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64 eve lLF280k version3 cells in 8P8S configuation 24-volt build December 28th, 2023

As long as you know what your getting into!
yes, it would be easy (and fast) to put a BMS on 16 cells in a 16S configuration for 48 volts... just do it 4 times
no cables to hydraulically crimp etc. 4 separate BMS's (simple redundancy)

the 32-cell 4P8S builds can be put into series but that is not recommended to achieve a 48-volt system..
at least not recommended by the Dacian the Electrodacus SBMS0 engineer and designer
 
64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells:
the version 3 that I ordered will have the welded-on bolt holes via laser at the factory.

Dacian designs the Electrodacus SBMS0 and DSSR50 and has a pic-n-place machine to assemble the tiny SMD (surface mount device) components.
His design is compatible with small arrays, large arrays, and split arrays so the excess solar from the large arrays can be utilized for diversion and heating in the north country...
if you look at where your energy is being used most energy costs are associated with the heating of your house in the cold north... in the south cooling would likely be the largest energy use...
I want to utilize more solar PV electric production to heat my buildings etc in the cold time of the year...
the larger ESS with LiFePO4 design allows more battery storage and the ability to use more of the solar PV output...
Solar panels can be obtained for very reasonable prices..... in the USA, especially in pallet quantities...
the LiFePO4 is still the most expensive part of my builds by far...
the Electrodacus SBMSO and Electrodacus DSSR50 allow the DIYer to expand 2 or 4 solar PV panels at a time...
although it is a 24-volt design >>> that is a part I like actually (24-volt) and the slightly larger wire between the inverter and battery is a minimal amount of extra expense...
I have been building passive solar structures for the last 30-plus years and the solar PV upgrades are just another step toward self-sufficiency!!!

anyways back to the 64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells being delivered by FedEx soon.... coming from the "City of Industry", out of California!!! The Chinese importers have warehouses all over>>> but this batch is originating from the California warehouse...
FedEx now shows a 1/4/2024 delivery date and the shipment is now in Arcadia, California.

I will let you know how the LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells arrive, shortly, condition, packaging etc.
A heat wave this morning >>>> 24 degrees Fahrenheit...????
 
64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells:

WEIGHT27 lbs / 12.25 kgs
DIMENSIONS11x10x9 in

each box of 2 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells weighs 27 pounds according to the FedEx tracking website

don't sweat the small stuff >>>> it's all small stuff
can't never did anything
if you think you can>>> if you think you can't >>> either way you will be right!!!
 
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64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells:

Approx. Dimensions (LxWxH)173.7mm x 72.0mm x 207.5mm
Approx. Weight5,420g

according to the battery store and supposedly 8000 cycle rating also ..... hope so with 300Ah or greater >>> hmmm

trying to make room ahead of their arrival etc...
 
64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells:

Approximately 22.677 inches x 57.6 inches is the approximate footprint but the interconnections will stretch that length out more .....
plus the large cable to copper bus bar on each end also increases the footprint....

I am leaning toward assembling at floor level this time....
For the other ones I built at counter height ,,,, but due to lack of more counter space >>>> the floor may have to be utilized...

Also 64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells >>> will weigh approximately 763.136 pounds or 346.88 kg not including the interconnections etc
 
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64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells:

Fedex reports the delivery of the 64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells (arriving early) >>>now and is in Lenexa, Kansas with a new early scheduled delivery for today January 3rd, 2024.

I am rearranging the things to make room in the off-grid solar power shed for the 64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells:
The temperature is 18 degrees Fahrenheit outside... It is coffee time for me again...?
The cold outside temperature is good for polar bears and solar PV panels !!!!
??????
the new plan is to make the counter height space to assemble the 64 cells etc.... stooping over is a killer on my back so the counter height is much better.... for charging and assembly of these hefty 64 LiFePo4 LF280k version 3 cells:

got out the tape measure and board stretchers !!!

if you think you can,
if you think you can't,
either way, you will be right
 
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will weigh approximately 763.136 pounds or 346.88 kg not including the interconnections etc
Do you plan to move only the 100 lbs cells around (2240Ah cell) or the entire battery?

I'm with you on the 8P configuration. I also prefer to have single cells build from 8 cells than having 8 BMS.
 
