diy solar

diy solar

Signature Solar said "Will Prowse setup is wrong and dangerous"

jhcrowe said:
Will's video "Beginner Friendly 48V Solar Power System! Step by step!" inspired me to purchase my 1st solar setup:
EG4 LifePower4 Lithium Battery | 48V 100AH
EG4 3kW Off-Grid Inverter | 3000EHV-48
4 x 415 Watt Panels

The system is stand alone (There is no other power coming in besides the panels).
As Will suggested I used a power strip for my output. I am only running a 60W light off the power strip. The light flickers all the time so I called Signature Solar's customer support. They stated quite clearly that I must connect the output to a grounded panel and that Will's video is wrong and dangerous to me and any equipment connected to the power strip. Being so new this concerned me enough that I have disconnected everything hoping to get some clarification:
1. Is Signature solar correct that the current setup is dangerous to me and anything connected to the power strip?
2. Why does signature solar think Will's setup is incorrect?
3. Is connecting to a grounded panel the only way to stop the light from flickering?

Thanks in advance for everyone's help!
Click to expand...
If you really want to freak them out tell them you put a power strip on it and its powering a pi computer running solar assistant that is connected to the inverter too.

Oh and have popcorn. Might as well really enjoy the show :)
 
EG4_Jarrett said:
This is typically the reason they say that. Most power strips are not rated for the amount of power that the inverter can output, and MOST people use is for a lot more than 60w of lights.
I have seen beginner solar installations with power strips on the output of the inverter and they are powering far more than that surge protector can handle (skill saws, power tools, AC Units, etc...). Those extension chords and power strips typically melt because there is no path to ground, and the heat starts to make the components fail.


If you are not running a ground from the inverter to a ground rod, then yes. You need to make sure that the system has a path to ground.
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90% of the stuff in the panel can't handle the total output of the inverter. As long as you don't put more than 10 to 15 amps worth of stuff on it there is no more danger doing what the op did than there would be plugging it into the wall powered by the grid.
 
EG4_Jarrett said:
This is typically the reason they say that. Most power strips are not rated for the amount of power that the inverter can output, and MOST people use is for a lot more than 60w of lights.
Click to expand...

So you are saying the power strip not being rated for the amount of power causes the light flicker? :ROFLMAO:

Do you write the "script" support uses when you call in? Because it sure sounds like you might be the writer of the "script".


EG4_Jarrett said:
I have seen beginner solar installations with power strips on the output of the inverter and they are powering far more than that surge protector can handle (skill saws, power tools, AC Units, etc...). Those extension chords and power strips typically melt because there is no path to ground, and the heat starts to make the components fail.
Click to expand...
And this is what causes light flicker? How about we address what the OP has stated is a problem (light flicker was the reason for the call)?



EG4_Jarrett said:
If you are not running a ground from the inverter to a ground rod, then yes. You need to make sure that the system has a path to ground.
Click to expand...
Hang on a minute, let's address the light flicker problem first and foremost and forget the OP was testing the unit to see if it had any problems. Which it does, the light flickers.

These units should work with a floating ground, as Signature Solar is stating on this page:
In an RV build, the unit needs to bond N-G at the inverter under inverter power or the RV needs to have a panel supplied by the inverter that bonds N-G. However the latter is usually not done because shore power is sometimes used and having a panel with N-G bond in the RV would cause objectionable current on G.

The BIG question is whether this unit dynamically bonds N-G under inverter power? This is the first and foremost question that needs to be answered before spouting off about ground rods (I want to see you pounding that ground rod in every time you park your RV :ROFLMAO:).

Once that is answered, then we can proceed.

If this unit is built and shipped without a ground screw with the option to dynamically bond N and G and Signature Solar is stating:

and someone gets killed, then SS and EG4 will be bankrupt after the jury awards the judgement for manslaughter.

So what is the answer? I shall await your response.
 
