Anyone buying these 305ah envision cells?

[Danke]

I've already spent a few hours looking for motors for an old Sonoma I have as well as a replacement motor for my GTI.
The money and time I'd have into swapping the Sonoma wouldn't be worth it. It would hurt to bad to swap the GTI, it's been modified just a little bit heavily...
By the time I get done swapping something I'd be better off buying for a few grand more.

My dream is to have PHEV truck with a huge battery.

But I know if such a thing comes to the market, no matter how expensive gasoline gets, I’m better off (cost-wise) sticking with what I have.

 

[gotbeans]

after this thread with HF I think if my batteries ever leak I'll just blow up my whole yard and move

 

[Surferdudemi]

It's formed from the electrolyte reacting with moisture, the carbon coating on the cathode is fluorine doped, when exposed to water the electrolyte releases fluorine gas and hydrofluoric acid. It is a lower concentration (aprox 4-10%) but that can actually be more dangerous, as the are no acute symptoms but it still readily penatrates the skin, and by the time you realize you've been exposed it can already be too late.

If it leaks out when the cell is punctured, it has not had time to absorb any moisture. So what's leaking out is not HF acid. It might be that over time it reacts with moisture from the air, but not instantaneously.

 

[wild01]

If it leaks out when the cell is punctured, it has not had time to absorb any moisture. So what's leaking out is not HF acid. It might be that over time it reacts with moisture from the air, but not instantaneously.

yes that's true, it needs some time to react, at which point it becomes hfa and offgasses severely toxic fumes. So like idk, sitting in a hot car truck all day? Do you think that just might qualify?

 

[a619]

Just an update here - now that I have had these cells integrated in my system and cycled a few times, I see average battery capacity of around 304Ah for both my packs. I have been charging/ discharging at 175A max using Seplos 200A BMS and all the cells are fairly well balanced using passive balancer alone. Not bad at all for $79 cells!

 

[Surferdudemi]

Just an update here - now that I have had these cells integrated in my system and cycled a few times, I see average battery capacity of around 304Ah for both my packs. I have been charging/ discharging at 175A max using Seplos 200A BMS and all the cells are fairly well balanced using passive balancer alone. Not bad at all for $79 cells!

What settings are you using in the BMS? I've had mixed results with two EEL packs using the (I think) Seplos BMS
If you want, you can just dump the XML settings file if you have access to it.

 

[Dooug]

I keep flip flopping on these cells for my first build...very tempting. Thinking about order 12 cells, build my first 24v pack and if the other 4 are okay build a 12v pack for a friend.

 

[NickC]

I ordered 4cells to test em for a 12v battery for fishing and the coolbox inside my car (charging with solarpanel 405w on top of car ?)

 

[karamazov]

I keep flip flopping on these cells for my first build...very tempting. Thinking about order 12 cells, build my first 24v pack and if the other 4 are okay build a 12v pack for a friend.

Having built my first batteries this year...I'd say just go with known good quality cells from a reputable source for your first build. It's quite an involved project as it is, best to try to control for as many variables as possible. Maybe some others more experienced here would say it's fine, just my 2c.

 

[wild01]

and they sold out again. I was waiting until they where in stock to order, just to make sure there where no surprises. oh well

 

[100kwh-hunter]

I have been lurking on them, great price.
But looking on some numbers:
envision---> 70%SOC gives a 6000cyles.
EVE B grade -->80%SOC gives a 8000 cycles.

So cycle life is less, what about self life?
If even doing 1 cycle a day it would still be 16 years for envision and 21 years for eve.
how would you get out max?
365x(70% of 280ah)=715.400x16=11.446.400
365x(80% of 280ah)=817.600x21=17.169.600 eu
What does this mean?
After there border there is still 70% left or in eves case 80% left of the original capacity.
I think after twice the life span the numbers willlook like this:
365x(40% of 280ah)=408.800x16+715.400x16=17.987.200
365x(60% of 280ah)=613.200x21+817.600x21=30.046.800

so for after 32 years or after 42 years it depends on what you want and need, how old you are and how big your battery is or is going to be.
I doubt that one with a resonal battery could do 1 cycle a day, most of us do more than 10kwh a day and most of us have 50kwh+, plus the sun does not always shine enough, not all have wind or water generators implemented in our system.

For me and my wife with max 30 years working life left incl two ev's(soon) i think i still would go with EVE.
However, they are very tempting....buy a set extra? so 5 sets of Envision or four sets of eve to make it balance?
Price wise it is the same.
365x(40% of 280ah)=408.800x16+715.400x16=17.987.200x5?
365x(60% of 280ah)=613.200x21+817.600x21=30.046.800x4?

