Auto Starting My Generac

[KolinCancer]

I have an offgrid setup that has been running well enough but id like it to be fully automated. Ill include links to all of the components in my setup but basically im trying to figure out how to use my inverters dry contacts to auto start my generator. my current setup is generator to ats. breaker on my panel to a 240v timer to the utility side of my ats. the ats load runs to my ac in of my inverter and then ac out runs to panel. i just added a battery so i have about 18hrs of autonomy so the timer has been kinda useless seeing as how my solar (10x400w qcell panels in series) is enough to keep the system alive and recharge the batteries. The BMS on my inverter and batteries are functioning well. However with rainy season coming up it would b nice to completely automate the system so if we get no sun for multiple days the generator will just keep the system alive. I appreciate any information just keep in mind while ive been going to school for electric this is a bit outside my scope and would appreciate full explanations.

Generator & ATS Switch:

Powering your home, your business, your world.

website

www.generac.com

Manual:

Powering your home, your business, your world.

website

www.generac.com

Inverter:

10KW 48Vdc Hybird Inverter 110/240Vac Split Phase

10KW 110Vac and 240Vac Split Phase Hybrid Inverter Charger for 48V batteries ensures a stable and balanced power supply.

powmr.com

Inverter Manual:
User Manual of POW-SUNSMART 10K

Batteries:

CL48-150B

Nominal Voltage/Nominal Capacity: 51.2V/150Ah wall-mounted with 7.68Kwh energy

cloudnewenergy.com

Solar:

Q.PEAK DUO BLK ML-G10+ - Qcells North America

Introducing Q.PEAK DUO BLK ML-G10+: Setting the standard for solar excellence. Unleash maximum power and reliability with advanced technology.

us.qcells.com

Datasheet:

https://us.qcells.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/Qcells_Data_sheet_Q.PEAK_DUO_BLK_ML-G10_series_385-410_DA_2023-01_Rev03_NA.pdf

 

[Samsonite801]

I have an offgrid setup that has been running well enough but id like it to be fully automated. Ill include links to all of the components in my setup but basically im trying to figure out how to use my inverters dry contacts to auto start my generator. my current setup is generator to ats. breaker on my panel to a 240v timer to the utility side of my ats. the ats load runs to my ac in of my inverter and then ac out runs to panel. i just added a battery so i have about 18hrs of autonomy so the timer has been kinda useless seeing as how my solar (10x400w qcell panels in series) is enough to keep the system alive and recharge the batteries. The BMS on my inverter and batteries are functioning well. However with rainy season coming up it would b nice to completely automate the system so if we get no sun for multiple days the generator will just keep the system alive. I appreciate any information just keep in mind while ive been going to school for electric this is a bit outside my scope and would appreciate full explanations.

Generator & ATS Switch:

Powering your home, your business, your world.

website

www.generac.com

Manual:

Powering your home, your business, your world.

website

www.generac.com

Inverter:

10KW 48Vdc Hybird Inverter 110/240Vac Split Phase

10KW 110Vac and 240Vac Split Phase Hybrid Inverter Charger for 48V batteries ensures a stable and balanced power supply.

powmr.com

Inverter Manual:
User Manual of POW-SUNSMART 10K

Batteries:

CL48-150B

Nominal Voltage/Nominal Capacity: 51.2V/150Ah wall-mounted with 7.68Kwh energy

cloudnewenergy.com

Solar:

Q.PEAK DUO BLK ML-G10+ - Qcells North America

Introducing Q.PEAK DUO BLK ML-G10+: Setting the standard for solar excellence. Unleash maximum power and reliability with advanced technology.

us.qcells.com

Datasheet:

https://us.qcells.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/Qcells_Data_sheet_Q.PEAK_DUO_BLK_ML-G10_series_385-410_DA_2023-01_Rev03_NA.pdf

You will need to figure out if your Generac has two wire start, or if you need to buy an optional generator start controller module.. Several brands available, but once wired into the generator, it allows start and stop based on simple closed contact and open contact control.

 

[Oldphile]

Here's the Generac 2 wire start instructions.

 

[KolinCancer]

Here's the Generac 2 wire start instructions.

how do i know which model of 2 wire start to get or are they all compatible

 

[pvgirl]

The pics of the 2 wire start kits seem to include the all the wires for the different models, and you just install the ones you need.

 

[KolinCancer]

Also when you look at the description on my dry contact it appears as though it should put off some voltage between 5 and or 6 and or 7 yet when i try to use my multimeter on it i dont get a reading

 

[KolinCancer]

Pins 5 and 7 put off .12 VAC/0VDC while battery is full and .7VAC/.3mVDC during disconnect and 5 and 6 put off nothing ever

 

[Samsonite801]

Also when you look at the description on my dry contact it appears as though it should put off some voltage between 5 and or 6 and or 7 yet when i try to use my multimeter on it i dont get a reading

The 'dry contact' means exactly that (in a vague sort of way), but it is just an on/off switch (passes continuity across the 2 terminals or not), it doesn't connect to anything inside the inverter. One contact goes in one terminal of the dry contact, and comes out the other, where the contact can open and close your input signal onto the output terminal. So essentially it just plugs (jumps) the two wires of your 2-wire start leads together, which starts the generator, and when the relay opens the dry contacts, it shuts off the generator.

 

[pvgirl]

Are sure you have the right pins, I don't see pins 5 and 7 mentioned anywhere in the manual posted? Which controller do you have?

