Signature Solar run around?

[400bird]

It basically lives at 26.5v (charging or discharging) has been my point the entire time. Unless I discharge it below ~20%

The voltage curve of lifepo4 is basically flat at 3.3 volts from something like 30-80%
Normally you'll see a small change from something like 3.3 to 3.32, but it isn't anywhere near linear.

Not disconnecting, as far as I can tell. When I have it on the regular battery charger, I'll leave it plugged in for 48-72 hours with no change in voltage.

What's the amperage from this charger?
What voltage is this charger set to?
Is it CC/CV? Is it a lead acid charger?

With the SCC, you know, it changes wit cloud cover. Still, sometimes it goes up to 28A max.... Sometimes I see it charge up to 28v, but as soon as I turn the SCC off, no matter what, it settles at 26.5v shortly thereafter.

At 20 amps, it would take 10 solid hours of charging.

I don't think the problem is charging. The problem is some sort of goofy regulation setting in the BMS itself. I've been through allllllllll this in my head. I'm quite certain it's a 5 minute fix in some setting on the BMS.

Listen, there is no regulation happening in the BMS. It's on it off!

Sure the BMS measures cell voltage and calculates SOC, but it's not able to do anything to the current but stop it. It can't to anything to voltage but open and make it stop.

 

[Max Q]

The voltage curve of lifepo4 is basically flat at 3.3 volts from something like 30-80%
Normally you'll see a small change from something like 3.3 to 3.32, but it isn't anywhere near linear.

What's the amperage from this charger?
What voltage is this charger set to?
Is it CC/CV? Is it a lead acid charger?

At 20 amps, it would take 10 solid hours of charging.

Listen, there is no regulation happening in the BMS. It's on it off!

Sure the BMS measures cell voltage and calculates SOC, but it's not able to do anything to the current but stop it. It can't to anything to voltage but open and make it stop.

Right, I've been down all these roads. None of it makes sense from all the data I have, none of it. I've changed every setting several times, I've cycled, I've charged other batteries perfectly fine on the same equipment with the same settings. It's the batteries/BMS. I guess I just wait and run around some more, because the SS troops don't seem interested in offering any actual solutions, just more canned responses and stalling.
My handle is my van.... I'm hauling 2 Wookies on a trip to Endore. Why would I be hauling 2 Wookies to a planet of 2' tall Ewoks? None of this makes any sense.

 

[400bird]

So, you're done answering questions and not listening to input?

If your "regular battery charger" is 5 amps that could take 40+ hours if you had the settings correct. If the charger can't reach 28-29 volts it will never finish.

The BMS and battery could be crap. But it don't see evidence of that yet. I am sensing the frustration of tech support.

 

[Koldsimer]

The only thing that I am aware of is the BMS terminating charge due to individual cells going over voltage from a imbalance in cell level state of charge. This can be worked out some of the time by a number of cycles. This sounds like what they are trying to get you to do.

I'd guess that's the case.

@Max Q When you were in the bms with pc, were there any alarms in the history? Were you able to look at individual cell voltages and if so, were any higher than 3.65?

 

[Max Q]

I'd guess that's the case.

@Max Q When you were in the bms with pc, were there any alarms in the history? Were you able to look at individual cell voltages and if so, were any higher than 3.65?

It's not. At least that's not what the monitoring software shows when I watch it while it's charging. No alarms in history. No history at all, actually. You guys keep trying to make sense of things, I'm telling you it doesn't.

 

[Max Q]

So, you're done answering questions and not listening to input?

If your "regular battery charger" is 5 amps that could take 40+ hours if you had the settings correct. If the charger can't reach 28-29 volts it will never finish.

The BMS and battery could be crap. But it don't see evidence of that yet. I am sensing the frustration of tech support.

I'm not done. None of you are suggesting anything new that I haven't thought of or tried. The charger is 12A. As I stated earlier, there have been instances where I've left it plugged in for 48-72 hours with no change. Something with this battery is F'd up. I believe it's the BMS. All signs point to it being set up as a 48v battery. Tech support is frustrated because they're not trained, because they're all new. As I stated earlier, I've received more questions from you guys in the first hour of this post than in the past 2 months of dealing with them.

 

[Max Q]

I'll be heading back to my parent's to take another crack at this. It's the only place I have access to PC and power to plug up to. Will post pics for you guys tomorrow.

 

[Koldsimer]

If the bms was set up as a 48v battery, i think you would be able to charge to 56v+.

I get your frustration with the customer service at Signature. You're right, most of them are new and not well trained. It's just a crapshoot of who you get and how knowledgeable they are. Maybe one of their "reps" will see this thread and offer more insight. Hopefully, you get the carrot and not the stick.

