#1) …Uhhhh, how about 100’s of hours.. for years….. at least in my case….
# 2) ..I have way less money in the bank…..
#3) …I seem to have developed a Blueish tint when I look in the mirror…
J.
Unintended consequences of Solar that we see
- Thread starter OffGridForGood
- Start date
# 2) ..I have way less money in the bank…..
#3) …I seem to have developed a Blueish tint when I look in the mirror…
J.
Lt.Dan
Solar Wizard
THIS. I can't count on both hands and feet how many times people ask if they can put their 4000 sq/ft home on solar/battery for pennies. It's one of the main reason I won't do work for friends/family anymore (like I'm sure a lot of people here have already learned).
But ill give them advice on where to go, what to look out for, and what equipement they would want/dont need. Then once they get several quotes from solar installers, they always ignore everything i recommended, they go for the cheapest bid with Chinese microinverters, and very little (or no) options for battery backup, and still spend 2x more than they should have, just to ask me why it's not working the way they expected.
/endrant
Zwy
Emperor Of Solar
Young Mennonite neighbor 1/4 mile from me called and asked about my system. He was looking at grid tie and wanted a roof mount. There are 10 acres there, I looked at that place before purchasing this one. There is a shed on the property and the south side would be perfect for a ground mount, no trees just open field. I told him what I would do if I was him, it snows here and stays cold so panels might not clear on a fixed ground mount at 45°, I did a video this winter showing 9 days of lost production on a fixed ground mount. On the south side of the shed, he might be able to get by with a ground mount just due to being a few degrees warmer, however more snow could drift on the array.
Noticed the other day a van was there and installation of rails on the attached garage roof which is a 4/12 pitch. Panels and grid tie electrical installed the next. The only thing he had going for him was he installed a steel roof a year ago. Windbreak isn't that good there, with the roof eave facing south, it will get loaded with snow from the NW wind, no avoiding it.
The salesman told him just what he wanted to hear. I can only imagine what it cost him. Live and learn. He will be learning this next year.
Last edited:
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
Tell me about it.
It. Never. Ends.
More tweaking yesterday, added / augmented some load shed automations as well as output source priority mode change and giving higher priority to home battery over EV charging.
Aside from free electricity tariff periods, self-consumption is the game with several loads automatically adjusting to available PV. Yellow production, red consumption, overlap orange = self consumption
Spike in consumption on 30 March is the free tariff period (which by the way are becoming more common here - another consequence of how much solar PV we have on the grid).
Then my wife puts on the dryer during this morning's peak hour, right when I want to preserve some battery for the crappy solar day ahead.
I. Will. Not. Say. Anything.
Might bring out the EV and draw some energy from it to charge the home battery, just for a bit of a fun experiment. We have some solid rain expect to start today and go through for a couple more days.
Every large roof looks like a lost opportunity to me now. I mean, why aren't they taking advantage of free energy? It's worse when I see large commercial buildings. Like WTH are they doing wasting all that great space....
I have to bite my tongue now when I'm in the car with my wife. I think she's tired of hearing the word "solar".
I have to bite my tongue now when I'm in the car with my wife. I think she's tired of hearing the word "solar".
Last edited:
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2020
- Messages
- 21,840
Opportunity costs. Companies get far higher returns investing money elsewhere.
When there is cheap money available, investors will borrow and offer power purchase agreements to such companies.
Sometimes beancounters sign really bad deals, because "cost per month" is all they know.
When there is cheap money available, investors will borrow and offer power purchase agreements to such companies.
Sometimes beancounters sign really bad deals, because "cost per month" is all they know.
two related unintended consequences - (1) I'm constantly looking to expand my setup, and none of the first stage is even built yet. (2) I'm spending ages on eBay making offers on used kit that everyone on there laughs at because they don't realise how much new stuff is. Used pylontech 2000 batteries they won;t let go for less than £1200.....
and I guess the third is me pacing around n my garage roof wondering if its worth cutting down trees to fit two more panels on, when I already know my main roof will take 22 more.....
Do I need all this power? probably not. Do I want it - oh, yes (actually, cos doing the work is the hard part, the cost of adding a bit more in is actually minor - at least, that's what I tell myself).
and I guess the third is me pacing around n my garage roof wondering if its worth cutting down trees to fit two more panels on, when I already know my main roof will take 22 more.....
Do I need all this power? probably not. Do I want it - oh, yes (actually, cos doing the work is the hard part, the cost of adding a bit more in is actually minor - at least, that's what I tell myself).
OffGridForGood
Catch, make or grow everything you can.
Oh Yes!
That whole, I will convince myself that ...is only a small increase in effort since everything else will already be in place...or is that called
fooling myself
OffGridForGood
Catch, make or grow everything you can.
I hear ya!
Power...Must Have More Power...MORE I SAY!!
Power...Must Have More Power...MORE I SAY!!
timselectric
If I can do it, you can do it.
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2022
- Messages
- 20,090
If I have enough power for myself and my neighbors.
Any shortcomings are my neighbors problems.
Any shortcomings are my neighbors problems.
We totally agree ……
I have several friends that have watched what I have done out here…..and see it working…
they are wanting me to help them with the solar stuff they want to create to power their big home and all appliances and etc….…..their budget is +/- a couple of grand…
… im supposed to do it free …..At first I tried to offer what advice I could or felt qualified to offer ….buttt…
No matter what I told them to consider or think about researching ,they do dumb stuff …because “some guy “ they met at the Piggly Wiggly told them that cheap China solar stuff is best..…and that eBay would insure they can’t get ripped off….or they already have alot of 12v car audio stuff from the 90,s …..or …or…or….
