Power of lightning

[BarracudaBob]

Question: my power shed will have six points where rebar enters the ground in sets of 4 and also 1or2 points where a stainless flow and return enters the ground, I realize these have a higher resistance than a ground rod but they will be bonded to the earthing system essentially making them supplemental rods how far should I place my main earth rod from them?

Add a ground rod by the service entrance, Bond everything together, make sure that the shed and home are also bonded together. Short answer.

Wrong answer: Don't bond everything together & don't bond to the main utility source.

Here is the Bible for Tower Site Grounding.pdf

Overkill for most but a good read.

 

[JRH]

Add a ground rod by the service entrance, Bond everything together, make sure that the shed and home are also bonded together. Short answer.

Wrong answer: Don't bond everything together & don't bond to the main utility source.

Here is the Bible for Tower Site Grounding.pdf

Overkill for most but a good read.

Yes , that’s some good stuff to read.. unfortunately the fact I think it’s interesting is probably why I’m not the go to guy at a party for fun chit chat….

Yep….yep….

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I love it when folks use their anecdotal sample evidence of N=1 to argue with folks that have significant education and experience who might even be considered subject matter experts. It gets REALLY exciting when Mr. Anecdotal takes the position of "what evidence do you have?"

 

[BarracudaBob]

You want to help people but you can't change someone's "believe system" no matter what facts you have.
I know old ham radio operators that never got hit by lighting for over 40 years. They stick their coax in a apple cider gallon jar. That is all everybody else needs to know.

Then there is the poor guy that gets into the hobby and gets $10K of equipment blown off the table in the first year. One interesting non-fact is that lightning DOES like to hit in the same place and others get ignored. Like playing Russian roulette. I was never good at gambling so I'll stick with tested proven methods.

Preaching grounding is a very unpopular endeavor.

 

[BarracudaBob]

Nobody Liked my Thor lighting recharging pic so I'll take it down... I guess you had to be there.

 

[Brett V]

Here is the Bible for Tower Site Grounding.pdf

Overkill for most but a good read.

As an L3Harris guy, I cannot read that!

 

[BarracudaBob]

As an L3Harris guy, I cannot read that!

come on even a Master V or a Symphony Console requires grounding. I would ground the RPM2 software if i could

 

[Brett V]

come on even a Master V or a Symphony Console requires grounding. I would ground the RPM2 software if i could

If you look closely at my battery rack, you may spot the OpenSky label on the breaker panel.

 

[CVCPJared]

I love it when folks use their anecdotal sample evidence of N=1 to argue with folks that have significant education and experience who might even be considered subject matter experts. It gets REALLY exciting when Mr. Anecdotal takes the position of "what evidence do you have?"

I've never drowned, i dont beleive in it. I've swam plenty of times, and I drink lots of water, every day. I even have a pool so I'm pretty much an expert on the subject. If you disagree, prove it. I will only accept personal experience from those who have drowned and were not revived as actual evidence. Anyone else is basically spewing nonsense, like all those round-earthers

Ok. Done -ing

 

[JRH]

On the things I totally know about , unless I meet a true newbie/groupie on the subject , I don’t even try anymore… few will put in the work to try and really learn…and I don’t have the energy to argue about it anymore….

 

[BarracudaBob]

come on even a Master V or a Symphony Console requires grounding. I would ground the RPM2 software if i could

Ok, we have gone off topic just a litt

If you look closely at my battery rack, you may spot the OpenSky label on the breaker panel.

Amazing how that stuff gets recycled I am using an old DC plant bullet breaker panel. Saving the earth by recycling
Old radio men (and women) are obsessed with bonding/grounding.. Beyond any solar person could ever understand.

 

[JRH]

Since this is a thread about the power of lightning I will submit….
I may have the location wrong but I think it was in eastern NC in recent days or so… from a news channel online…

A older man and his 93 yr old mother ( I think she was in a wheel chair , maybe ?? ) were in their house .. he was standing with his hand on the refridge in the kitchen talking to here..lightning struck the roof…it ran inside somehow and knocked him airborne and backwards across the kitchen …
In the end he got up and drug his mom out side and the 2hole house burned down…pi’s were posted ..pretty damn good fire to..

They both safe in the end….

I think you can prepare and design stuff all you want … but in the end lightning is Gona do what the hell it wants to do…

I Don’t like lightning…

 

[BarracudaBob]

Lightning and Tropical storm are a pain in my ass especially living in Florida. There are things that can be done but it is a cost/benefit choice we each have to make. One way to look at it is what is the probability of getting hit where you are. Your elevation. What is around you to take the hit instead of you. Don't forget about it coming in from the utility looking for a place to go either.

Here is a USA Map of Lighting strikes


The average number of cloud-to-ground lightning strike points per flash across the United States between 2017 and 2022.
Vagasky, et al, 2024

 

[JRH]

Lightning and Tropical storm are a pain in my ass especially living in Florida. There are things that can be done but it is a cost/benefit choice we each have to make. One way to look at it is what is the probability of getting hit where you are. Your elevation. What is around you to take the hit instead of you. Don't forget about it coming in from the utility looking for a place to go either.

Here is a USA Map of Lighting strikes

View attachment 233503
The average number of cloud-to-ground lightning strike points per flash across the United States between 2017 and 2022.
Vagasky, et al, 2024

I spent the summer of 83 in gulf shores/ orange beach Alabama working for a resort complex …my condo was was one block from the beach..
I have never seen such awful lightning , almost everyday , hitting everything everyday in my life..
I left in sept of that year…went back to a normal place ….like SC…
That’s some crazy lightning down there on the panhandle..