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64 LiFePo4 280Ah cells version 3 with welded-on screw holes:

I received 62 of the 64 cells today (January 3rd, 2024) of the 280Ah version 3 cells...
They do not say lf280k just 280Ah, they have the welded-on screw holes and the 8-sided terminal that is new to the version 3 cells;
Fedex came at 4 pm and by 6 pm I had them all inside the off-grid solar power shed but only opened one box....
It is dark outside and after taking care of the livestock etc... 6 pm

I will have to do more tomorrow.... evidently the last 2 cells are scheduled to arrive tomorrow...
I plan to build them in place once I get the counter height shelf built and reinforced...
I will start the top balancing tomorrow>>> some...
the ice and snow hindered moving things but they are all inside.....about 24 degrees Fahrenheit outside now and getting colder...
I think it was 68 degrees Fahrenheit inside the off-grid solar power shed until I had to keep opening the door to move the battery cells inside....
have to let them thaw overnight at the minimum... maybe more...???

this is a stationary build and will not be moved once assembled... the 64-cell ESS battery...
but I still will need to lift every cell a couple of times as they get charged and assembled...
I will be able to slide 8 cells at a time on the base but they will not be lifted once they are in the 8P initial configuration...
right now the only picture would be a pile of boxes.
they pack them sideways 2 per box.... (( a lot better than the previous 4 per box that were packed upright )).... the packaging was definitely better in the sideways 2 per box....with dense white foam packing to individually protect each cell on all sides....
??
 
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64 LiFePo4 280Ah cells version 3 with welded-on screw holes:

57344 Wh 64 cell DIY vs 11.2 of the power queen pre-built would cost over 13,087 dollars plus sales tax....

The DIY 64 cell will be half the price of the pre-built server rack or prebuilt batteries
I am estimating a $7000 investment for the 57344 Wh DIY build ...

I opened 15 boxes and the last 2 cells arrived by FedEx yesterday (January 4th, 2024) so all 64 cells are here.

I started charging 4 cells yesterday off-grid with the Riden 6012 and Riden 6018,,,
the grub screws (studs ) went in without a problem and the serrated flange nuts so the quality of the 1st four seems to be better than previous cells...
interestingly, they include strapping tape to assemble the cells into packs ( I have seen this method used before in other set ups...)

I am still rearranging for the new (counter height - revised ) shelf in the off-grid solar power shed.... etc... (it will be closer to eye level) but still better than working off the floor and stooping over ....
4 baby lambs this morning and hauling hay before the next snowstorm,,,,
have a great weekend!!!?
more later
 
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Another electrician said>>> the main battery switch is only to handle the loads you draw to inverter and such. That switch is not for battery size. Ex: your home grid has almost unlimited availability of power from the utility, however your main switch/breaker on your panel/load center is based on your home usage and wire sizes there. Not the size of the backup battery or available power....you can have as big a battery bank as you like....that has nothing to do with the battery switch. You also fuse off your battery terminal for the load and wire sizing.... Not your battery bank size. Same for the disconnect switch. Just a standard 300amp disconnect switch will handle a 14,400watt load on a 48volt system. Even tho the bank contains a multitude larger amps that's irrelevant. It's the load. And just a 500amp shunt works too. As, that's measuring the load passing thru it, not the battery capacity....it can add up amps to any battery capacity.... it's just limited to a 500amp load either way thru it.

please note::>>>>> The above is from another forum and is not in any way a direct reply to my build, but I think he explains this rather well....

my 5000-watt inverter will have 2 4/0 cables one to each terminal >>>> 2 negatives and two positive 4/0 cables, ((two positives 4/0 cables, two negative 4/0 cables)) and a 250 amp Siemens NH fuse...
5000 divided by 25.6 = 195 amps approximately so if I use the 1.25 rule of thumb to upsize the fuse
195 x 1.25 = 244 Amp fuse, so a 250 Amp fuse should be about right...

nothing is saying anywhere that I plan to pull a 2240 amp load from a 24-volt battery bank....
I have more realistic amp draws up to 250 amps at 24-volts, maybe more??? maybe less using 4/0 copper cables...
depending on the inverter and particular load connected and drawing from the battery
working on the fusing side of things right now....

the disconnect switches will also be in the works....
 
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Hi Michael! Haven’t been on for a few years, but enjoyed reading your thread today. I’m also a fan of Dacien’s approach. Although it may seem complicated at first, the simplicity and reliability are great. And for some, the 24v (or 12v) aspect has its advantages.

I‘ve used the (original design) SBMSO in our old Sprinter for 5 years now, never turned off. Before the Eve and Lishen cells were popular I bought 4 used 200ah prismatic cells. We’re in St Paul, and I’ve neither heated nor removed them past 5 years. So they’ve gone through 4 winters of subzero. I wait until the guts of them gets above freezing before charging. That works out to about the end of the first day of driving south, using a diesel heater flexible duct aimed at the pack. Then the last few hours with 40a alternator charging. From there on the two 280w 60 cell panels on the roof are all we need.

Back to topic, sorry! I’m thinking of doing an off grid setup.

