EG4 new AIO rated 12K output and 18kPV aka "EG4-18Kpv-12LV"

[robby]

Why would you suspect that James doesn't know?

Given his answer that Inverters are going to catch fire if they are in open loop. That makes zero sense.

And it's not a luxpower demand.

From what I was told it is. They also told Fortress Power that the units had to be operated in closed loop mode.

With the new rules, communication will be required.

Do the new rules speak directly about this? I have not heard that mentioned but I agree it will probably be a requirement at some point.

I don't see what James or signature solar has to do with any of this. Everyone will have it in due time. Isn't that just obvious?

That is what I said, that it is a Luxpower requirement. I asked them that question in the other thread.

 

[SignatureSolarJames]

Given his answer that Inverters are going to catch fire if they are in open loop. That makes zero sense.

From what I was told it is. They also told Fortress Power that the units had to be operated in closed loop mode.

Do the new rules speak directly about this? I have not heard that mentioned but I agree it will probably be a requirement at some point.

That is what I said, that it is a Luxpower requirement. I asked them that question in the other thread.

inverters catching fire was never mentioned. this mistake seems to be a good way to keep your rant going.
Pls do something better tonight.

also not a lux requirement. your facts are made up again

 

[Tulex]

inverters catching fire was never mentioned. this mistake seems to be a good way to keep your rant going.
Pls do something better tonight.

also not a lux requirement. your facts are made up again

I think your post 263......

 

[SparkyJJO]

If we “support” open loop insanity then we get liability related to every open loop fire hazard out of shenzhen

@Tulex Looks like he's talking about batteries not inverters to me.tule

 

[Tulex]

@Tulex Looks like he's talking about batteries not inverters to me.tule

Oh, that might be, I was just pointing out where fire was mentioned.

 

[cs1234]

inverters catching fire was never mentioned. this mistake seems to be a good way to keep your rant going.
Pls do something better tonight.

also not a lux requirement. your facts are made up again

Whether it's the EG418k branded inverter causing fires with open loop batteries, or lighting itself on fire because it allows open loop in the firmware but doesn't fully support it as other inverters in the past do is kind of irrelevant. Unless you are saying that all the past inverters by you and other companies all have what is now deemed excessive risk of making open loop batteries catch fire?

Or is it something about the design of these new eg418k inverters that causes open loop batteries to possibly catch fire? But with closed loop batteries they are much safer than other inverters of the past, to the point the open loop sacrifice is worth it?

Hopefully you will fill us in on all the details in the announcement/post you mentioned a little while ago in this thread.

It's nice that you participate in threads here, but you shouldn't talk trash to people. It isn't a good look for a company representative. Even if you feel we are being mean to you, you should turn the other cheek, take a breather and temper your reply.

 

[Lt.Dan]

I have to admit, I was under the impression that the problem was the Batteries cutting off, and the inverter not being capable to handle to sudden shutoff of current, and catching on fire. I did not understand it as the batteries catching on fire.

 

[timselectric]

As long as open loop doesn't void the warranty. I can put this one back on my list. (Assuming it passes the test of time)
I have several customers that are getting very interested in solar. And as a professional installation, it will be using closed loop.
But I'm not going to install anything for a customer, that I have not personally vetted.
and I have no interest in closed loop, for myself. As long as open loop doesn't become the get out of jail free card.
I completely understand that if the unit was damaged by something else that I connected to it. Then of course that's on me.

 

[timselectric]

I have to admit, I was under the impression that the problem was the Batteries cutting off, and the inverter not being capable to handle to sudden shutoff of current, and catching on fire. I did not understand it as the batteries catching on fire.

I really don't understand what the answer is, either.
If a breaker or fuse opens the circuit. This is also an instantaneous disconnect.
These are protection devices. I would hope that their activation would make it safer. Versus risking a fire Hazzard.

 

[cs1234]

Though it might be hard to believe, I actually like the looks of this EG418k inverter on paper. If it ends up having properly functioning zero export support, I'm considering getting one. In the meantime, I just want to help SignatureSolar get all the details out here first. The same helpful service I provide for every other manufacturer here, free of charge so far. ?

 

[PreppenWolf]

? Comms was the whole reason for the discussion as it pertains to warranty coverage / safety with this inverter.

Are you using lead acid, which James says is covered under warranty if not using comms? Or are you using lifepo4 of some sort that is possibly not covered under warranty if you use it without comms?

I wouldn't care about the warranty. I build my own LiFePO4 packs. Server racks would need to be half the current price for me to even consider using them.

