WHY do all-in-one Solar Power Inverters have a high idle consumption? Asking to learn...

[GLC]

Most inverters have a low power mode where they send out little blips to determine if there is a real load or not. How much power does it take if you put a load on the inverter and then remove it?

This inverter only has an on and off, no stand by mode.

 

[copec]

I would say “you have an income problem, not a debt problem” and need to look at other sources of electricity. My cousin up in Idaho has actually had great luck with the micro wind turbines more than making up for lacking PV output.

 

[Lt.Dan]

As my previous statement. My the shunt monitor shows "o" watt draw with the unit off. Then i turn the unit on, you hear the beep, watt draw goes to almost 4 watts and the settles around 2.7. Then I move the camera to the side of the inverter which shows the voltage of the batteries at 27.4 and the watt draw which is "0" because there is no load on the inverter. It is at idle. Can't believe that you actually think that I am lying, you see the video guess the only thing left is for you to come to my house and see for yourself. That is why I did a video instead of pics. Video's can't lie. I do have another inverter on my setup that does draw 40 watts at idle but it is a Sigineer and is a 110/220 volt 5000 watt inverter.

I said I'm not calling you a liar by any means? Chill out.

I thought maybe that readout was battery voltage, and it showing 0 meant the inverter wasn't on completely and maybe still turning on? Which is why it was showing low 2.5-4 watts, but then once it started to read voltage, did the watt usage go up? Now I know the 0 readout was for watt usage. Thanks for clarification.

This in no way affects my life, sorry if my post ruined your day?

 

[copec]

This inverter only has an on and off, no stand by mode.

It might stand-by by default until a load kicks it on. I’ve seen other inverters do that.

I 100% don’t think you’re lying either. Just wanting to be sure before I grab one of those inverters too.

 

[GLC]

It might stand-by by default until a load kicks it on. I’ve seen other inverters do that.

I 100% don’t think you’re lying either. Just wanting to be sure before I grab one of those inverters too.

I will check it again when I get home tonight to watch as loads are applied and taken off to see how it effects wattage draws. Possible that it has a standby built into it but I never noticed it. My other inverter has a standby switch. I don't like it because if i turn on something like a led house light it does not recognize such a slight draw and it does not turn on.

 

[curiouscarbon]

thanks again to @GLC for taking the effort to record/share video to help us better understand how this specific model of inverter behaves ??

 

[Zwy]

The beep you hear is me turning on the inverter with no load.

Give the shunt make/model.......

 

[GLC]

It might stand-by by default until a load kicks it on. I’ve seen other inverters do that.

I 100% don’t think you’re lying either. Just wanting to be sure before I grab one of those inverters too.

Well, i checked. Turned off all loads and then turned them on and off a few times. Went up quick and then went down just as quick to 2.7 watts.

 

[GLC]

Give the shunt make/model.......

This is the one i have. I also checked with a dc clamp amp meter. It is pulling .29 amps at idle which may be a little more than what the meter shows. Someone smarter than me can do the math.

 

[Zwy]

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Check out this Amazon review of DC Multifunction Battery Monitor Meter,0-200V,0-300A (Widely Applied to 12V/24V/48V RV/Car Battery) LCD Display Digital Current Voltage Solar Power Meter Multimeter Ammeter Voltmeter

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I'd be very leery of any accuracy with this meter. Some say it's great and accurate, others checked against good shunts and say it is inaccurate, even with calibration.

 

[GLC]

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Check out this Amazon review of DC Multifunction Battery Monitor Meter,0-200V,0-300A (Widely Applied to 12V/24V/48V RV/Car Battery) LCD Display Digital Current Voltage Solar Power Meter Multimeter Ammeter Voltmeter

Solar battery monitor

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I'd be very leery of any accuracy with this meter. Some say it's great and accurate, others checked against good shunts and say it is inaccurate, even with calibration.

Wow, don't hold back tell me how you really feel. Ha ha
Don't know what all the fuss it is about. We are talking about the meter being off by 3 or 4 watts based on clamp meter results.. I think that is well within range. So the inverter still uses around 6 to 7 watts on idle which is great.

 

[Zwy]

Wow, don't hold back tell me how you really feel. Ha ha
Don't know what all the fuss it is about. We are talking about the meter being off by 3 or 4 watts based on clamp meter results.. I think that is well within range. So the inverter still uses around 6 to 7 watts on idle which is great.

