sorry should have been more clear. I quoted "rectifier" because that is the term the telecom industry uses for its AC to DC power supplies. I agree they are much more than just a rectifier only. That is the industry term, however, and knowing that can help somebody searching for product. Here is more from a teardown of the chargeverter
Chargeverter alternative
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Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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That's interesting!
I assumed it was a subset of their custom inverter design.
But tapping available volume production could be cheaper, and more reliable.
So basically, this this is a CV/CC supply, no special voltage vs. time profile of a battery charger.
Is it PF corrected? That makes a difference on how much can be drawn from a given generator (or any other source.)
I've been alert to power factor since discovering my VFD upsets Sunny Boy inverters when used off-grid.
I assumed it was a subset of their custom inverter design.
But tapping available volume production could be cheaper, and more reliable.
So basically, this this is a CV/CC supply, no special voltage vs. time profile of a battery charger.
Is it PF corrected? That makes a difference on how much can be drawn from a given generator (or any other source.)
I've been alert to power factor since discovering my VFD upsets Sunny Boy inverters when used off-grid.
OffGridInTheCity
Solar Wizard
I have a Chargeverter and LOVE 2 features - selectable amps and 90% efficient (AC -> DC conversion).
Before the Chargeverter I setup multiple 48v @ 15a chargers... so I could select 15a, 30a, 45a, 60a... up to 120a. It worked but quickly wised up that they're only 60% efficient - what a waste of $ and effort.
So yes, I'd love a cousin or alternative that is >=90% efficient and selectable charging amps but haven't found anything close yet except for some suspicious Alibaba units that claim adjustable amps. Also, $400 is not bad compared to pricing for 48v @ 20a chargers that are $275.
So I ordered a 2nd Chargeverter for my trailer... so I can power it from the trailer generator choosing amps for max watts (and minimum run time) to charge my 48v battery directly. The trailer MPP Solar 3048 doesn't have fine-tune settings and when changing AC charge current settings does some kind of unnecessary 'momentary overload' that destabilizes the generator won't allow me to use it to effectively maximize watts.
Before the Chargeverter I setup multiple 48v @ 15a chargers... so I could select 15a, 30a, 45a, 60a... up to 120a. It worked but quickly wised up that they're only 60% efficient - what a waste of $ and effort.
So yes, I'd love a cousin or alternative that is >=90% efficient and selectable charging amps but haven't found anything close yet except for some suspicious Alibaba units that claim adjustable amps. Also, $400 is not bad compared to pricing for 48v @ 20a chargers that are $275.
So I ordered a 2nd Chargeverter for my trailer... so I can power it from the trailer generator choosing amps for max watts (and minimum run time) to charge my 48v battery directly. The trailer MPP Solar 3048 doesn't have fine-tune settings and when changing AC charge current settings does some kind of unnecessary 'momentary overload' that destabilizes the generator won't allow me to use it to effectively maximize watts.
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Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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Are you sure efficiency (watts out / watts in) was so low? That might require a linear regulator to burn off 40% of input power as heat.
Or was that (watts out / VA in)?
A diode rectifier after a transformer, or rectifier/capacitor circuit at front end of SMPS, has poor power factor. Shows higher VA than actual W.
timselectric
If I can do it, you can do it.
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Every measurement that I have made. And seen by others. Has shown that 90% of watts in, makes it out to the battery.
Which is amazing. Because it's also a great space heater. With the other 10%. lol
Which is amazing. Because it's also a great space heater. With the other 10%. lol
OffGridInTheCity
Solar Wizard
Unfortunately it really is ~60% based on Iotawatt Generator AC input metric and Batrium shunt DC charging metrics. Really horrible! and was taken by surprise as I assumed things would be at least 85% efficient (like a standard inverter).
I've tested them at least 3 times as I couldn't believe it. Input generator is Honda eu3000is for 1 test and Champion 100297 for another test. The charger manufacturer will sometimes list >87% efficient in their specs but it just isn't true and as you can see, I own 8 visible and 3 others - so it's not just 1 bad charger.
Each one pulls about 11.1a @ 120v ~1300w and provides 15a @ 52v ~ 780w. 780w / 1300w ~ 60% effeciency.
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Robbert
Solar Enthusiast
Just a quick question.
Does the chargeverter holds its settings after disconnected from AC power.
I am thinking of adding a chargeverter to my system and disconnect AC-in on my inverters.
