brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
let me guess. you are from down under?
Building the sickest ® VAWT ever. Brilliant minds unite please!!
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wopachop
New Member
Nah just getting into the mood trying to rock that aussie accent.
Plus i was just watching supercross and the kid who won has a heavy aussie accent.
Hope your turbine ends up working.
Plus i was just watching supercross and the kid who won has a heavy aussie accent.
Hope your turbine ends up working.
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
here is another conundrum ;(
So please imagine a 6m tall aluminum tube that will serve as the central column for the turbine.
How can we secure it tightly, while being able to spin, and.. this is the hard part I think. Make sure it is perfectly upright (sure there are tolerances because perfect is just not possible on micro levels)
I have huge scaffolding so I am thinking that when I get a aluminum tube i just hold it from the top on the scaffolding. And then when ever motion on the bottom stops then it is perfectly upright.
I really hope there are better ways of doing this so if someone has an idea then please shoot.
So please imagine a 6m tall aluminum tube that will serve as the central column for the turbine.
How can we secure it tightly, while being able to spin, and.. this is the hard part I think. Make sure it is perfectly upright (sure there are tolerances because perfect is just not possible on micro levels)
I have huge scaffolding so I am thinking that when I get a aluminum tube i just hold it from the top on the scaffolding. And then when ever motion on the bottom stops then it is perfectly upright.
I really hope there are better ways of doing this so if someone has an idea then please shoot.
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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What is the benefit of having a tube spinning?
I think VAWT might just need two bearings on a non-rotating vertical column. The bearings need to take some thrust as well as radial loading.
Lower bearing could be larger diameter to allow a tapered column.
You might get away with a ring riding inside several bearings/wheels.
I think VAWT might just need two bearings on a non-rotating vertical column. The bearings need to take some thrust as well as radial loading.
Lower bearing could be larger diameter to allow a tapered column.
You might get away with a ring riding inside several bearings/wheels.
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
so that the alternator can be low to the ground where it is easy to service.
i will try and mentally form a picture of what you meant. But my initial gut reaction is to mostly see drawbacks.
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
Btw, wether the botom part of the colum is fixed or spins. The challenge of getting it perfectly upright remains
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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You can have alternator near the ground whether turbine has spinning tube or not.
Are your blades airfoils, either in an arc or a rectangle between top and bottom of spinning tube, only connect to tube at ends?
Or, are they paddles (like a split 50 gallon drum wind turbine), and connected to tube full length?
If the former, only thing I see tube doing is taking tension/compression. Which is why I said thrust bearings if no tube.
Of course you need a rigid tower to remain upright. That's why I've suggested guy wires from the top, less material for same strength. With guy wires you might have a spinning tube but no non-rotating tower. In that case, guy wires also need to handle a bit of torque (drag in bearings), like the spokes of a bicycle wheel.
Are your blades airfoils, either in an arc or a rectangle between top and bottom of spinning tube, only connect to tube at ends?
Or, are they paddles (like a split 50 gallon drum wind turbine), and connected to tube full length?
If the former, only thing I see tube doing is taking tension/compression. Which is why I said thrust bearings if no tube.
Of course you need a rigid tower to remain upright. That's why I've suggested guy wires from the top, less material for same strength. With guy wires you might have a spinning tube but no non-rotating tower. In that case, guy wires also need to handle a bit of torque (drag in bearings), like the spokes of a bicycle wheel.
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
there is a lot to unpack here.
Currently I am using a drag type system. As in I start out with pedals as blades. You might have seen the animated gif of them.
I will either upgrade them to a much lighter and larger version or I will go to an airfoil system.
Sure the structure needs to remain upright. But my burning question is how to get it upright to begin with.
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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What diameter turbine? How tall?
A tall pole, hinged at the base, would have upper portion near parallel to the ground. You could attach blades, rotating as you work. It could be tilted up by typical right angle boom and cable (restrained by other cables so it doesn't go past upright and fall the othe rway.. Once upright it could either continue to use cables as guy wires (maybe attached below turbine, or above and below for much greater strength). or, secure to a second pole or tripod set in the ground. Could simply have hinged gusset base.
An alternative is to assemble blades to it while erect. But I like the idea of tilt-up.
A tall pole, hinged at the base, would have upper portion near parallel to the ground. You could attach blades, rotating as you work. It could be tilted up by typical right angle boom and cable (restrained by other cables so it doesn't go past upright and fall the othe rway.. Once upright it could either continue to use cables as guy wires (maybe attached below turbine, or above and below for much greater strength). or, secure to a second pole or tripod set in the ground. Could simply have hinged gusset base.
An alternative is to assemble blades to it while erect. But I like the idea of tilt-up.