 

[cs1234]

I wouldn't care about the warranty. I build my own LiFePO4 packs. Server racks would need to be half the current price for me to even consider using them.

I honestly don't care about the warranty either. They either honor it, or they don't. It's gotten to the point where I view warranties as a bonus lotto scratcher ticket type of deal. But, some people might care about the warranty. A little bit of time on our end, when we have nothing else to do, because we are hopeless internet forum addicts, could save somebody else some hassle later. "It's the principle of the thing, sir!"

If the BMS on your custom batteries has comms that are compatible with it, they say they will cover you under their highest tier. At least as long as you connect it up to share logs, which considering they would get access to when they got it back anyway, what's the harm?

 

[robby]

If we “support” open loop insanity then we get liability related to every open loop fire hazard out of shenzhen

I really don't understand what the answer is, either.
If a breaker or fuse opens the circuit. This is also an instantaneous disconnect.
These are protection devices. I would hope that their activation would make it safer. Versus risking a fire Hazzard.

Yep I had no idea what James was talking about and I said that several times.
He could have come back and clarified what was catching on fire but instead stayed low until now.
In any case it still makes no sense.
He sure does get aroused by every post I make, even if I am saying the same thing 10 other people posted before me.

 

[cs1234]

He sure does get aroused by every post I make, even if I am saying the same thing 10 other people posted before me.

Sol-Ark 12K / 28x LG-365W Panels / 26KWh eFlex Batteries with one EG4LL / Solar Assistant and PowerView with closed loop battery communication.

Your ratio of EG4 to non EG4 equipment isn't high enough sir. It's like you are rubbing stuff right in his face. Get with the program already!

 

[Shimmy]

Is the closed-loop discussion an eventual UL9540 issue?

 

[SparkyJJO]

Is the closed-loop discussion an eventual UL9540 issue?

Good question.

I can see where closed loop can be good (BMS can report cell imbalance so instead of the BMS totally disconnecting due to a runner cell, it can keep things online while it balances it out maybe, that sort of thing). I don't get the "fire hazard" part though. Even if a BMS fails to do its job (or is set incorrectly or w/e) and it lets a cell overcharge a good amount, since when does LFP catch fire just because the cell overcharged some? We've seen many cases on here where someone managed to overcharge their LFP cell well above 3.65v and the cell, while bloated, doesn't burn down the place. They aren't the "I'll-explode-if-you-look-at-me-funny" other cell chemistries.

Glad it sounds like they aren't going to void some warranty because of using open loop though.

 

[Quattrohead]

In our push to make solar projects do-able and affordable for more people we have to make sure the support speed and efficiency can be delivered in a way to not leave people hanging who are on a tight budget with timeframes they can't manage. the only way I see this happening is by removing variables and creating access to support for efficient troubleshooting. I think several of you guys will come around to this and hope y'all can encourage others to do these 2 things if the most rapid support is a concern for them

OMG James has been taken over by a chinese AI chatbot

 

[SignatureSolarJames]

Good question.

I can see where closed loop can be good (BMS can report cell imbalance so instead of the BMS totally disconnecting due to a runner cell, it can keep things online while it balances it out maybe, that sort of thing). I don't get the "fire hazard" part though. Even if a BMS fails to do its job (or is set incorrectly or w/e) and it lets a cell overcharge a good amount, since when does LFP catch fire just because the cell overcharged some? We've seen many cases on here where someone managed to overcharge their LFP cell well above 3.65v and the cell, while bloated, doesn't burn down the place. They aren't the "I'll-explode-if-you-look-at-me-funny" other cell chemistries.

Glad it sounds like they aren't going to void some warranty because of using open loop though.

it is like a propane leak as the cells off gas at extreme voltage, if the propane does not find a spark you could in theory escape a fire. all 9540 or 9540 tests involve a flame inside the battery so this benefit of the doubt is removed lol

 

[SparkyJJO]

it is like a propane leak as the cells off gas at extreme voltage, if the propane does not find a spark you could in theory escape a fire. all 9540 or 9540 tests involve a flame inside the battery so this benefit of the doubt is removed lol

But how extreme are we talking? What does it really take to get a LFP cell to off gas? We've seen people overcharge cells to 4V and they only get puffy but no leak of any sort.

9540 tests involve an already-ignited fire?

 

[Shimmy]

But how extreme are we talking? What does it really take to get a LFP cell to off gas? We've seen people overcharge cells to 4V and they only get puffy but no leak of any sort.

9540 tests involve an already-ignited fire?

"Inherently safe" testing. Kind of points to the absurdity of it all...