Solis RHI 5kw + Pylontech US500 not stopping discharge at defined SOC

[jgh]

Solis 3102, installed last month. Not sure what firmware.

I'm also seeing 68 watts (sometimes 90) draw overnight, as logged for the "Battery Power" graph on the website
(plus a 20 minute pulse every hour or two, to 170W; probably the fridge). The battery (Pylontech US3000C) SOC droops about
10% / 4 hours, which doesn't seem inconsistent (but a little disappointing).

The Load "Total Consumption Power" line is flat zero for that period. No fridge pulses. How should I interpret this?
On the other hand, "Today Consumption" steps up about 0.5 kWh over that 4 hours, so 125W.

An interesting item I noticed today: the Grid Reactive Power is about 90 Var during the non-fridge-load periods.
It drops to 15 Var or so during the fridge pulses, and this bimodal variation continues throughout the day.
Is this down to the inverter, or is it some dodgy load in the house?
The Grid Power Factor mostly logs a solid 1 (what are the units here? The graphing has none but the axis goes both ways
from zero).

 

[bazza14]

Solis 3102, installed last month. Not sure what firmware.

I'm also seeing 68 watts (sometimes 90) draw overnight, as logged for the "Battery Power" graph on the website
(plus a 20 minute pulse every hour or two, to 170W; probably the fridge). The battery (Pylontech US3000C) SOC droops about
10% / 4 hours, which doesn't seem inconsistent (but a little disappointing).

The Load "Total Consumption Power" line is flat zero for that period. No fridge pulses. How should I interpret this?
On the other hand, "Today Consumption" steps up about 0.5 kWh over that 4 hours, so 125W.

An interesting item I noticed today: the Grid Reactive Power is about 90 Var during the non-fridge-load periods.
It drops to 15 Var or so during the fridge pulses, and this bimodal variation continues throughout the day.
Is this down to the inverter, or is it some dodgy load in the house?
The Grid Power Factor mostly logs a solid 1 (what are the units here? The graphing has none but the axis goes both ways
from zero).

It's been many years since I've had to deal with real power/reactive power and I couldn't begin to explain it now but you might find this informative https://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/accircuits/reactive-power.html

 

[bazza14]

SelfUse on --> min-SOC 20% Force-Charge 15%;
Backup on --> Backup-SOC 30%-->charge from grid allow;

EPM --> feed in 100w allow,
Backup output enable,
Battery pylonLV

Although the firmware will allow you to do this I don't think the device is intended to operate in both modes simultaneously. In Backup mode it uses PV when present and Grid if it is not, to charge your battery. It will not discharge the battery unless the grid is lost and then it will only power those items on the Backup port, all your stuff grid side will go off, basically it's a UPS. In Self use mode it will power all your devices from firstly PV and then the battery and finally the grid. If the grid goes out and there is less than the set min-SOC in the battery everything goes off. I accidentally configured mine like this because I set it to Backup to charge the battery when I commissioned the system as we were having a period dismal weather and then later selected Self Use not realising at the time that the firmware is 'dumb' and you need deselect the previous mode manually. I don't think it causes any harm, you're just not maximising the use of your PV power as it will switch to grid if there is not enough PV power rather than use the battery.

 

[BXII]

Not deselecting previous modes when making changes to a Solis is at the root of many of the Solis issues reported in this forum. The manual would be improved by 'an order of magnitude' if this simple instruction was included!

 

[bazza14]

This should help solve the issue when the battery does not charge the next day:

Might not be ideal but is working.
I select Dyness as my battery as is what I have, you should select your brand Pylon or whatever.

Then:
SOC 20%
Force Charge 20% - I selected 300W charge rate as the minimum I can select, 5000W is the default.
Self use ON - make sure all are zeroes on the dates to charge/discharge and you have "Stop" selected , not "Run"
Battery Reserve ON => 21% (also make sure you allow charge from grid to Battery)

This is what happens:
Battery goes down normal consumption until it reaches 20%.