Something else to consider, new technologie, like sodium or other new not invented chems.

Just some food for thoughts, i must say very honest they are very tempting, very tempting....

 

[houseofancients]

I have been lurking on them, great price.
But looking on some numbers:
envision---> 70%SOC gives a 6000cyles.
EVE B grade -->80%SOC gives a 8000 cycles.

So cycle life is less, what about self life?
If even doing 1 cycle a day it would still be 16 years for envision and 21 years for eve.
how would you get out max?
365x(70% of 280ah)=715.400x16=11.446.400
365x(80% of 280ah)=817.600x21=17.169.600 eu
What does this mean?
After there border there is still 70% left or in eves case 80% left of the original capacity.
I think after twice the life span the numbers willlook like this:
365x(40% of 280ah)=408.800x16+715.400x16=17.987.200
365x(60% of 280ah)=613.200x21+817.600x21=30.046.800

so for after 32 years or after 42 years it depends on what you want and need, how old you are and how big your battery is or is going to be.
I doubt that one with a resonal battery could do 1 cycle a day, most of us do more than 10kwh a day and most of us have 50kwh+, plus the sun does not always shine enough, not all have wind or water generators implemented in our system.

For me and my wife with max 30 years working life left incl two ev's(soon) i think i still would go with EVE.
However, they are very tempting....buy a set extra? so 5 sets of Envision or four sets of eve to make it balance?
Price wise it is the same.
365x(40% of 280ah)=408.800x16+715.400x16=17.987.200x5?
365x(60% of 280ah)=613.200x21+817.600x21=30.046.800x4?

Something else to consider, new technologie, like sodium or other new not invented chems.

Just some food for thoughts, i must say very honest they are very tempting, very tempting....

Lol..
Funny how eve went from 4000 cycles to 8000 without significant changes ?
30 years life will NEVER happen

 

[SeaGal]

I have been lurking on them, great price.
But looking on some numbers:
envision---> 70%SOC gives a 6000cyles.
EVE B grade -->80%SOC gives a 8000 cycles.

So cycle life is less, what about self life?
If even doing 1 cycle a day it would still be 16 years for envision and 21 years for eve.
how would you get out max?

To be honest I think that is all academic. I only have 14.3kWh (16 x EVE LF280Ks), push them really hard and in 15 months the cycle count is only 263.

Calendar aging will be, by far, the biggest factor. Not sure in my case whether the limiting calendar aging factor will be me or my LiFePO4's, but either way, I know that in less than 5 years time they will be so much cheaper than they were 18 months ago. Hence decisions on cycle life of them I made in 2022 will be irrelevant.

 

[100kwh-hunter]

Funny how eve went from 4000 cycles to 8000 without significant changes ?

to80% of state of charge, if you are using 100% then you will have no more then 4000 left.
EVE also has several species of cells, their not only for automotive industrie.

 

[100kwh-hunter]

So it is clever to buy then or stick with EVE?

 

[Zwy]

to80% of state of charge, if you are using 100% then you will have no more then 4000 left.
EVE also has several species of cells, their not only for automotive industrie.

It takes me several days to run a complete cycle of my battery bank. Calendar aging will have a bigger effect long term than using that power. I run to about 98% SOC and don't worry about it. When the cells are done, then I move on.

At 80% SOC, you will find there will be problems with cell balance.

 

[G00SE]

So it is clever to buy then or stick with EVE?

Imo they were a clever purchase. But I think that will be person dependent.
I have a large bank desire. Reasonable prices on reasonable equipment will help me get there
I perceive these cells as both. Only time will tell, but I paid less than half the cost of an eg4 6 battery rack for the same capacity so I feel like I won

 

[houseofancients]

So it is clever to buy then or stick with EVE?

Have bought 16 last summer to test, after always using lf304 .
Am really happy with them, ordered 32 more, and will keep these as my standard

 

[100kwh-hunter]

At 80% SOC, you will find there will be problems with cell balance.

All my banks have a 1A balancer, turn on every 3 months as long as needed, usually 3 days, when in 5 days, something is pretty wrong, i think
But some folks have stated those envision are pretty time resistant.
I think i will give it a go, again you get what you pay for?

 

[Zwy]

All my banks have a 1A balancer, turn on every 3 months as long as needed, usually 3 days, when in 5 days, something is pretty wrong, i think
But some folks have stated those envision are pretty time resistant.
I think i will give it a go, again you get what you pay for?

How can you balance cells effectively below 3.4V?