zanydroid
Solar Wizard
I think 32gw is for all solar
Midnite Solar Announced their new 10kw AIO at Intersolar Today
- Thread starter HighTechLab
- Start date
jarred125
New Member
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2021
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It wasn’t terrible to get my interconnect, Duke just had a bunch of incompetent people reviewing plans. I had to point out multiple times where they were wrong when they tried to reject my plans.
I was a novice and I was instructing their folks on what was acceptable and that my plans showed exactly what they were requiring. Multiple times rejected for stuff they missed on a single line diagram that was as closed to simple as you could get.
Zwy
Emperor Of Solar
Ratio will change as rates rise, battery storage drops in price.
The utility companies are working very hard at statehouse level to get legislation passed that favors them. Most likely you will see people install systems not grid tied for load reduction and UPS but not permitted.
The marketplace can override government regulation and corporate greed.
Battery storage will increase-it should- but most of those systems will be grid tied as well.
I can see where they make it almost impossible to grid tie. That day is coming. Hopefully the price of off grid solar will have come down to a level where no one even cares if they export or not.
I also hope the big money in solar is behind the scenes fighting all these roadblocks. There is some serious money backing pv and they are not going to go down without a fight
Dave911
Solar Enthusiast
We need to be careful about the definition of grid tie vs off grid. With a hybrid setup you can be connected to the grid, but not grid tied. If you dont export, your just a load. Some of these inverters and operate without batteries and consume power when no solar and use PV when there is solar and mix it when its in between.
That is still considered off grid in the sense that you are not exporting.
Im in the process of designing and setting up such a system, but I will include 20kwhr of batteries. Still, I consider it off grid due to not exporting.
Exporting makes zero sense for me. I cant justify installing much when the utility is only willing to pay me just over the wholesale rate for power. About the same rate they buy and sell power at 384kv etc.
We are there now.
Most systems for the foreseeable future will be grid tie. We will see battery backup systems increase but they will be grid tie first.
As time goes on and power gets way more expensive and solar gets way cheaper we may see more off grid systems.
To my a hybrid inverter can feed the grid an off grid inverter can use the grid but cannot feed the grid.
Far from it. The vast majority of systems are Company installed and they are still $3-$5/watt.
Those costs need to come down a lot.
Exporting to the grid still makes sense in many areas.
For example, this month my poco is selling at 13.7c and buying at 7.9c
If I stored all my production in a battery, at 80% round trip efficiency I would save 10.96c vs selling at 7.9c, which makes having a battery hardly worth it.
And that's not even the whole story.
At this time of the year I'm using about 30kwh a day. I'm making about 65kwh. So with a grid tie system the poco is paying me about $2.37 a day to sell to them, which would have been zero with an off grid system.
Everything available has been posted already. Now we waitDesperately looking for content about the Midnite Solar 10kW AIO in any recent posts on this thread.
@HighTechLab will you be offering this aio? Any ideas when it will hit the shelves, or a price?
Dave911
Solar Enthusiast
But thats like saying a pickup truck is unaffordable since a new Ford Platinum with a diesel crew cab is over $100k.
I dont need a new Ford Platinum Diesel. Im ok with a 20 year old pickup with a gas engine for $6000. Thats a huge cost difference.
If you look at my numbers, I can easily afford to ignore exporting power for two reasons, exporting power at just over 3 cents per KWHR with export restrictions makes zero sense compared with the increased cost of the system and possible future dictates from the utility and government. I want to get away from the utility, not be a servant to it.
280 watt used panels are going locally for $45 each.
Racking is my labor and steel at 35 cents per lb.
Batteries are $150/kwhr.
Ill be less than $1/watt with batteries.
Im not including my labor cost. But if Im not working at the time, (Im a contractor), then Im not out $$ for my time.
So yes, when you DIY, you can ignore exporting to the grid and all the utility control BS that comes with that. My payback will still be, realistically 5-7 years.
Still grid tie and if not properly setup could accidentally backfeed. You will need an interconnect permit which = grid tie even if you don't pull from the grid.
MrM1
I'm Here, But I'm Not All There
This is exactly what I'm hoping for in the new Midnite unit. An inverter that will be highly customizable for grid interaction without export. But one that does it well with out concern for even the slightest bit of export ... Down to a few watts. My PoCo showed up at my door one Monday after my microwave start surge force my inverter to do some weird send back of about 150w for less than 15 seconds a few times on Sunday - it was a simple setting I was testing ... But they knew. (we don't have an interconnect bc we don't export)
Right now I'm doing this with a 4000 watt SW4024 and MN classics. 6k of solar in and 32kWh of storage. The SW is now too small for my needs and doesn't do customizable grid interactive as well as I'd like. Favors grid for loads too much.
Zwy
Emperor Of Solar
I consider the definition of grid tie to be any export into grid. Whether you get to bank it or not.
I consider off grid to never export to grid and micro grid with grid backup to be off grid. Micro grid should not require an interconnection agreement as there isn't any export to grid. If there is a cord that you plug into the wall to provide grid backup, an inverter with a built in transfer switch or a manual transfer switch in place, it should be micro grid.
im talking about the macro level. yes, you can build your own truck but most people buy a truck. so, no we are not close to where it makes sense to not grid tie
42OhmsPA
What's in a title?
I've had zero issues with export for over a year.
Almost a year with a voltronic and SRNE since Sept.
I don't understand how there are so many issues.
Robbert
Solar Enthusiast
It is my understanding that some Voltronic inverters (like mpp solar pipMax) do deliver back very small amounts, even if not reported in de app/SA.
that would be difficult, unless they have the ability to sync to the grid frequency, which I doubt
Dave911
Solar Enthusiast
You are missing my point entirely. Did I ever say anything about building your own truck? No.
We are on the DIYSOLARFORUM.... Not the UtilitySolarForum.... Not the GlobalSolarForum....
I'm in Indiana, USA
Context is everything!
In the Context of DIYSOLAR ..... I can ignore exporting to the grid and still get a 5-7 year payback and I'm being conservative.
That works now. Read @timselectric build thread.
That said, you can make this almost as expensive as you want. But then I refer back to my pickup truck analogy.
Do you need to? No.
You are missing my point entirely. Did I ever say anything about building your own truck? No.
We are on the DIYSOLARFORUM.... Not the UtilitySolarForum.... Not the GlobalSolarForum....
I'm in Indiana, USA
Context is everything!
In the Context of DIYSOLAR ..... I can ignore exporting to the grid and still get a 5-7 year payback and I'm being conservative.
That works now. Read @timselectric build thread.
That said, you can make this almost as expensive as you want. But then I refer back to my pickup truck analogy.
Do you need to? No.
You said "we are there now". Maybe you meant to say "I am there now" because "WE" certainly are not at a price point where we can just choose not to tie in with the grid.
Dave911
Solar Enthusiast
I know you have the SRNE inverter. What voltronic inverter do you have?
That SRNE inverter is definitely on my list. However I may be willing to spend more for warranty and support.
The EG4 stuff continues to fail to impress me.
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