Markus_EG4 said:
Come on guys leave Jarrett alone he’s really trying.
If you guys seen some of the set ups after Wills video Tech Support saw and had to troubleshoot you would understand his side better. People complaining about getting shocked and so on.
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All 3 of you seem to be trying I'll give you that, it's noticed and appreciated.
Don't forget to recognize the other forum members who aren't even employees that go above and beyond in helping those that have issues. I've seen some engaged in troubleshooting for days on end until things are resolved.
I can only imagine some of the stuff you've seen, it scares me thinking about it after some of the stuff I've seen here.
I worked in tech support for a few years, it's unbelievable what people deem to be ok...
The issue is the multiple repeat issues that don't seem to end, that isn't seen with other active vendors.
Honestly I feel it should be mandatory that multiple photos of a system and list of settings are required when creating a post for help.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, keep fighting the good fight.
 
42OhmsPA said:
All 3 of you seem to be trying I'll give you that, it's noticed and appreciated.
Don't forget to recognize the other forum members who aren't even employees that go above and beyond in helping those that have issues. I've seen some engaged in troubleshooting for days on end until things are resolved.
I can only imagine some of the stuff you've seen, it scares me thinking about it after some of the stuff I've seen here.
I worked in tech support for a few years, it's unbelievable what people deem to be ok...
The issue is the multiple repeat issues that don't seem to end, that isn't seen with other active vendors.
Honestly I feel it should be mandatory that multiple photos of a system and list of settings are required when creating a post for help.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, keep fighting the good fight.
Click to expand...
Man I love your attitude and everything you all do on here.

This forum is a great place to help people out and get into solar.

Not only that but learn electrical as well the knowledge base here is awesome.
 
Zwy said:
Do you write the "script" support uses when you call in? Because it sure sounds like you might be the writer of the "script".
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wow. a statement that provides no value to your argument going on here, and taking things out of context. do better bud
 
ksmithaz1 said:
I will admit it may not be ideal, however, most power strips are rated at 120v/15A. and use #14 wire pigtails. They typically have a breaker/fault switch, and are generally 3-prong grounded NEMA 5-15 outlets. That means it should handle 12A sustained at 120v = ~1500Watts

Therefore your statement makes no sense, since the outlets should be grounded. Most small power tools use <1000 watts and rarely would you have more than one operating at the same time. Non-the-less it should blow the breaker on the strip if you pull too many amps.

Having a path to ground has nothing whatsoever to do with overloading, ground is a safety issue to trip breakers. Nothing will melt because it has no path to ground. If you have no breaker on the strip, then you could melt it by overloading it.
Click to expand...
The power strip may have a ground conductor but it has to trace back to a ground somewhere off the invertor (off grid) or main panel panel (on grid). You can leave the ground screw in the invertor and bond the inverter to the hand cart. If you are really paranoid you can run a wire from the cart to a copper/aluminum stake that you jam into the earth when you run the jnvertor.
 
Why is the 60watt light flickering?

How does a ground wire make the 60watt light flicker?
 
Crowz said:
Why is the 60watt light flickering?

How does a ground wire make the 60watt light flicker?
Click to expand...
It doesn't. The bulb could be sensitive to the particular inverter output or the inverter is unstable either from a slight fault or the way it is being used.
 
Markus_EG4 said:
Come on guys leave Jarrett alone he’s really trying.
If you guys seen some of the set ups after Wills video Tech Support saw and had to troubleshoot you would understand his side better. People complaining about getting shocked and so on.
Click to expand...
Can someone answer the question about the unit dynamically bonding N-G?

Either it does or doesn't. If it doesn't have a bonding screw when shipped, it definitely doesn't.
 
snoberry said:
wow. a statement that provides no value to your argument going on here, and taking things out of context. do better bud
Click to expand...
Zwy did some "product development work" unintentionally on the EG4-6500EX, ultimately concluding it had some shortcomings, and apparently SS agreed as they sunset that product...long story.
 
ksmithaz1 said:
Having said that, ... A quality line-interactive UPS would be better for your TV's. Laptop, or anything that has a nice power supply in the front it won't matter, and the fridge won't care.
Click to expand...

Newbie here so be gentle - Why would a UPS be better for TV/electronics that an inverter that puts out a nice clean pure sine wave? All modern devices you mention run from a HF switching PSU and then they use the DC output. So they generally would work fine from an inverter or a UPS. The only thing a UPS would potentially buy that I can think of is a shorter transfer time to battery power?

Am I missing something?
 
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