California proposes “blatant seizure of property” in solar ruling

[Crowz]

The monthly fee, and power rate you pay are based on a pricing model that assumes on average the amount payed for electricity will cover the costs of providing electricity year round. When there's enough shift in the consumption, say from solar self-consumption, the pricing model has to change, to continue to cover the costs of providing electrical service year round.

Well thats nice but that flat minimum power bill covers ALL of that. So if its not correct for them they need to recalculate it and get it approved by the psc for that state. Not the consumers care or concern as to how they use the utility.

That's where they go wrong is by claiming its any of their business what happens on the other side of the meter.

Also the usage patterns are for them to decide how much power to produce or how much power to purchase to sell to the customers.
So if you suddenly stop using hardly any power that minimum fee covers that and within a short period of time their usage models will start adjusting to the changes thus they can allocate money or resources accordingly. Again the power companies problem not the consumers.

 

[ricardocello]

Mark my words, offgrid solar will be illegal one day. I'm currently thinking of ways to hide off-grid arrays from view of satellites. I am thinking vertical orientation bifacials might be best in the future.

And yes, NEM 3.0 is coming to every state.

Satellites, maybe. Planes, no.

I've got airplanes buzzing around the farmland all the time.
Even if I went full vertical on the panels there is some slant angle at which they would see them.
That and the brilliant white nylon reflective tarp around them.

 

[pvgirl]

Well thats nice but that flat minimum power bill covers ALL of that. So if its not correct for them they need to recalculate it and get it approved by the psc for that state. Not the consumers care or concern as to how they use the utility.

And that's the original topic of this thread.

 

[hwy17]

But that's a lie. One that the power companies made up when solar became popular. All power companies that I know of have a minimum power bill. You pay that for the privilege of staying connected. If that fee is good enough for pre solar days and is still good enough now if you don't have solar at all then its good enough for if you do have solar and rarely use any grid power.

That's just not true. It wasn't true back then either, but when nobody was self generating they could bake those costs into the volumetric rates and it wasn't a problem, because nearly everybody was paying those too.

The old minimum power bill was tiny, maybe 10% of the average power bill. We know that utility fixed operating costs are well above that in the range of more like 50%. If you straight up don't believe that's true, then ok I'm not gonna argue with your belief.

 

[G00SE]

the sooner people stop relying on on the government and it’s subsidiaries the sooner they can’t control you
California does what it wants because people allow it.

 

[glandpuck]

I would just disconnect from the grid ... problem solved.

Against the law in California

 

[glandpuck]

They can just set the top charge as standard, and offer discounts for income qualified applicants below that. The FTB can confirm whether all filers at the address are being reported on the income qualification.

No discounts. Billed at full price and taxpayer funds used to pay the bills. IE Public assistance. But NO DISCOUNTS from utilities in CA.

 

[timselectric]

The only solution is to go to war with California.
It's the only way to stop the spread of communism.

 

[pvgirl]

The only solution is to go to war with California.
It's the only way to stop the spread of communism.

Large corporations, fighting regulation to extract more money form consumers, and make their investors happy, sounds just like communism to me.

 

[timselectric]

Cubafornia

 

[SilverbackMP]

Takings clause. Frak these commo-fascists.

 

[glandpuck]

the sooner people stop relying on on the government and it’s subsidiaries the sooner they can’t control you
California does what it wants because people allow it.

I don't think that is entirely true. There are many things here that people try to eradicate or improve. For example, the people fought like an army to preserve NEM 2.0 instead of cancelling it. It was grandfathered in for time being. Many people here have been trying for years to limit assault rifles magazines to 10 bullets. Federal judges strike it down. Judges in San Francisco prevent the homeless from being taken off the street unless the city has a free bed for them. The state is being inundated with migrants seeking asylum and being absorbed into the city centers with no places for them. This is a Federal issue and state doing all it can. Air quality and wildfires are REAL in problems California and yet people are in a constant battle against fossil fuels ruining the state. California is generally socially very liberal, but the citizens still want good, common sense government that works on behalf of people. They don't want graft and corruption. They only get two choices at the ballot box, RED or BLUE. RED's are usually rural areas, if in urban centers they lose. BLUES's are split among Whites, Asians, Hispanics, African Americans, Native Americans, LGBTQ and this requires a coalition of the willing to get anything done.

 

[hwy17]

It's the states that retained more government control over utilities that are doing better with their electricity systems.

This is a map of the ISO/RTO regions that opened their electricity up into an "open market" to "promote competition".

https://www.energy.gov/sites/default/files/Presentation%20by%20Kevin%20Gunn%2C%20MO%20PSC.pdf

Chances are if you are in an "open market" (ISO/RTO) region, your power is a lot more expensive than your nearest neighbors in a government controlled (non ISO/RTO) area.