Last week we bought an abandoned house in Patagonia AZ, an hour south of Tucson. It’s a mountain town in the “Sky Islands” at about 4200’ above sea level. The house is an old mud adobe 1200 sq ft one story with a low pitch (3.5/12) gable steel roof. I’d cover the roof with forty 60 cell used panels from Santan. Probably 32 of the cells you just received, using a SBSMO with DSSR50s. Install a 4 head minisplit for heating and air conditioning. I’ve toyed with the idea of using resistive wire diversion heating. But- the heating needs will be pretty minor compared to the cooling.

Since cooling is needed primarily when the sun is shining, the undersized battery bank may be fine? I’m hoping that excess PV will offset loads during the day. These loads would be washer, dishwasher, mini split, power tools, etc.

At night it gets cool enough to open windows (temps are 10 to 15f lower than Tucson in the summer).

I’m thinking of 2 inverters. One would be a single phase (2 legs of 120) inverter feeding only the mini split disconnect box. For efficiency, this inverter might be remotely activated only when the mini split is calling for heating or cooling.

The other (5k?) 120v inverter would feed the house breaker box. Jumper across the main breaker line feeds; every breaker is 120v. 240v not possible in the breaker box.

This property is right in town, and on the rear of the lot is another very small (400sf) house. I would do a stand-alone smaller system for this, but use a small 120v mini split. Thus no dinking around with a 240v inverter, just another 5k inverter feeding a small breaker box.
Since used panels are inexpensive and there‘s ample low pitch roof on the small house, keeping it separate and simple is the way to go.

What are your thoughts? And recommendations on good, lower cost inverters?
 
i can not recommend an inverter..... at least I am not certain of their long-term reliability..

the low-cost ones ???? who knows if they will stand up over time...
the cnswipower 24-volt inverters in the 3500 and 5000-watt versions are low cost John Daniels talks them up on YouTube and they have a low idle standby draw which is a good thing... they are high-frequency inverters.... John Daniels seems to be a straight shooter...

you might also look at Dacian's threads and followers for inverter suggestions as what can be controlled by the Electrodacus SBMS0
I get regular notifications on the Electrodacus improvements...
like the new Electodacus DSSR50 etc... and the Electrodacus DEXT v02.b for diversion simplification etc


I do not recommend (or have any knowledge) any of the all-in-ones..... too many bugs and are expensive for their bugginess...
 
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64 LiFePo4 280Ah cells version 3 with welded-on screw holes:
February 1st, 2024 update:
I started more top balancing some of the 280Ah version 3 cells with Riden 6012 and Riden 6018 with solar PV via a 24-volt inverter in the off-grid solar power shed....been slightly warmer now for 3 days above freezing finally... and the sun was out with lots of snow reflection so excess solar available...
still reinforcing the new eye-level battery shelf for the 64 cells >>> I have 32 cells on it now.... so about 5.4 x 32 = 172.8kg or approximately 380.16 pounds... need to support twice that amount so extra support is being added....I do not want any unwelcome surprises..... always overbuild it!!!
 
64 LiFePo4 280Ah cells version 3 with welded-on screw holes:
Electrodacus SBMS0 #1, #2 & #3 photos after employing them for 2-3 years. Presently using two Ridens 6012 and Riden 6018 to top balance 2 cells in parallel at a time of the new 280Ah version 3 cells from the other three ESS batteries.... a 16 cell Lishen 272 Ah build 2P8S; a second Lishen 272Ah 16 cell 2P8S build; and a third 32 cell Eve 280 Ah 4P8S build pictures at end of day on February 1st, 2024.

Electrodacus SBMS0 #1 on 2p8S Lishen 272Ah cells has a 23mV cell delta; it is 272Ah x16cells x 3.2V = 13,926.4 Wh ESS battery at 1088 Amps;
Electrodacus SBMS0 #2 on a second Lishen 2P*S build has a 58 mV cell delta; it is also a 272Ah x 16cells x 3.2V = 13.926.4 Wh at 1088 Amps;
SBMS0 #3 on 4P8S EVE 280 Ah cells has a 54 mV cell delta; it is 280Ah x 32cells x 3.2V = 28,672 Wh ESS battery at 1120 Amps;
the cell delta is small and is being balanced by the Electrodacus SBMS0 passively...

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the Riden numbers are not the voltage of the cells.... when you turn the charging off the cells are 3.31 to 3.35 volts.... the Riden..... the higher you set the Riden the more watts and Amps are pushed to the cells,,,, I do not leave them on all the time as I do not want to charge the cells that high in the preparation for the larger new ESS build...

I added a third charger on two more cells today February 2nd, 2024 ... in preparation for the larger ESS.... a 64-cell build (280 ah cells version 3)

evidently, SBMS0 #3 is not registering exactly correctly either as it only works up to 780 amps or something like that ( due to an internal hardware limit) whereas the 32-cell 4P8S DIY build battery is more like 1120 amps so I need to look into that a bit more !!!

the other two SBMS0 are correct in their readings as far as I can tell.... both are 2P8S builds with 544 Amps;
 
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