I have the same inverter as you but I don't recall seeing a "battery reserve" setting just SOC and Force charge. Could you describe where to find it.

 

[bazza14]

Well, tell me then where is the Solis getting its DC energy to run at 4AM in the morning and the battery in standby and saying there is 0W consumed, the Solis app and the Dyness app... because the only place it can get it from is AC conversion to DC and then usage... and the solis inverter was up logging and all. Screenshots up there.

It would seem there are many undocumented features for these inverters. I have a Solis S5-EH1P6K-L Hybrid Inverter, Model 3105, Firmware 3D0037. No PV + No battery = Dead inverter. It can obviously convert AC grid to DC otherwise it could not charge the battery (which it definitely can). I am still researching this but it does seem to able to power the inverter from the grid but, in my case, not without a DC source connected. The commissioning procedure even states that it can "3. Switch on the external AC breaker to power on the LCD of the inverter." but real life experience says otherwise. One has to wonder that what is in the box is the same as that which it states on the lid.

 

[bazza14]

This should help solve the issue when the battery does not charge the next day:

The trick to get the battery to charge the next morning is to setup Backup Supply to "Disable" in Control Parameter menu.
You can see below, battery is charging. I didn't have to do anything with the inverter this morning.

Setting the Backup Supply to disable does exactly what it says, it turns off the back supply. In the event of a grid failure everything goes off and as all my loads are on the backup port this does not work for me.

 

[bazza14]

Hello pm2000,
Unfortunately, I have not followed the thread, since I was apparently the only one with the problem occurred. No charge of the battery in deep sleep mode....
Now I read that you have the same errors and a solution to it.
We have researched in parallel and have found different solutions. My solution is to allow 100W feed in the export Power Manager. I have a RHI 4.6kw with the FW 3A0032. Your work around to disable the backup output does not work for me unfortunately.
Maybe it helps one...

Tadaa, overlooked this earlier while trawling through this thread looking for solutions. Set a 100W feed as described above yesterday and the system woke up with the light this morning, happy days. I'm still concerned about the jagged power output but at least it's harvesting the power and storing in the battery .

 

[SeaGal]

I am still researching this but it does seem to able to power the inverter from the grid but, in my case, not without a DC source connected.

That is expected, as mentioned in post #50 https://diysolarforum.com/threads/s...ng-discharge-at-defined-soc.48064/post-646652

 

[bazza14]

That is expected, as mentioned in post #50 https://diysolarforum.com/threads/s...ng-discharge-at-defined-soc.48064/post-646652

I'm familiar with that reference, my comment was a reply to user pm2000 on that thread. Do you not find it remarkable that he and I have the same inverter and he insists that his will run on only grid AC and yet mine will not? Further, the commissioning procedure supports his assertion. Is my inverter faulty? They all look pretty much the same so maybe the internals of my box are not the same as the internals of his box, I mean they can't be the same and yet behave differently can they? I have taken this up with my supplier and I'm waiting for a reply.

 

[pm2000]

I'm familiar with that reference, my comment was a reply to user pm2000 on that thread. Do you not find it remarkable that he and I have the same inverter and he insists that his will run on only grid AC and yet mine will not? Further, the commissioning procedure supports his assertion. Is my inverter faulty? They all look pretty much the same so maybe the internals of my box are not the same as the internals of his box, I mean they can't be the same and yet behave differently can they? I have taken this up with my supplier and I'm waiting for a reply.

Not insisting. I am only saying what I am seeing reported by the Solis and the *Dyness Battery*.
During the summer there's always charge anyways, months since I have seen the 20% and 0W consumption.

 

[SeaGal]

It is logical that a hybrid inverter with off-grid capability derives its internal power from the DC side of its electronics. As far as I can see, the only downside to that is is that without solar or battery voltage, the AC backup circuit does not just pass through from the AC Grid connection - that was a surprise to me.

But maybe newer models have a dual DC and AC supply capability and Solis haven't updated their tech/support documentation yet?

