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Replacing FANS inside the EG4 6500EX-48 to make it quiet

BenFromSignatureSolar said:
The fans on the 3K are positioned differently and not quite as loud.
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Thanks Ben - from what I’ve heard though, I expect they are still too much for our setting. I really need something with zero noise from the charger, and fans only running when the temp warrants it or when inverter load exceeds a modest threshold.

If the system could work with no fans running in charge only mode (like the Victron SmartSolar MPPT’s, or when you are running 50 watts of light bulbs, only coming on during heavy loads like many import standalone inverters do, then I would order the 3k and a rack battery right now, but it doesn’t sound like this is possible with this system.

I considered building an outdoor box for it, but our low temps in winter go well below the specs listed for the Eg4, and combining insulation in winter with suitable ventilation in summer has been a challenge to economically address.
 
David Collins said:
Thanks Ben - from what I’ve heard though, I expect they are still too much for our setting. I really need something with zero noise from the charger, and fans only running when the temp warrants it or when inverter load exceeds a modest threshold.

If the system could work with no fans running in charge only mode (like the Victron SmartSolar MPPT’s, or when you are running 50 watts of light bulbs, only coming on during heavy loads like many import standalone inverters do, then I would order the 3k and a rack battery right now, but it doesn’t sound like this is possible with this system.

I considered building an outdoor box for it, but our low temps in winter go well below the specs listed for the Eg4, and combining insulation in winter with suitable ventilation in summer has been a challenge to economically address.
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Completely understandable. One of the great things about this industry, there are lots of options. Find the one that works in your application.
 
Delmar said:
The Noctua fans are relatively quiet, but more importantly have a very pleasing sound. In my office-bedroom-doghouse my gateway drug system is all 12V, and the Noctua fan is always on for both air circulation and white noise. Ears are 6ft away from the fan. Can’t sleep without it.

EDIT: the Noctua NF-P14s "silent" fan with the sawtooth blade has the pleasing sound.
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I considered buying an Eg4 and voiding my warranty right away by swapping out the fans. Trading warranty for quiet would be more than a fair deal from my perspective.

I looked at Noctua’s selection, and have to expect their range includes something comparable in cfm and static pressure. Flow is typically listed and I have a manometer to check static pressure, so fitting it with a replacement suitable for a modestly cool northern environment should be doable.
 
Can think of a few factors that may result in requiring a lot of noisy airflow through a system like the EG4, not that all of these directly apply to it but are possible reasons why it is what it is. One, the unit itself is not very deep which requires using smaller diameter fans. When you have smaller diameter fans in order to push as much air as a larger diameter fan that some other devices have you have to spin it faster which creates more noise. Two, not having temp controlled fans is annoying. Three, many electronic components have a "lifetime at temp" rating. You can get a component that lasts X hours at Y temp or one that lasts 10 or 100x longer at same temp. Generally the ones that last longer cost more for a given temp.. or you can use the cheaper ones by pushing a lot of airflow through to keep it cooler.
 
rhino said:
Can think of a few factors that may result in requiring a lot of noisy airflow through a system like the EG4, not that all of these directly apply to it but are possible reasons why it is what it is. One, the unit itself is not very deep which requires using smaller diameter fans. When you have smaller diameter fans in order to push as much air as a larger diameter fan that some other devices have you have to spin it faster which creates more noise. Two, not having temp controlled fans is annoying. Three, many electronic components have a "lifetime at temp" rating. You can get a component that lasts X hours at Y temp or one that lasts 10 or 100x longer at same temp. Generally the ones that last longer cost more for a given temp.. or you can use the cheaper ones by pushing a lot of airflow through to keep it cooler.
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That all makes a good deal of sense.
 
rhino said:
Can think of a few factors that may result in requiring a lot of noisy airflow through a system like the EG4, not that all of these directly apply to it but are possible reasons why it is what it is. One, the unit itself is not very deep which requires using smaller diameter fans. When you have smaller diameter fans in order to push as much air as a larger diameter fan that some other devices have you have to spin it faster which creates more noise. Two, not having temp controlled fans is annoying. Three, many electronic components have a "lifetime at temp" rating. You can get a component that lasts X hours at Y temp or one that lasts 10 or 100x longer at same temp. Generally the ones that last longer cost more for a given temp.. or you can use the cheaper ones by pushing a lot of airflow through to keep it cooler.
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You could also design a better chassis and pull the air instead of pushing it.
 
adobopr said:
The air does get pulled. The bottom fans push air downwards which forces air in from the 2 side grills at the top.
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I've seen people say it pushes the air out the vents. Do you have one and can confirm? Also, it would be more efficient to put the fans on the top and the intake on the bottom and sides since hot air rises. I'm comparing this to IT since that's where most of my experience is...but a server chassis is basically the same. Blade servers for example are great for stacking but have poorer thermal properties compared to a atx style case where the fans are on the top of the case. It would be kinda hard to put bigger fans without increasing case dimensions...but dell used to put centrifugal type fans in their desktop towers that extracted twice as much air as the standard pc fan and were quiet. I guess I just saying some design improvements could help. Doesn't solark put them on the sides and pull the air across?
 
realpinochet said:
I've seen people say it pushes the air out the vents. Do you have one and can confirm? Also, it would be more efficient to put the fans on the top and the intake on the bottom and sides since hot air rises. I'm comparing this to IT since that's where most of my experience is...but a server chassis is basically the same. Blade servers for example are great for stacking but have poorer thermal properties compared to a atx style case where the fans are on the top of the case. It would be kinda hard to put bigger fans without increasing case dimensions...but dell used to put centrifugal type fans in their desktop towers that extracted twice as much air as the standard pc fan and were quiet. I guess I just saying some design improvements could help. Doesn't solark put them on the sides and pull the air across?
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Yes I have 2 6500ex installed powering my whole home in split phase. I was actually pretty surprised as well when I felt the hot air coming out of the bottom vents after installation.
 