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
currently 4m diam
for the animated gif please see
diysolarforum.com
but 4m diam might be for newbs only. I am contemplating 6m diam.
eeerrr wait, what is my avatar name again?
for the animated gif please see
Building the sickest ® VAWT ever. Brilliant minds unite please!!
yes agreed, this modeling is below my abilities. well bite me. I am on a linux system now and for the time being can not use my software of choice. But can one see where I am aiming at?
diysolarforum.com
but 4m diam might be for newbs only. I am contemplating 6m diam.
eeerrr wait, what is my avatar name again?
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
blade height 2.4m blade width 63cm
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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4m D, 2 m R, reasonable to stand on a step ladder while connecting each paddle.
So I suggest a long pole hinged at the base. How high off the ground do you plan?
Your GIF of a drag device close to the ground won't perform particularly worse due to the turbulence. Good for a start. Later will want an airfoil, elevated above turbulence.
Which means measuring airspeed and turbulence vs. altitude should be done. Maybe a tower or balloon or kite carrying an anemometer (drag device) and a turbine (airfoil, relies on lift.)
So I suggest a long pole hinged at the base. How high off the ground do you plan?
Your GIF of a drag device close to the ground won't perform particularly worse due to the turbulence. Good for a start. Later will want an airfoil, elevated above turbulence.
Which means measuring airspeed and turbulence vs. altitude should be done. Maybe a tower or balloon or kite carrying an anemometer (drag device) and a turbine (airfoil, relies on lift.)
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
I had planed the turbine arounf 12m from the ground. But because of turbulence and the fact that I do not like fast spinning things around my house I focussed on DRAG first.
the more I look at the animated gif the more I think guy wires, as you suggested, might be good.
I mean in winter time no one is on the lawn anyway. During summer I can just store the turbine.
This is assuming though that the turbine will actually generate something worthwhile.
the more I look at the animated gif the more I think guy wires, as you suggested, might be good.
I mean in winter time no one is on the lawn anyway. During summer I can just store the turbine.
This is assuming though that the turbine will actually generate something worthwhile.
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
we will "soon" know more about actual output
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
WTF is that?
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
a self adjusting blade is what it is?
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
yess of course. we can't do with standard stuff. we need the sickest® there is!!
Now in my mind this is only a prototype. Things well get larger. But it is a proof of concept.
My thinking is that with light weight rigiid panels around a central axis we can have blades that auto rotate into the least sub-optimum position while it spins.
When we apply a torsion spring in the middle of the blade it wants to open again just in time.
When the wind is too strong it overtakes the pressure of the torsion spring and it will act as an additional break.
If I did believe in patents I would already filed for one on this
Search behind in this thread and you will find a 3d model I made of it way back/. But then I said I could never do it.
I now believe I can.
Now in my mind this is only a prototype. Things well get larger. But it is a proof of concept.
My thinking is that with light weight rigiid panels around a central axis we can have blades that auto rotate into the least sub-optimum position while it spins.
When we apply a torsion spring in the middle of the blade it wants to open again just in time.
When the wind is too strong it overtakes the pressure of the torsion spring and it will act as an additional break.
If I did believe in patents I would already filed for one on this
Search behind in this thread and you will find a 3d model I made of it way back/. But then I said I could never do it.
I now believe I can.
Last edited:
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
WOW!
it turns out I never said I could not build it
diysolarforum.com
I said I probably would not.
Well, times change don't they?
it turns out I never said I could not build it
Building the sickest ® VAWT ever. Brilliant minds unite please!!
@Hedges I might have found a reason not to make the coil separators from iron filled filament. My reasoning is that the magnetic flux needs to pass through the coils and having iron filled filament will attract the magnetic field between the coils rather than through them. Yes, any magnetic...
diysolarforum.com
I said I probably would not.
Well, times change don't they?
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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Improved drag device, but not an airfoil.
I'd guess performance falls between the two.
Call it an "Air Wheel (tm)", similar to a water wheel that drags in a stream, returns without having to fight current.
Would a flopping airfoil be an improvement over conventional airfoil VAWT? (until spontaneous disassembly.)
I'd guess performance falls between the two.
Call it an "Air Wheel (tm)", similar to a water wheel that drags in a stream, returns without having to fight current.
Would a flopping airfoil be an improvement over conventional airfoil VAWT? (until spontaneous disassembly.)
brandnewb
Going for serious. starting as newb
hahhahha
and now you have hit the nail on its head.
Airfoils need around 4 times, if not more, the velocity than the wind is blowing at to do any actual lifting and in an urban setting that is just not responsible.
Also they do not auto start.
Nah let me tinker on an Air Wheel ®