 

[KolinCancer]

User Manual of POW-SUNSMART 10K
Pg 39
"Generator remote start/stop When the voltage of battery reaches the under-voltage alarm voltage (parameter14) or voltage point of utility switch to battery (parameter 04), pin 6 to pin 5 normal open, pin 7 to pin 5 normal close. When the voltage of battery reaches the voltage point of battery switch to utility (parameter05) or battery is full. pin 6 to pin 5 normal close, pin 7 to pin 5 normal open. (Pin 5/6/7 outputs 125Vac/1A, 230Vac/1A,30Vdc/1A) "

 

[KolinCancer]

The 'dry contact' means exactly that (in a vague sort of way), but it is just an on/off switch (passes continuity across the 2 terminals or not), it doesn't connect to anything inside the inverter. One contact goes in one terminal of the dry contact, and comes out the other, where the contact can open and close your input signal onto the output terminal. So essentially it just plugs (jumps) the two wires of your 2-wire start leads together, which starts the generator, and when the relay opens the dry contacts, it shuts off the generator.

thats what i have read however in my manual it says pin 1&3 output 5v and that works. and it also says pins 5/6/7 outputs 125vas/1a 230vac/1a, 30vdc/1a. am i just misinterpreting that

 

[Oldphile]

how do i know which model of 2 wire start to get or are they all compatible

When did you buy your Generac? 2013 and later have Evolution controller.

 

[KolinCancer]

When did you buy your Generac? 2013 and later have Evolution controller.

ya i have the newest model. i found the kit i need however im wondering what pins i need to connect it to on my inverter. it says
"Generator Remote Start/Stop
When the voltage of battery reaches the under-voltage alarm voltage (parameter14) or voltage point of utility switch to battery (parameter 04), pin 6 to pin 5 normal open, pin 7 to pin 5 normal close.
When the voltage of battery reaches the voltage point of battery switch to utility (parameter05) or battery is full. pin 6 to pin 5 normal close, pin 7 to pin 5 normal open. (Pin 5/6/7 outputs 125Vac/1A, 230Vac/1A,30Vdc/1A) "

 

[pvgirl]

User Manual of POW-SUNSMART 10K
Pg 39
"Generator remote start/stop When the voltage of battery reaches the under-voltage alarm voltage (parameter14) or voltage point of utility switch to battery (parameter 04), pin 6 to pin 5 normal open, pin 7 to pin 5 normal close. When the voltage of battery reaches the voltage point of battery switch to utility (parameter05) or battery is full. pin 6 to pin 5 normal close, pin 7 to pin 5 normal open. (Pin 5/6/7 outputs 125Vac/1A, 230Vac/1A,30Vdc/1A) "

Those pins are what are called dry contacts they don't output voltage, they act as switches for external sources of power. Depending on the setting of the parameters in the inverter, when the configured condition is met the pins will be connected together "closed", or no longer be connected together "opened". The voltages and currents specified are maximum the inverter can switch, any power would be supplied by the equipment connected to the inverter, such as a generator. To check the outputs of the inverter you will want to use the resistance or continuity setting on your multimeter to verify which pins are connected together under different conditions.

 

[Oldphile]

ya i have the newest model. i found the kit i need however im wondering what pins i need to connect it to on my inverter. it says
"Generator Remote Start/Stop
When the voltage of battery reaches the under-voltage alarm voltage (parameter14) or voltage point of utility switch to battery (parameter 04), pin 6 to pin 5 normal open, pin 7 to pin 5 normal close.
When the voltage of battery reaches the voltage point of battery switch to utility (parameter05) or battery is full. pin 6 to pin 5 normal close, pin 7 to pin 5 normal open. (Pin 5/6/7 outputs 125Vac/1A, 230Vac/1A,30Vdc/1A) "

From your description you would use pins 5 and 7, closed to start the generator, open to stop the generator.

 

[KolinCancer]

From your description you would use pins 5 and 7, closed to start the generator, open to stop the generator.

And does it matter which dry contact (5 or 7) i connect to which 2 wire start/stop wire? I couldnt imagine so but figured i should make sure

 

[Oldphile]

And does it matter which dry contact (5 or 7) i connect to which 2 wire start/stop wire? I couldnt imagine so but figured i should make sure

It doesn't matter. A dry contact is just a switch.

 

[KolinCancer]

It doesn't matter. A dry contact is just a switch.

And last question. How should i wire up the ats or should i even use one. Should it be generator to ats generator input pigtailed to ac in on the inverter (to charge batteries). Inverter ac out to utility on the ats and then panel to load on the ats? Im concerned that that might make the generator trip back and forth while the batteries are undervoltage. My current config is in the op

 

[Samsonite801]

And last question. How should i wire up the ats or should i even use one. Should it be generator to ats generator input pigtailed to ac in on the inverter (to charge batteries). Inverter ac out to utility on the ats and then panel to load on the ats? Im concerned that that might make the generator trip back and forth while the batteries are undervoltage. My current config is in the op

Would you be able to draw a picture or make a diagram showing the above description so we could wrap head around the proposed ATS wiring?

 

[Samsonite801]

It doesn't matter. A dry contact is just a switch.

Yes, and if he opted to, he could also use an ohmmeter across the terminals to confirm for sure which terminals are the dry contacts, and put the inverter into both open and closed states to see the change on the ohmmeter from infinite (open) to continuity (closed) states...

EDIT:
Nevermind, I later found the page showing the terminals in the manual, Pins 5,6,7, can see it in a later post on Page 2...