 

[glandpuck]

So, if your system is off grid, how would you tie it back to the grid? Especially for non-UL equipment.

You don't tie it back in and you still need a permit and inspection which means UL equipment and NFPA 855 rules or UL9540a and UL9540 equipment.

 

[740GLE]

NH visited net metering in 2017 and implemented net billing with full 1:1 on the energy cost and a fraction of the delivery cost for any surplus at the end of the month. All the utilities proposed outrageous plans that would have made solar break even bad. NHPUC set the new plan in place for 5 years while the utilities gathered data to support an alternative plan. 2023 the utilities reported to the NHPUC that they see no reason to change the plan. It's still up to NHPUC, but without the utilities lobbying for a change, I don't see why they would. Regardless, I'm grandfathered in until 2040. For clarity NH utilities do not generate their own electricity and are not allowed to profit off it. They go out for bids twice a year and charge customers the same price per KWH without a mark up. We are allowed to buy electricity from 3rd parties, but one needs to read the fine print if you are on net metering or billing.

kinda, but not quite 1:1

So anyone post 2017 is still assisting is same charges (storm recovery funds/stranded costs) non solar houses are still responsible. If you we’re to break it down it’s prob closer to 1:0.85, it’s more middle of the line.

 

[glandpuck]

The only solution is to go to war with California.
It's the only way to stop the spread of communism.

How exactly would you win? Do you not realize that California is home to most of the military industrial complex, the Air Force with major bases with nuclear weapons, the Marines with Camp Pendelton and Air Station Miramar, the Navy with home to many nuclear submarines and multiple air craft carriers and their supporting ships. Also the mountains and desert would provide a formidable terrain to cross and California ports up and down the coast could not be stopped from importing goods from the rest of the world. Yes, go to war with California. You would lose and we would be laughing and drinking our home grown wine!

 

[Donny Hucklebuck]

Large corporations, fighting regulation to extract more money form consumers, and make their investors happy, sounds just like communism to me.

Making more money for investors and greedy ceo‘s is capitalism
over regulation is communism

 

[theJ]

Mark my words, offgrid solar will be illegal one day. I'm currently thinking of ways to hide off-grid arrays from view of satellites. I am thinking vertical orientation bifacials might be best in the future.

And yes, NEM 3.0 is coming to every state.

I totally disagree with that statement, there are a number of “American states” vs communist states(those of you who understand the reference), this is not a political statement is it a statement of empirical fact that many states have violated the tenant of the constitution and the 10th amendment. There are many states who will not allow such policies to be enacted. However you are governed by those you select in the election process, if you choose poorly this is the net effect, if you do not engage in our constitutional Republic system. This is the outcome. You can choose to dismiss what I'm saying and just say this guy's just talking about politics however every aspect of your life is governed by such. States like comifornia, are no longer representative state. And therefore most people who believe in American values I've chosen to exit the situation.

 

[timselectric]

How exactly would you win? Do you not realize that California is home to most of the military industrial complex, the Air Force with major bases with nuclear weapons, the Marines with Camp Pendelton and Air Station Miramar, the Navy with home to many nuclear submarines and multiple air craft carriers and their supporting ships. Also the mountains and desert would provide a formidable terrain to cross and California ports up and down the coast could not be stopped from importing goods from the rest of the world. Yes, go to war with California. You would lose and we would be laughing and drinking our home grown wine!

Should be easy. Our forces are already behind enemy lines. lol

 

[pvgirl]

I don't think that is entirely true. There are many things here that people try to eradicate or improve. For example, the people fought like an army to preserve NEM 2.0 instead of cancelling it. It was grandfathered in for time being. Many people here have been trying for years to limit assault rifles magazines to 10 bullets. Federal judges strike it down. Judges in San Francisco prevent the homeless from being taken off the street unless the city has a free bed for them. The state is being inundated with migrants seeking asylum and being absorbed into the city centers with no places for them. This is a Federal issue and state doing all it can. Air quality and wildfires are REAL in problems California and yet people are in a constant battle against fossil fuels ruining the state. California is generally socially very liberal, but the citizens still want good, common sense government that works on behalf of people. They don't want graft and corruption. They only get two choices at the ballot box, RED or BLUE. RED's are usually rural areas, if in urban centers they lose. BLUES's are split among Whites, Asians, Hispanics, African Americans, Native Americans, LGBTQ and this requires a coalition of the willing to get anything done.

If only there was an easy way to fix many of those issues, but it's too bad many of California's localities are doing everything in their power stop new housing construction, and people wonder why there are people without homes, or people need to build homes in areas with high fire risk.