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Yep. Airflow is down. In through the filters. That’s why they are on the outside in easy to remove and clean filter holders. And the fan speed seems to be based on load not necessarily temp. Cloud goes by, pv drops, fans drop. Sun comes out, PV up, fans up. Maybe I’ll liquid cool the system like some of cases. Not.
 
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adobopr said:
Yes I have 2 6500ex installed powering my while home in split phase. I was actually pretty surprised as well when I felt the hot air coming out of the bottom vents after installation.
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1663385027837.png

They could also use a extruded design to increase the surface area while not increasing the case size. You'd be surprised how much extruded cases dissipate heat compared to a flat surface. This pic is steel not aluminum so the cost increase should not be much if done on scale.
 
BenFromSignatureSolar said:
I'll throw that out to the product team
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Do these fans trigger off of internal case temperature or are they designed to trigger off of current handled? If it's overall case temperature then we could design external air handling / venting that would reduce the temperature and thus shift the need for the active cooling these fans are providing.
 
Heat naturally rises. Forcing it to go the wrong way is just a bad design. There are a few others with the same flaw. I really don't know what they were thinking. The heat that is discharged from the bottom will naturally rise and be drawn into the top.
 
Engineering is always a process of dealing with constraints. In this case, the case literally has holes all around it that “should” be sealed if installed properly (AC input/output/PV/etc) but might not be. Because those holes are on the bottom of the case, you can “seal” the top and force the air through the bottom. While hot air does naturally rise, even the smallest forced air fan provides much much more cooling than passive. The air flow direction is a reasonable solution to the problems they had to deal with. Ideal? Nope. But neither is the fan speed based on power, not on actual temperature. Still happy with my inverter, though.
 
My AIO also has holes all around it.
But the fans blow the right way. (Up)
If something so basic is wrong. it makes me wonder what else there might be that isn't so obvious.
I personally think that it was a last minute change in order to add inlet filters. But not sure how they are much of a benefit.(other than marketing) Since we know that the case has plenty of other holes for unfiltered air to be drawn in through.
 
I replaced all 3 fans with silent ones. It's super quiet and is more than tolerable in the TV room. BUT! During the day the unit constantly hits 72C for the inverter temperature. It never came close to this with the stock fans (average mid 40s). So, having wiring ran tomorrow so it can be moved to another room and putting the original fans back in.
 
Yeah, the noise level is a bit... surprising... in a small cabin environment. Pretty intense even at idle. I'm going to go ahead and insulate my utility closet area with rock wool insulation. I think that will be very helpful in cutting down the noise level heard around the rest of the cabin. Anything that could be done to reduce that noise and still meet the thermal needs would be helpful. Even just making it temp based not power based would be a nice change. My place is cooler much of the year and most of the time it's blowing a lot of cold air when charging or running a moderate load of 1-3KW
 
Generally, a higher powered fan, is going to be more noisy and blow a lot more air.
Silent fans may be silent, but your equipment may also seriously overheat....

Propeller type axial fans are not very good at creating static pressure, and the tip speed needs to be pretty high which is what generates the noise.
Centrifugal fans are much more efficient in every respect.

If you are really serious, fit a centrifugal air blower resurrected from an old room heater.
These have a small diameter very wide barrel type rotor that can shift a LOT of air and run almost silent doing it.
Try heating up a whole room with a pissy little computer fan....

This is the type of thing to look for:
This one is a bit wide, but they come in all shapes and sizes.
Some of these have two speeds, the lower speed will probably be more than enough.
110/220v ac operation should not be a problem with an inverter.
 

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If the fans are variable speed, some controllers are reading fan speed so make sure any fan chosen will play good with the controller circuit.
 
Nashional99 said:
I replaced all 3 fans with silent ones. It's super quiet and is more than tolerable in the TV room. BUT! During the day the unit constantly hits 72C for the inverter temperature. It never came close to this with the stock fans (average mid 40s). So, having wiring ran tomorrow so it can be moved to another room and putting the original fans back in.
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Thanks for running the experiment for us.
 
FWIW, here is the temperature difference with the silent fans vs the stock fans.
 

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Nashional99 said:
FWIW, here is the temperature difference with the silent fans vs the stock fans.
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was there a significant difference in the noise level. I wonder if adding an auxiliary air handling system to pull the air through them. I use something like this for my resin 3d printing - using the top vents to attach through or even the bottom wiring raceway (if the system has that built on to move the air through
 

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Yes, it was very significant in reducing the noise. But ran too hot for me. I ended up running wiring to another room from the main panel and back to the sub-panel transfer switch (using the stock fans). So far that's working great.
 
Nashional99 said:
Yes, it was very significant in reducing the noise. But ran too hot for me. I ended up running wiring to another room from the main panel and back to the sub-panel transfer switch (using the stock fans). So far that's working great.
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what silent fans did you use, if I may ask? Noctua? model number?
 
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