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Dead short fuse trip experiment using an MRBF fuse

Johan

Off-grid energy systems enthusiast.
Joined
Oct 2, 2019
Messages
81
Location
Sacramento, CA, USA
Introduction
Marine Rated Battery Fuses (MRBFs) are sometimes used to replace Class T fuses due to supply chain issues, ease of installation, space constraints, and cost. However, the breaking capacity of MRBF fuses is significanly lower than that of Class T fuses as shown in Figure 1.

fuse VS breaker.png
Figure 1. Ampere Interrupting Capacity vs DC Voltage Rating

Problem
How will an MRBF fuse behave when subjected to a dead short outside of the fuse specifications?

Background
If the fuse does not quench the arc, then hot plasma could theoretically turn the fuse into a near-perfect conductor and cause a fire, instead of a near-perfect isolator that prevents fire.

In a previous experiment, an MRBF fuse was blown using an LFP battery, and a relatively small diameter wire was used, resulting in a relatively large circuit resistance, so it may not be a conservative representation of many battery installations.

Goal
The goal is to create a practical, realistic, and relatively safe near-worst-case dead short experimental setup using a relatively large capacity (Ah) battery together with large-diameter and short-length conductors that can be used to observe how MRBF fuses behave when a dead short occurs.

Experimental setup
See Figure 2 for the experimental setup.

experimental setup photo.jpg
Figure 2. Experimental setup.

Parts used:
  • MRBF fuse block and MRBF fuse rated 150A (random rating choice).
  • Battery: 4 x brand new Victron Smart Lithium 330Ah 12V LFP in series, 48Vnom; never charged or discharged; NO internal BMS; Battery voltage = 52.7V = 3.29Vpc (SoC unknown).
  • Battery interconnects ("busbars"/ battery cables): 4/0 AWG UL-listed pure copper. Total cable length ~20" (500mm).
  • Tinned copper lugs, hammer crimped on solid concrete substrate (one sample cut in half after crimping to verify quality which was good). Lugs degreased before mounting, torqued to spec.
  • Dead short initiation device: 250A snowmobile winch relay (solenoid, approx 5Ω), triggered remotely with power supply set at 14Vdc.
Some of the safety aspects for this experiment:
  • Backup circuit breaking methods in the order of prioritized use:
    1. Use extension pole tree branch cutter. This cutter was verified to cut like a knife through butter through copper cables. Once cut, the weight of the relay (black box with black tape in Figure 2) will pull down one cut end to create a gap large enough to quench the arc. Locally remove cable insulation to reduce cutting resistance.
    2. In case method (1) fails: Use a stand-by impact drill set to CCW rotation with socket wrench attached to disconnect interconnect bolt.
    3. In case methods (1) and (2) fail: Use manual cable cutter.
  • Safety goggles; gloves; fire protective clothing.
  • Fire extinguisher nearby especially for extinguishing burning insulation after breaking circuit.
  • Second person with phone to call for help.
Theory
The initial calculated (estimated) theoretical dead short current is approx 14,000A (14kA). This is wel outside the MRBF specs as shown in Figure 1. The instantaneous theoretical dead short power is in the order of 700,000W (700kW), which roughly matches the maximum power of a Tesla Model S Plaid 😨. Should we really do this? Just kidding - Curiosity wins :p.

Results
  • The fuse successfully quenched the arc in the order of one video frame rate interval, in this case 30fps, so 1/30 = 0.033s. See also Figures 3 and 4.
  • The fuse polycarbonate (assumption; probably not acrylic) housing back wall blew out and landed ~10 ft away. See also Figure 5.
  • Sparks of molten copper blew out and landed 1-3ft away.
  • The relay welded closed (this was expected) and had to be taken apart to break the contact points loose as shown in Figure 6.
small02.png
Figure 3. This is what the fuse blowing looks like in close-up (most dramatic video frame).

animation50.gif
Figure 4. Fuse blowing process.

PXL_20240316_190219524.jpg
Figure 5. The MRBF fuse after blowing. The separation occurred at the plastic weld / glue seam.

PXL_20240316_011822879 small.jpg
Figure 6 - Welded relay. Only the right two studs were used.

Conclusions
When operating outside of the MRBF specs, conservatively expect at least the housing to fail and molten copper and plastic debris to fly around. This experiment is anecdotal only and needs to be repeated many times to show repeatability.

