The vaccinated are more likely to catch Covid

[Shale MacGregor]

Then you state that an anti-inflammatory is stopping viral replication without links? Cool!
----------

Ivermectin: a systematic review from antiviral effects to COVID-19 complementary regimen​

Ivermectin proposes many potentials effects to treat a range of diseases, with its antimicrobial, antiviral, and anti-cancer properties as a wonder drug. It is highly effective against many microorganisms including some viruses. In this comprehensive systematic review, antiviral effects of ivermectin are summarized including in vitro and in vivo studies over the past 50 years. Several studies reported antiviral effects of ivermectin on RNA viruses such as Zika, dengue, yellow fever, West Nile, Hendra, Newcastle, Venezuelan equine encephalitis, chikungunya, Semliki Forest, Sindbis, Avian influenza A, Porcine Reproductive and Respiratory Syndrome, Human immunodeficiency virus type 1, and severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus

Ivermectin: a systematic review from antiviral effects to COVID-19 complementary regimen - PubMed

Ivermectin proposes many potentials effects to treat a range of diseases, with its antimicrobial, antiviral, and anti-cancer properties as a wonder drug. It is highly effective against many microorganisms including some viruses. In this comprehensive systematic review, antiviral effects of...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Did you even read this? They theorize that it might work against covid, and then link to a study that used it at concentrations in vitro WAAAAY higher than you would ever be able to tolerate.

The approved dose of ivermectin alone not useful in treating COVID-19

A new paper published on the preprint server medRxiv in April 2020 shows that the use of the already approved drug ivermectin in clinical trials to treat severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2)s not feasible. This contradicts earlier reports of its ability to suppress the...

www.news-medical.net

The in vitro study used ivermectin at a concentration that inhibits 50% of proliferating viruses (IC50). This concentration of 2 μM is 35 times higher than the maximum plasma concentration achieved in blood on oral administration of ivermectin at the approved dose of approximately 200 μg/kg. And this refers to the total plasma concentration.

Ivermectin is bound extensively by plasma protein, to the tune of 93%, which means that the maximum concentration of unbound ivermectin in the plasma is several orders of magnitude less.

So unless you are taking approximately grams of the stuff, it has no proven efficacy.

 

[Shale MacGregor]

If you are going to demand others provide links/cite sources (and I am all for citing credible sources), you should of course be citing (credible) sources when you yourself make claims, like the one above, anything less is a double standard.

There has been too much of this in this thread (people demanding high bars of evidence of those they disagree with, while providing little to none of their own, or at best a youtube video or something). <-- this is not directed at everyone in this thread, but I think its an area we could all do better (vetting and providing credible sources, protecting ourselves from being conduits of misinformation, not just posting everything that reflects our worldview/pre-conceived beliefs, and treating our own ideas as skeptically as those we disagree with).

You are correct and even if something is available online I should make an effort to link it.

 

[BMcL]

So unless you are taking approximately grams of the stuff, it has no proven efficacy.

If your mind isn't closed, there is tons of evidence supporting the use of ivermectin.
It's not a cure. It's an anti-viral that is almost 100% effective in helping people fight off covid and stay out of the hospital.
The dose is ~24 to 36 mg per day if you get covid and most people take it less than one week.

Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy of Ivermectin in the Prophylaxis and Treatment of COVID-19​

Kory, Pierre MD1,*; Meduri, Gianfranco Umberto MD2; Varon, Joseph MD3; Iglesias, Jose DO4; Marik, Paul E. MD5

Conclusions:​

Meta-analyses based on 18 randomized controlled treatment trials of ivermectin in COVID-19 have found large, statistically significant reductions in mortality, time to clinical recovery, and time to viral clearance. Furthermore, results from numerous controlled prophylaxis trials report significantly reduced risks of contracting COVID-19 with the regular use of ivermectin. Finally, the many examples of ivermectin distribution campaigns leading to rapid population-wide decreases in morbidity and mortality indicate that an oral agent effective in all phases of COVID-19 has been identified.

Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy... : American Journal of Therapeutics

ed within clinical trials. Areas of Uncertainty: The majority of trialed agents have failed to provide reproducible, definitive proof of efficacy in reducing the mortality of COVID-19 with the exception of corticosteroids in moderate to severe disease. Recently, evidence has emerged that the...

journals.lww.com

 

[BMcL]

What ivermectin does is prevent the virus from replicating until it causes pneumonia. Once pneumonia sets in, the real trouble starts.​

------
The 4 stages of Covid

Stage 1​

During COVID-19 Stage 1, Alabi says you could experience symptoms of fever, headaches, fatigue, loss of taste, loss of smell, or upper respiratory issues.

“Why some people do well and some people don’t, I don’t think I know,” said Alabi. “I don’t think anybody does.”

Stage 2​

When the virus progresses to COVID-19 Stage 2, you will likely be hospitalized with lower respiratory tract issues and pneumonia. In the past, Alabi says many who needed oxygen by this point would have been moved to the ICU, but not anymore.

“We do not have enough ICU beds for our COVID-19 patients,” he said. “So we have to find ways to be able to take care of sick people in a non-ICU bed.”

Stage 3​

In COVID-19 Stage 3, your chances of survival start to dwindle. You will be moved to the ICU while on high-flow oxygen. Alabi dreads the conversations he has to have with patients when they are going to be put into a medically induced coma, paralyzed, and on a ventilator.

“Deep inside you’re almost like crying, because you know that there’s a very high chance that that patient is not coming back.”

Stage 4​

If you survive long enough to progress to COVID-19 Stage 4, doctors will try to save your life with last-resort tools like ECMO, if available. But only a lucky few will be given the opportunity to be on those machines because they’re in such limited supply.

 

[Freep]

Ivermectin has been attacked with tons of money funding propaganda trying to scare people from using it.

Source?

I have a link to a pharmacy in India ; I have over 200 12mg pills at home in my fridge that would treat dozens of people.
It's cheap; $150 for 200 pills. And in India, ivermectin has wiped covid out. It's an amazing drug with zero side effects in normal use.

Where are the double blind studies? I've seen in-vitro studies that were promising but to get the same effect in in-vivo studies the dosage required would cause neurological damage.

I have seen a few studies that misrepresented their findings and they used those ivermectin results to get grants but still there are no double blind studies.

 

[time2roll]

Merck say no. That is enough for me.

 

[BMcL]

Merck say no. That is enough for me.

Merck created ivermectin and now it's stopping them from making billions of dollars. You sound like a wise person for believing them. LOL
My son is an internal medicine Dr who sometimes covers the critical care unit of his hospital.
At the beginning of this pandemic, he believed what he was being told. Now he sees how money has corrupted medicine.
We keep ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, doxycycline and zinc at home in the fridge.

 

[Freep]

If your mind isn't closed, there is tons of evidence supporting the use of ivermectin.
It's not a cure. It's an anti-viral that is almost 100% effective in helping people fight off covid and stay out of the hospital.
The dose is ~24 to 36 mg per day if you get covid and most people take it less than one week.

Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy of Ivermectin in the Prophylaxis and Treatment of COVID-19​

Kory, Pierre MD1,*; Meduri, Gianfranco Umberto MD2; Varon, Joseph MD3; Iglesias, Jose DO4; Marik, Paul E. MD5

Conclusions:​

Meta-analyses based on 18 randomized controlled treatment trials of ivermectin in COVID-19 have found large, statistically significant reductions in mortality, time to clinical recovery, and time to viral clearance. Furthermore, results from numerous controlled prophylaxis trials report significantly reduced risks of contracting COVID-19 with the regular use of ivermectin. Finally, the many examples of ivermectin distribution campaigns leading to rapid population-wide decreases in morbidity and mortality indicate that an oral agent effective in all phases of COVID-19 has been identified.

Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy... : American Journal of Therapeutics

ed within clinical trials. Areas of Uncertainty: The majority of trialed agents have failed to provide reproducible, definitive proof of efficacy in reducing the mortality of COVID-19 with the exception of corticosteroids in moderate to severe disease. Recently, evidence has emerged that the...

journals.lww.com

Funny how none of those studies are from developed nations.

 

[Freep]

What ivermectin does is prevent the virus from replicating until it causes pneumonia.

