think if the multiplus could communicate with the battery monitor, it should get all the info it needs... right?

The BMV-700 can only interface via VE.Direct, which can only connect with a Cerbo GX or other GX device. There is a ve.direct to bluetooth dongle that would turn it into a BMV-712 but without temperature sensing.

Two primary options:
Victron bluetooth devices can share data via a VE.Smart bluetooth network.
All Victron devices can share data via a Cerbo GX or other GX device.

GX devices also includes a Raspberry Pi running Venus OS; however, there are some hardware limitations.

 

[SamDeleted]

I have a school bus conversion. I installed solar and a 12v system about 5 years ago. I recently upgraded to 1350 watts and installed a Renogy 3000W inverter charger and ran AC wiring through the bus. I've turned on the Renogy a few times before to test everything, and everything seemed fine. The plan has been to move back into our bus and leave town this coming weekend to travel out West full-time. Today was my first day working in the bus on my desktop computer.

My system:
375Ah AGM batteries (3 125Ah batteries connected in parallel)
1300W solar with 2 MPPT charge controllers
3000W Renogy inverter charger

The batteries were at 70% this morning due to a lot of rain the last few days. I plugged into shore power and turned on my desktop. No other loads were on AC power, and the DC power was only powering some LED lights, a small 12v fridge, and Starlink (no more than a 10A draw total when the fridge cycled). Everything seemed fine until around 4pm.

At 4pm, the propane detector started to beep. It has given me false alarms before, so I checked for propane leaks, decided there were none, shut it off and ordered a new one online. About an hour later, my wife came in and noticed she smelled a rotten egg smell toward the front of the bus (where the electrical system is). I was working in the back of the bus, so I hadn't noticed it. We tracked it down and realized it was coming from the battery compartment, and the compartment itself was warm to the touch.

I quickly checked the battery monitor (Victron BM700). It said the batteries were 100% full with a voltage of 14-something. But it also said it still had a net-gain of 500+ watts (it was already dark out, so this must have been coming from the Renogy). I don't understand why the Renogy was still putting in 500+ watts when the batteries were already charged to 100%. I shut everything down immediately. I opened the battery compartment and felt the batteries. They were warm to the touch, borderline hot. The rotten egg smell was much stronger when I opened the compartment. After 20 minutes or so, I had grabbed my laser thermometer and checked the battery temps. They were at around 130 degrees Fahrenheit.

Now I have the batteries completely disconnected and sitting outside.

I'm wondering what to do from here. I don't know why the Renogy over-charged the batteries. I want to confirm that I had it on the correct setting (I'm 99% sure I did), but I'm going to let the batteries cool down overnight before connecting the Renogy to one of them to power it up and check the setting.

Questions:

• Are my batteries toast? (I assume they are)
• Is my Renogy going to do that again?
• What should I do going forward? I'm assuming I need new batteries and possibly a new inverter charger. I want one that is reliable and safe and not going to burn our bus down with us in it.
• What batteries and inverter charger do I get?
• Where can I get them so I can have them as soon as possible? (again, we were planning to move into the bus full-time in 4 days)

Its very possible your renogy inverter is NOT at fault here and it's your AGM batteries that have failed

 

[Beeb1]

Ok, well now I'm very curious if I have equalization turned on. If so, I've had it turned on for many years with my Victron MPPT, because I haven't touched the settings on that since initially setting it up back in 2019. But it's also possible I'm just thinking of something else. It's hard to remember all the correct terms when I have everything unplugged and can't just go look. I thought it was a setting on my battery monitor (BMV-700) that did something when the batteries reach 100%. I can set it to either manual or automatic. I thought it was called equalization, but I might just be mixed up.

What I do know is that I set up the Renogy according to its manual for use with AGM batteries. (EDIT: for clarification, I know that I set it up correctly when I initially set it up. But I wonder if some buttons got pressed sometime in the last few months and maybe the settings changed)

Ok, so it sounds like if I want to get the multiplus, I should ideally have all Victron devices and connect them through either bluetooth or a Cerbo GX. And that would allow the multiplus to know what the other charge controllers are doing so as not to overcharge the batteries. Does the multiplus automatically compensate for when I'm using power while it's charging? For example, yesterday when the Renogy fried my batteries, I was running my desktop computer and some lights and the fridge all at the same time. Is it possible that the Renogy thought the batteries weren't completely full because it saw the power being consumed by devices? Would the multiplus do that?

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Ok, well now I'm very curious if I have equalization turned on. If so, I've had it turned on for many years with my Victron MPPT, because I haven't touched the settings on that since initially setting it up back in 2019. But it's also possible I'm just thinking of something else. It's hard to remember all the correct terms when I have everything unplugged and can't just go look. I thought it was a setting on my battery monitor (BMV-700) that did something when the batteries reach 100%. I can set it to either manual or automatic. I thought it was called equalization, but I might just be mixed up.

synchronization.

What I do know is that I set up the Renogy according to its manual for use with AGM batteries. (EDIT: for clarification, I know that I set it up correctly when I initially set it up. But I wonder if some buttons got pressed sometime in the last few months and maybe the settings changed)

Ok, so it sounds like if I want to get the multiplus, I should ideally have all Victron devices and connect them through either bluetooth or a Cerbo GX.

Cerbo vastly preferred. Also gets you VRM monitoring and control from anywhere in the world provided the Cerbo has an internet connection.