 

[pm2000]

When the battery reaches down 20%, it does indeed use DC down to 17%, then goes back up to 20% and *stops* draining from it. This is what the Dyness separate app AND the Solis app tells me. Are both lying?

When the battery reaches 100%, it does use DC down to 98% and then gets recharged up to 100%.

 

[bazza14]

Not insisting. I am only saying what I am seeing reported by the Solis and the *Dyness Battery*.
During the summer there's always charge anyways, months since I have seen the 20% and 0W consumption.

Ah the Asimov fan is back (i'm assuming that's who your avatar is). Hello, I'd like to ask you if you have confirmed that your inverter will operate on only AC by disconnecting any DC supply because I would like that to be the case, it is what the commissioning procedure states should be the case. BTW setting the EPM to 100W fixes the won't charge the battery in the morning issue.

 

[pm2000]

Asimov fan is back
Not touching any cables no more ! However, as mentioned, when the battery goes back up to 20% from 17% the battery goes to 0W consumption , as reported by the Dyness external device, and the Solis inverter also reports that. Whatever that means it means. That must mean the inverter is able to use AC to power itself on that case.

With the settings I posted here I have no issue with charging battery in the morning, but haven’t been under 40% for months now, won’t happen till autumn when under 20%

 

[Aj.Jenner]

Late to the party here but what have I missed? I am having the same issue. US5000 still saying it is discharging beyond the 20% setting.

Force charge is set to 12% @ 1500w from grid.
This appears to be working and has been pushing the battery back up when reached.

I assume when the battery reaches 20% it should just ramp down and feed the inverter overnight and pull the rest of the power from the grid.

I believe I am on FW 3F003C. Do I have to just accept this is how it will work until fixed? And just offset set the difference between where battery cut off should be and force charge so hopefully I don't keep pulling from the grid overnight.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Aj.

 

[__Alex]

Same here. Did you guy manage to fix this issue in the end?

I have a Solis inverter S5-EH1P6K-L, a Pylontech US5000 battery, and "Overdisch SOC" is set to 10% but the battery keeps discharging until force charge (triggered at 6%).

Solis upgraded my firmware (from 3E0039 to 470044), but I still see this behaviour.

Here is their reply:

"We have discussed internally and find that over discharge SOC won't be stick on over discharge till long .after sometimes definitely it will discharge till force charge. Over-discharge SOC may go lower than the limit if the battery can't get charged for a long period of time. To prevent the battery going into sleep mode, when the Force-Charge SOC is reached, inverter will charge the battery using the power from either PV or Grid. "

Alex.

 

[rpdom]

Same here. Did you guy manage to fix this issue in the end?

I have a Solis inverter S5-EH1P6K-L, a Pylontech US5000 battery, and "Overdisch SOC" is set to 10% but the battery keeps discharging until force charge (triggered at 6%).

Discharging at what rate? "Overdischarge SOC" is when the inverter will stop using the battery to power your load. But the inverter itself is powered by the battery or solar, not mains, so it will keep discharging the battery slowly until it gets down to "Forcecharge SOC" when it will use mains to top up the battery a bit. That is normal usage.

 

[__Alex]

Discharging at what rate? "Overdischarge SOC" is when the inverter will stop using the battery to power your load. But the inverter itself is powered by the battery or solar, not mains, so it will keep discharging the battery slowly until it gets down to "Forcecharge SOC" when it will use mains to top up the battery a bit. That is normal usage.

Yes, you're right, it's the inverter itself discharging the battery at night. Solis never explained this, and their "for a long period of time" was confusing, since going from 10% to 6% can be very quick (it's only ~200Wh).

Also, I think the previous firmware was discharging the battery too fast, or was reporting incorrect information.

I just looked at the inverter details, and it looks ok for now. I updated the Over Discharge and Force Discharge SOC limits to 12% and 7% and with daylight it doesn't go under 12%.

 

[SeaGal]

Yes, you're right, it's the inverter itself discharging the battery at night.

If it's of any interest my RHI 3.6kW Solis and others with similar found the inverter's power consumption during the night to be about 30W.