I have quit telling anyone I even have a system… and if they know already , I tell em it broke.
I know there are exceptions , but generally leave family and friends alone unless you wish to start a “ not for profit “ solar consulting business …so you can hear about every quirk that ever happens, and trouble shoot it on the phone …..forever ….
That’s just my take on it…….J
Nobodybusiness
Solar Sponge.
So True!!We totally agree ……
I have several friends that have watched what I have done out here…..and see it working…
they are wanting me to help them with the solar stuff they want to create to power their big home and all appliances and etc….…..their budget is +/- a couple of grand…
At first I tried to offer what advice I could or felt qualified to offer ….buttt…
No matter what I told them to consider or think about researching ,they do dumb stuff …because “some guy “ they met at the Piggly Wiggly told them that cheap China solar stuff is best..…and that eBay would insure they can’t get ripped off….or they already have alot of 12v car audio stuff from the 90,s …..or …or…or….
I have quit telling anyone I even have a system… and if they know already , I tell em it broke.
I know there are exceptions , but generally leave family and friends alone unless you wish to start a “ not for profit “ solar consulting business …so you can hear about every quirk that ever happens, and trouble shoot it on the phone …..forever ….
That’s just my take on it…….J
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
Because it costs money to harvest it and to set up the ability to consume it at the time of production. IOW it's not free at all.
Many rooftops are rented.
Many won't have the current ownership for long enough to warrant the spend.
Many cannot afford it.
Many have grid power that is still reasonably priced, or don't use that much electrical energy.
OffGridForGood
Catch, make or grow everything you can.
You are so right !We totally agree ……
I have several friends that have watched what I have done out here…..and see it working…
they are wanting me to help them with the solar stuff they want to create to power their big home and all appliances and etc….…..their budget is +/- a couple of grand…
At first I tried to offer what advice I could or felt qualified to offer ….buttt…
No matter what I told them to consider or think about researching ,they do dumb stuff …because “some guy “ they met at the Piggly Wiggly told them that cheap China solar stuff is best..…and that eBay would insure they can’t get ripped off….or they already have alot of 12v car audio stuff from the 90,s …..or …or…or….
I have quit telling anyone I even have a system… and if they know already , I tell em it broke.
I know there are exceptions , but generally leave family and friends alone unless you wish to start a “ not for profit “ solar consulting business …so you can hear about every quirk that ever happens, and trouble shoot it on the phone …..forever ….
That’s just my take on it…….J
The unintended consequence of going solar...becoming a "not for profit family and friends solar consultant, installer and all hours trouble-shooter!"
timselectric
If I can do it, you can do it.
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2022
- Messages
- 20,090
Nothing new for me.
It's not limited to solar knowledge.
It's not limited to solar knowledge.
wpns
Solar Joules are catch and release
That’s the “You touch it, you own it” issue. Be careful out there!We totally agree ……
I have several friends that have watched what I have done out here…..and see it working…
they are wanting me to help them with the solar stuff they want to create to power their big home and all appliances and etc….…..their budget is +/- a couple of grand…
At first I tried to offer what advice I could or felt qualified to offer ….buttt…
No matter what I told them to consider or think about researching ,they do dumb stuff …because “some guy “ they met at the Piggly Wiggly told them that cheap China solar stuff is best..…and that eBay would insure they can’t get ripped off….or they already have alot of 12v car audio stuff from the 90,s …..or …or…or….
I have quit telling anyone I even have a system… and if they know already , I tell em it broke.
I know there are exceptions , but generally leave family and friends alone unless you wish to start a “ not for profit “ solar consulting business …so you can hear about every quirk that ever happens, and trouble shoot it on the phone …..forever ….
That’s just my take on it…….J
I've been trying to learn the "just shut up - it's not your problem unless someone is paying you to solve it" mantra. I give advice in a couple of niche areas for a living, primarily to large corporations. Even then, I'm amazed at how often the client pays us, thanks us, praises our work, and then goes off and does something completely different. Then they come back later asking for our help to fix the problem they created by not following our advice. Usually, they've had a series of internal meetings where some yahoo with little to no knowledge or experience, who is often now off on some other project or not even part of the company, persuaded or ordered everyone to do it a different way. Inside our company, after hearing each other complain about how frustrating and demoralizing this is (like digging a hole and filling it back in, over and over) we now look at each other and say, "Don't whine - just invoice." That helps a little, but less than you might think. I find it even more frustrating when friends do the same, 'cause they're not paying for the help. So, I try to just shut up more often. Varying degrees of success there...
wpns
Solar Joules are catch and release
I keep telling myself “Billable Hours” but as you note it doesn’t help enough. It’s occasionally nice to refer them back to the consultant that did it wrong. He did it wrong? Gosh, that’s unfortunate.
timselectric
If I can do it, you can do it.
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2022
- Messages
- 20,090
With friends and family, cost is usually the deciding factor.
With my customers, down time is the only thing that matters.
I just finished a project that I have been trying to do for two years.
It took my customer that long to allow me the time to make the repair.
And it only happened because they were already going to be down for other repairs. (That didn't give them a choice)
With my customers, down time is the only thing that matters.
I just finished a project that I have been trying to do for two years.
It took my customer that long to allow me the time to make the repair.
And it only happened because they were already going to be down for other repairs. (That didn't give them a choice)
Tell me about it.
Yep…and anything else you fix too.
timselectric
If I can do it, you can do it.
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2022
- Messages
- 20,090
It's rare for someone to call me to just say hi.
It's usually, "how do I fix this?"
It's usually, "how do I fix this?"
Similar threads