I think if purchased an accurate shunt, you will discover the idle draw is much higher than what this shunt is reporting. Each one of those links indicated the accuracy is lacking.

 

[GLC]

I think if purchased an accurate shunt, you will discover the idle draw is much higher than what this shunt is reporting. Each one of those links indicated the accuracy is lacking.

I stated that I checked with a clamp meter and it measured .28 amp draw when the unit was on idle. That should make it around 6 or 7 watts. I am ok with the shunt being off 3 or 4 watts.

 

[EugeneJohn]

It's time I upgrade my entire system. I loved Will Prowse's video on the MPP all in one system he built, and I'm interested in spending a few thousand dollars to upgrade everything. The most unexpected CON of the All-in-One systems are the "high idle consumption" rate. Somewhere around 1.2kW per day!...That's an entire 12V 100aH battery. Seems really really high, so I'm looking for an explanation of why that is. Maybe I'm not thinking on the right track, but at that point, I'll have to buy 400 more watts of solar and another 12V battery, upwards of $1500 ADDITIONAL? Thanks.

I was told by mpp that the on/off switch is for the inverter. everything else will work with the switch off. look in the operation manual about 20+ pages in.

 

[jamiko]

I thought the MPP units had a power saving mode where idle consumption was < 15 watts.

 

[Rednecktek]

I thought the MPP units had a power saving mode where idle consumption was < 15 watts.

They do, but it requires 50+ watts of load to turn back on. If I turned every light in my cabin on at once it still wouldn't be 50w, much less if I just need the hallway light to go pee. It also shuts off your clocks and small appliances that need that constant power for control circuits so if you have a timer on the coffee pot set (as an example), it's just going to be 12:00 12:00 12:00 all the time.

 

[wild01]

My own personal observations on aio idle, the higher the dc voltage, the higher they idle. Ie the 12v inverters have much lower idle than the 48v ones. I figure they use some component that had the same AMP draw no matter what voltage is used.

Also if anyone else has bought one of these giendel inverters and can confirm the low amp draw, that would be amazing for the price point. Hell even the manufacturers claimed 36w idle would be better than average.

 

[Lt.Dan]

My own personal observations on aio idle, the higher the dc voltage, the higher they idle. Ie the 12v inverters have much lower idle than the 48v ones. I figure they use some component that had the same AMP draw no matter what voltage is used.

Also if anyone else has bought one of these giendel inverters and can confirm the low amp draw, that would be amazing for the price point. Hell even the manufacturers claimed 36w idle would be better than average.

Typically 12v models are of a much lower wattage ratings, meaning fewer parts, and smaller components = lower idle draw. Typical 48v inverters are usually 6000w at minimum, with some up over 15kw.

 

[SupraSPL]

I think 7 watts is possible, and if so that is damn good. My Renogy 12V 2000W HF inverter idles at .9a 13V = 12 watts. Same for the Renogy 12V 3000W HF. The Renogy 12V 3000W LF with fan on idles at 2.23A 13.1V = 29 and fan off is 1.67A 13.1V = 20 Watts.

The LF inverter also has grid charging and auto transfer capabilities that these HF inverters do not. That is valuable feature you get for the extra watts.

The question is, do we have to pay that 20W of overhead once a load kicks in? I tested a 250W heat lamp that draws exactly 250W on grid power and 258W on inverter due to higher AC voltage. When running on the inverter I get 21.9A 12.57V (small test battery) = 275 Watts. So the inverter is 93% efficient in this case and that includes the 20W of overhead power. In other words, when you have a substantial load, that standby power gets rolled into normal DC to AC inverter losses.

 

[MaximusAnonus]

Victron Multiplus are not AIO. But have the lowest idle draw specs of most any inverter out there for the size, by far. Then there are 2 more programable settings to set them even lower.

Dunno if mine are defective or something but I have 2x 3kVA Multiplus and 1x 3kVA Quattro and when I put a low load on them while drawing from the grid the VE.Config shows stuff like "0.9A 240V being drawn from the grid" and "0.5A 240V being drawn from the inverter" with charging completely off. That implies 0.4A got lost somewhere inside the inverter (or the measurements are waaaaay off). I wouldn't call that low.