Best of luck. I bet some of the good people on this forum will get you steered in the right direction eventually.

 

[MrThisIsME]

You're right, most of them are new and not well trained.

I have found if they start calling you "bro" on the phone, you found one of them. Very unprofessional to boot.

 

[RV10flyer]

I have found if they start calling you "bro" on the phone, you found one of them. Very unprofessional to boot.

I get your frustration with the customer service at Signature. You're right, most of them are new and not well trained. It's just a crapshoot of who you get and how knowledgeable they are. Maybe one of their "reps" will see this thread and offer more insight. Hopefully, you get the carrot and not the stick.

That is the understatement of the year.

Edit 8/23/22: Richard and Ben on here resolved my issue in a timely manner. Thank you so much!

 

[Max Q]

If the bms was set up as a 48v battery, i think you would be able to charge to 56v+.

Well, if the BMS is set to 48v but the battery is hardwired for 24v.... the issues I'm having would start to make sense, but just barely. Still more sense than anything else I've tried. This is why the capacity was initially set to 100Ah instead of 200Ah, as it should have been. But what other settings are there that could have been changed is the question. We'll see tomorrow.
Actually, found a pic of the protection parameters. Does this look like it's set up as a 48v or a 24v battery?

 

[Koldsimer]

You are right. That bms is definitely set up with 48v parameters. Sig should be able to recognize and correct this pretty easily i would hope.

 

[Max Q]

You are right. That bms is definitely set up with 48v parameters. Sig should be able to recognize and correct this pretty easily i would hope.

you would think, but I've already sent them this pic. That's why I found it on my drive.

 

[Quattrohead]

Obvious answer to me is backup the settings from your "good" battery and restore them to the "bad" battery.
If there is no backup/restore then just copy the settings. Yes the bad battery got a BMS setup for 48v

Typical for zero QA and load em high and sell em cheap.

 

[acdoctor]

You are right. That bms is definitely set up with 48v parameters. Sig should be able to recognize and correct this pretty easily i would hope.

I don’t see how it could ever work. The sense leads don’t measure each cell they measure from their cell pos. to neg.. so even if they put a sense wire on each cell pos. You would have two per parallel cell group. But none would read above 28 volts to ground. Should see all kinds of faults. Surely they have two completely different boards for each voltage.
Clearly programmed wrong! I would demand a replacement or full refund. No restocking, no freight!
It’s not your job to diagnose and field repair factory mistakes.

 

[MrThisIsME]

Obvious answer to me is backup the settings from your "good" battery and restore them to the "bad" battery.
If there is no backup/restore then just copy the settings. Yes the bad battery got a BMS setup for 48v

I would tend to disagree. Something is wrong off the bat, who knows what else. Send it back.

 

[Max Q]

Obvious answer to me is backup the settings from your "good" battery and restore them to the "bad" battery.
If there is no backup/restore then just copy the settings. Yes the bad battery got a BMS setup for 48v

Typical for zero QA and load em high and sell em cheap.

They're both "bad" batteries. The other battery I referred to in this thread is the A123 systems battery I posted about in the past. It's just there for backup in case the SS craps out on me.

 

[MrThisIsME]

Clearly programmed wrong! I would demand a replacement or full refund. No restocking, no freight!
It’s not your job to diagnose and field repair factory mistakes.

I can hear SS now: Sorry, it took us three months to troubleshoot, unfortunately that puts you outside the refund window.

 

[Max Q]

I don’t see how it could ever work. The sense leads don’t measure each cell they measure from their cell pos. to neg.. so even if they put a sense wire on each cell pos. You would have two per parallel cell group. But none would read above 28 volts to ground. Should see all kinds of faults. Surely they have two completely different boards for each voltage.
Clearly programmed wrong! I would demand a replacement or full refund. No restocking, no freight!
It’s not your job to diagnose and field repair factory mistakes.

I agree. Signature Solar will not cooperate and will not hear my pleas. Meanwhile I'm supposed to keep a cool head when I'm absolutely livid. Else public perception ..."well, you were an a-hole, no wonder they won't talk with you!"

Can't win these days with everyone woke af.

 

[BenFromSignatureSolar]

I agree. Signature Solar will not cooperate and will not hear my pleas. Meanwhile I'm supposed to keep a cool head when I'm absolutely livid. Else public perception ..."well, you were an a-hole, no wonder they won't talk with you!"

Can't win these days with everyone woke af.

Hey Max, I apologize for you getting the runaround on this issue. Could you send me over your order number? I'll make sure we resolve this asap.