Recommendations
  • Repeat this experiment to evaluate repeatability.
  • Vary the fuse current rating: A 300A MRBF fuse could yield different results.
  • vary the battery SoC.
  • Etc.
Ideas and criticism, preferably constructive with references when making claims, are welcome.
 
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Cool!
Oscilloscope measurement for the current and clearing time would be really nice.

Would be also interesting to see how the cheap Classs T alternatives like bs88 and NH fuses would measure
 
Given how Victron uses the MEGA fuses in their diagrams instead of Class T, it would indeed be of interest to see how they fare compared to what you've shown with the MRBF.
Most of those diagrams have been around when FLA is king, but I’d love to see mega fuses tested similar fashion.
 
Thanks for taking the time to test. I wonder if one could fabricate/3d print a shield to keep the guts of the fuse contained upon failure in these extreme conditions. Also I'm drooling over those blue batteries lol thank jebus they weren't harmed in this experiment.
 
Very interesting. Thank you for doing this testing and sharing!!


Battery: 4 x brand new Victron Smart Lithium 330Ah 12V LFP in series, 48Vnom; never charged or discharged; NO internal BMS; Battery voltage = 52.7V = 3.29Vpc (SoC unknown).

No internal BMS? I can't say for sure but I do believe that nearly every LFP battery shipped today will have a BMS. This may be something unique to Victron but I am certainly not familiar with the batteries you mentioned.

It has been mentioned before, perhaps even tested, that a BMS will go into an error mode and shut the battery off before a fuse can act. The results of putting a "typical" LFP server rack battery through this same test would be quite interesting to me.
 
Very interesting. Thank you for doing this testing and sharing!!




No internal BMS? I can't say for sure but I do believe that nearly every LFP battery shipped today will have a BMS. This may be something unique to Victron but I am certainly not familiar with the batteries you mentioned.

It has been mentioned before, perhaps even tested, that a BMS will go into an error mode and shut the battery off before a fuse can act. The results of putting a "typical" LFP server rack battery through this same test would be quite interesting to me.
The Victron batteries use an external BMS (just balancing), and then there's a 500A or 1000A contactor for shutoff in the lynx bms.

 
The Victron batteries use an external BMS (just balancing), and then there's a 500A or 1000A contactor for shutoff in the lynx bms.

Thanks. After a few minutes of researching that's what I was starting to gather but I felt a "blue" brain tumor growing in my head so I stopped in hopes to live to fight another day. (I've got plenty of Victron gear but this is a PERFECT example of something they do that leads to great and needless confusion)

I was trying to point out that a battery without a BMS is not the common approach for most on this DIY forum and perhaps the rest of the LFP battery world.
 
Given how Victron uses the MEGA fuses in their diagrams instead of Class T, it would indeed be of interest to see how they fare compared to what you've shown with the MRBF.
Interesting to note Victron will be offering a class T option.. so indeed would be interesting to see how a MEGA fuse would fail with same test.

And has been correctly stated this is only a single test. Having hot debris thrown out isn't a great failure mode to begin with and would be a concern by itself.
 
In my second battery bank, I used CNL-100 amp fuses to connect the 2 banks to the common output. The CNL fuse is intended for DC fork lift battery protection and are rated to 80 volts DC. It would be interesting to see how they fare in a dead short test like that. The blown open gap looks about twice as long as the MRBF fuses.
 
I don't mind the cost of the Class T fuses, but the mounting requirements are annoying. The idea of a stud mounted fuse that can hold a cable lug is attractive.
Mounting NH fuses is even worse.
 
The weak point is clearly the primary switch. Reference: Youtube, video ywaTX-nLm6Y at 1:48, "100 Car Batteries Wired in Parallel".
I wonder if winding a longer conductor into a coil would grant more of a "soft start" to the high current flow. Allowing for a less-exciting test, but your electrical contact might be more resistant to welding itself closed.

Maybe we need a corporate sponsor for the next test?? https://www.te.com/usa-en/products/relays-and-contactors/contactors.html

Personally, I would be interested to see a test with two fuses in-line. One coming out of the battery array on (-) side and one going into the battery array on (+) side. If rated asymmetrically, would the larger fuse always remain intact, or would they both blow? That would give a little information about the quickness of the current interrupt, and whether that's sufficient to protect 100% of the other equipment in the circuit.
 
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Cheap Amazon din breakers, or even the “breakers” sourced on rack mount batteries is another great test.
 
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