And that would allow the multiplus to know what the other charge controllers are doing so as not to overcharge the batteries.

The Cerbo also allows you to control total charge current and not impact ability to meet loads with AC or PV, e.g.,

Lead acid batteries don't like to be charged fast. Your AGM likely don't want to be charged at over 75A, and something closer to half that would be preferred for longevity.

With DVCC in the Cerbo, you could specify a 75A (or other number) charge current limit. The Cerbo would tell the MPPT and the MP-II to never charge more than 75A total, but if you have additional PV available above that limit, you can still use it.

Does the multiplus automatically compensate for when I'm using power while it's charging?

doesn't really work like you imagine.

For example, yesterday when the Renogy fried my batteries, I was running my desktop computer and some lights and the fridge all at the same time. Is it possible that the Renogy thought the batteries weren't completely full because it saw the power being consumed by devices?

No. Charging doesn't quite work like that. When you're charging from AC power, that same AC power is being passed through to the loads.

Charging works like this:
Charge at max rate until absorption voltage is reached.
Hold at absorption allowing current to taper until:
1) a set time passes
2) charge current drops below a certain threshold (call tail current in MPPT setup).

The Renogy was still charging because 1 or 2 hadn't been met. If you were using a heavy load, it could influence #2, but that's not programmable on the Renogy. The renogy probably only follows a timed absorption phase, so as long as it stayed at absorption voltage, it doesn't matter how much loads were being drawn.

 

[Beeb1]

Gotcha. Ok! Thanks for all your help! I'm definitely going to look into Victron for all future products. Ideally, I'd like to upgrade to lithium batteries as well, but my budget isn't working for that right now.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Gotcha. Ok! Thanks for all your help! I'm definitely going to look into Victron for all future products. Ideally, I'd like to upgrade to lithium batteries as well, but my budget isn't working for that right now.

look into victron, magnum, morningstar, outback, schenider (not my favorite) or xantrex. they are all tier one items, they are all programmable they are all, dare i say expensive. you get what you pay for.
Renogy is at the top of the list for every possible failure, burned up system, burned up camper, burned up cabin's in some cases. parse through all of the ?"my xxx.xxx burned up" and 90% or better involve one word... renogy. they take hot garbage and relabel it. no support no real users manuals that amount to jack squat. it is generally factory overruns that they buy and relabel with their brand name and dump on the unknowing.

 

[Tomthumb62]

Renogy is at the top of the list for every possible failure, burned up system, burned up camper, burned up cabin's in some cases

When I first joined this forum, I had already sunk money into the Renogy ecosystem. All the hate on Renogy on this forum struck me as elitism. But having dealt with Renogy headaches for over 3 years (fortunately no fires), I have replaced everything from the batteries to inverter, shore charger and MPPT charge controller. The battery is Powerurus and everything else is Victron. I have not had one single headache with this setup…the Victron system just works as it should.

I got a good deal from invertersRus.com by buying open box items that come with the original warranty.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

When I first joined this forum, I had already sunk money into the Renogy ecosystem. All the hate on Renogy on this forum struck me as elitism. But having dealt with Renogy headaches for over 3 years (fortunately no fires), I have replaced everything from the batteries to inverter, shore charger and MPPT charge controller. The battery is Powerurus and everything else is Victron. I have not had one single headache with this setup…the Victron system just works as it should.

I got a good deal from invertersRus.com by buying open box items that come with the original warranty.

yep i got lucky got some good scoop about 12 years ago when i first started by a man who was very knowledgeable but very prickly in the solar scene.
he recommended magnum and morningstar and gave very good (and valid) reasons why. victron was not well know in the US at the time or i might have very well ended up with the affliction with buying anything that was victron blue (jokes) they are good gear. but simply buy 1st tier gear and cry one time is my motto, even when buying things like cells go for the known quality sellers etc.

 

[Tomthumb62]

victron was not well know in the US at the time or i might have very well ended up with the affliction with buying anything that was victron blue (jokes)

Seriously, and I’m embarrassed to admit this, besides price and features listed on paper and promoting how happy they were to provide customer support (which they failed to do), a major reason why I chose Renogy:

Colors and shape.

I liked the mostly black with turquoise trim and squarish shape. Morningstar has ugly colors and weird shapes. People buy many times not on logic, but on visceral gut reactions. Department stores in the USA used to pump certain fragrances into the air that soothed and calmed you and made you want to hang out in the store longer. Hang out in the store longer and you’re more likely to buy something or buy more than you’d anticipated.

Anyways, I veered from Victron at first in large part because their devices look like a 5-year old boy designed them: Ask him what he likes and he replies, “I like blue! And blimps!” Because that’s what my Victron Phoenix 12/1200 inverter looks like, a blue blimp.

I doubt Victron is going to change their designs, but I hope they do.

As an example, what if you designed a car that drove like a Porsche but looked like a Geo Metro? And priced slightly less than an actual Porsche. How well do you think those would sell? Because that’s what my Victron devices are: high powered with smooth operation but fugly as heck.

So that leaves an opening in the market. I would love to see Renogy and Victron merge. The design people at Renogy stay and everyone else goes, including the customer support. Everything else would stay the same with Victron and they’d be at the helm. Just don’t let them have any crayons, especially blue ones.

 

[Partimewages]

When it's hanging in my basement, RV storage, or the boat I don't give a crap what it looks like. It just better work!