 

[Brett V]

I was at a site once with several towers, the tallest was a 250’ freestanding job with a static dissipation ring on top and a series of what looked like big wire brushes on the legs. A storm was approaching and suddenly there was what I can only describe as a loud hissing sound followed by what looked like a ball of pink colored plasma slowly drop down one of the tower legs. It vanished about half way down. I’ve seen a few lightning strikes close up but nothing weirded me out like this.

 

[JRH]

I was at a site once with several towers, the tallest was a 250’ freestanding job with a static dissipation ring on top and a series of what looked like big wire brushes on the legs. A storm was approaching and suddenly there was what I can only describe as a loud hissing sound followed by what looked like a ball of pink colored plasma slowly drop down one of the tower legs. It vanished about half way down. I’ve seen a few lightning strikes close up but nothing weirded me out like this.

Ball lightning …??..I don’t know ….I have seen pics of it come inside a structure and do weird stuff bouncing around…again I don’t know… could be a Romulan probe ..they are a crafty bunch.

 

[Dacflyer]

In my OPINION, this is why you want to have NOTHING connected to ground at all, whatsoever. However, this may be only possible for someone who has an entirely off-grid system.

I've shared my experience before in another thread, but suffice to say, I was bitten by having installed a very good ground rod--and the only damaged equipment in the house happened to be the only equipment plugged into that grounded plug I had made. Nothing else was grounded, and nothing else was damaged. For perspective, this happened to me in Laos, where virtually nothing is ever grounded. Perhaps I learned the reason why.

If you are going to ground something, ground the lightning rod, and make sure that the lightning rod is more attractive to lightning than anything else in your system. If you ground anything else, then, as @pollenface implies, perhaps you better ground EVERYTHING--and hope for the best. I have yet to experience any issues from NOT grounding, so long as nothing is grounded that is connected to my off-grid system--and this accounts for years of experience, weathering electrical storms during the monsoon season.

DISCLAIMER: I am not an electrician, and am not qualified to give advice on this subject: I present only my experience-educated opinion.

I kinda agree,, years ago when I was into CB Radio, i wanted to be sure I could get a far signal.. I finally saved up to get a nice antenna (Antron99) l fiberglass.. I was told by many that i should ground my antenna, and if also improve my reception. We'll dumb as i was.. I had my antenna way up in a pine tree, (yes redneck style)
I had a 30ft ground rod in the ground, 1st one disappeared into the ground, swallowed up.. I guess it was too deep and into the well water.. 2nd one i made sure to hold onto with a cross bar,, All way working great, until the 1st storm came by,, i was smart at least, i had my radio disconnected and the cable hung out the window.. The antenna was struck right away.. KaBooommm..
Checked things out later on, the antenna was not to be found, only fiberglass all in the yard,,
Ok, i thought it was a fluke of nature, did it again, sure enough.... Destroyed.
So this time ( 3rd times a charm), new antenna, no ground... Antenna lasted 14yrs..
Trees grounding is fire safety, lightning rods will keep you house from burning down.. You might still get some damage, but no fire..
In Europe is mandatory all buildings be having lightning rods.. I don't understand why they are not used in America,, especially town houses abbey churches etc..
So many burn down from lightning strikes every year in my state..

 

[BarracudaBob]

I kinda agree,, years ago when I was into CB Radio, i wanted to be sure I could get a far signal.. I finally saved up to get a nice antenna (Antron99) l fiberglass.. I was told by many that i should ground my antenna, and if also improve my reception. We'll dumb as i was.. I had my antenna way up in a pine tree, (yes redneck style)
I had a 30ft ground rod in the ground, 1st one disappeared into the ground, swallowed up.. I guess it was too deep and into the well water.. 2nd one i made sure to hold onto with a cross bar,, All way working great, until the 1st storm came by,, i was smart at least, i had my radio disconnected and the cable hung out the window.. The antenna was struck right away.. KaBooommm..
Checked things out later on, the antenna was not to be found, only fiberglass all in the yard,,
Ok, i thought it was a fluke of nature, did it again, sure enough.... Destroyed.
So this time ( 3rd times a charm), new antenna, no ground... Antenna lasted 14yrs..
Trees grounding is fire safety, lightning rods will keep you house from burning down.. You might still get some damage, but no fire..
In Europe is mandatory all buildings be having lightning rods.. I don't understand why they are not used in America,, especially town houses abbey churches etc..
So many burn down from lightning strikes every year in my state..

Especially when Ben Franklin invented them in the USA.

Nasa uses them:

 

[Norwasian]

When working with electricity, there are times when the technician will ground his or her wrists to prevent any static from damaging the electronic components. There are times when the electrician will wear thick rubber boots and make sure to NOT be grounded, to prevent electrocution.

This is not rocket science, folks--it's common sense. There are two ways to protect from harmful electricity: grounding and isolation. It is up to each use case to determine which method is preferred.

In my case, isolation has proved best to protect my equipment from lightning. Grounded, the UPS was damaged in the very first storm. Ungrounded, and in that same location--i.e. everything else was the same--I went through scores of storms over about four years of time, with nary a glitch.

In my case, I did not have any high antenna, nor anything on the roof. Isolation was a reasonable option. Those with high antennas or tall steel structures may not consider it a reasonable option, as they are too exposed.