The chargeverter will only be used if the batteries go under a certain level (e.g. 25%).
ricardocello
Watching and Learning
I set the volts and amps once when I installed it, and have not had to touch it since.
But I’ll plug in the AC tonight and double check.
EDIT: Yes, it holds the settings.
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OffGridInTheCity
Solar Wizard
After manually adjusting it, mine remembers it's settings.
I leave it connected to the battery bank w/chargeverter breaker on but the control panel doesn't appear to be on without AC input. I leave the chargeverter plugged into my generator. When I start the generator (Champion 100297), after a short delay (20sec?) power + charging begins to flow (generator engine digs-in) with no action on my part. When I've had enough I stop the generator.
Bottom line - all I have to do is start and stop the generator. This is nice since the generator is 150ft away from the chargeverter.
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Not sure about the PF spec for the chargeverter itself but the commercial (generally more costly) telecom rectifiers have power factor of near unity (0.98 or so). I would expect if the chargeverter has halfway decent rectifiers they are pretty high PF (eg have internal correction and aren't just robbing sine wave peaks). @Hodge if you've had PF challenges you can look into external power factor correction which can be accomplished simply by adding capacitance (disregard the energy savings that is mostly BS but they do the same thing commercial units do for PF correction) . Guess it depends on how much it upsets your Sunny Boy. Also curious what VFD you are using, most quality units should also be very high PF here is the spec from the one on my well pump.
Yes it is just a CV/CC supply where the V and the C are both configurable. It is just a power supply not a specific charger with any knowledge of battery profiles or charge cycles.
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ricardocello
Watching and Learning
The two power supplies in the chargeverter are labeled: S312-SR4850-1U
This appears to be a manufacturer data sheet for them:
http://www.suplet.com/public/uploads/product/document/SR4850x-1U Rectifier series.pdf
Not sure how the S312 number fits in.
Presumably the CANbus lets you tweak the voltage and current, but i see no programming docs.
This appears to be a manufacturer data sheet for them:
http://www.suplet.com/public/uploads/product/document/SR4850x-1U Rectifier series.pdf
Not sure how the S312 number fits in.
Presumably the CANbus lets you tweak the voltage and current, but i see no programming docs.
OffGridInTheCity
Solar Wizard
My Iotawatt shows a 100% PF on AC input from my frame generator Champion model 100297 when powering the Chargeverter. And I'm getting ~90% AC->DC efficiency.
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I use an Eltek (Valere) Telecom Shelf (19" rack mount) with 3 x 'V' series 2000A1-HE modules and a BC-2000 controller for my 48v system ... fully programmable 6kW+ with near unity PF and typically in the 94% - 95% efficiency range by my measurements
A lot of this ex-Industrial/Telecom stuff on eBay at times if you look and have a little time to get a good deal ... Flatpak's are also readily available and cheap
A lot of this ex-Industrial/Telecom stuff on eBay at times if you look and have a little time to get a good deal ... Flatpak's are also readily available and cheap
42OhmsPA
What's in a title?
Wow. Looks like you took it to the next level...
DIY 'Chargenectifier'
Based of the informative info recently posted by @ChrisFullPower in another thread I'm intrigued in DIY'ing a charger from used rectifiers. A quick search on eBay for '48v rectifier' has made me realize it's definitely doable at costs much lower than off the shelf options... I'll start with a...
diysolarforum.com
timselectric
If I can do it, you can do it.
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Yup, that's exactly how I use them.
ricardocello
Watching and Learning
I assume the programming is over I2C. Were you able to find the programming info?
Voltage and max current?
seneysolar
Solar Addict
Iota DLS series with the iq4. Works great
They use CANBus. Lots of info on reverse engineering Eltek CAN protocol in this thread. Unfortunately I never saw any indication that protocol documentation is publicly available I think it is just used to communicate to their own user interface.
Good find! I hadn't been able to find any info on the rectifiers they use.
the CAN protocol documentation for the top US telecom commercial units (eg Eltek, Emmerson) is also not published unfortunately so bummer but not surprising. Some work to reverse into them on this forum and others.
ricardocello
Watching and Learning
If there is one thing I wish EG4 would do to improve the chargeverter, it would be to implement an external rs-485 modbus or CANbus interface so the voltage and current could be set remotely. But it is still a great buy for the price.