There is no conclusive evidence for this claim.

 

[BMcL]

There is no conclusive evidence for this claim.

And your source is Big Pharma telling you this ? Have you read the evidence ? Of course you haven't.

Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy... : American Journal of Therapeutics

ed within clinical trials. Areas of Uncertainty: The majority of trialed agents have failed to provide reproducible, definitive proof of efficacy in reducing the mortality of COVID-19 with the exception of corticosteroids in moderate to severe disease. Recently, evidence has emerged that the...

journals.lww.com

 

[BMcL]

Funny how none of those studies are from developed nations.

That's because Moderna, Pfizer and Merck are paying off politicians and media moguls.
There are billions of dollars at stake.

Did you know if there is a safe treatment available, the vaccines are no longer legal under the EUA ?
The "emergency use authorization" that allowed Pfizer and Moderna to rush to market untested mRNA vaccines
was under the condition that there were NO AVAILABLE SAFE TREATMENTS.

So they had to kill anything that worked in the fight against Covid. First hydroxychloroquine, then ivermectin.

 

[Bob B]

Merck say no. That is enough for me.

Not so fast .... doesn't Merk now have a pill to tread Covid that they can charge a LOT more money for?

Why would they want to be selling the old cheap one?

 

[eXodus]

many articles referred to Ivermectin as "horse de-wormer", when in fact it is a medication approved for human use, just not for this purpose. A few noted that it is available for humans and safe. Problem of course was people taking the veterinary variety ...

lol yeah, we have a farm and stocked up on Ivermectin when we saw that people where starting to take that.
It's sold out in all farmers store and prices have skyrocket.

The animal variety is much higher concentration then the human one. (Horses and Cows are much heavier then a human) don't try at home my friends.

But to get around to a point - Ivermectin is a really good treatment for all sort of animal disease. Sure against internal parasites. We also use it for many other infections and even apply it to the skin when it's not healing for one reason or another.

Animals have similar metabolic pathways to humans, so in a wider sense, I can see why people see the application for Covid, but still - lot's more double blind studies are needed..

Just food for the thought, animals with perfect diet and good living condition really never get serious sick. (lots of outside time)

 

[Shale MacGregor]

That's because Moderna, Pfizer and Merck are paying off politicians and media moguls.
There are billions of dollars at stake.

Did you know if there is a safe treatment available, the vaccines are no longer legal under the EUA ?
The "emergency use authorization" that allowed Pfizer and Moderna to rush to market untested mRNA vaccines
was under the condition that there were NO AVAILABLE SAFE TREATMENTS.

So they had to kill anything that worked in the fight against Covid. First hydroxychloroquine, then ivermectin.

Again, it requires a lot of people to be willing to leave a trail of dead bodies in exchange for money without a single person with evidence from stepping forward.

Did you really just try to claim that moderna and Pfizer we're untested before eua was granted ?

 

[tigerwillow1]

One data point: One of my doctor's patients was in the hospital with covid that was getting worse and worse. He and the family decided it was hopeless and he checked out of the hospital wanting to die at home. As a shot in the dark with no perceived downside, the doctor put him on invermectin and the patient was walking around feeling a lot better after a couple of days. Could be coincidence, but after one hears a similar story enough times, he starts to become a believer. First hand reports carry a lot more weight than news articles and social media posts.

If the previous statement "A total of 1,668 reports for ivermectin were identified. The most commonly reported adverse events for ivermectin were pruritus (25.3%), headache (13.9%), and dizziness (7.5%). Under the MedDRA SOC “Neurological disorders,” there were a total of 426 reports; 156 of these were classified as “serious” according to ICH Guidance." came from https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5929173/, I cannot find any statement in that report of how many doses were administered or what the rate of side effects was. Sorry if it has to be spoon-fed to me because of limited reading skills, but without that information I think using this to discuss ivermectin side effects is pretty useless.

 

[Shale MacGregor]

One data point: One of my doctor's patients was in the hospital with covid that was getting worse and worse. He and the family decided it was hopeless and he checked out of the hospital wanting to die at home. As a shot in the dark with no perceived downside, the doctor put him on invermectin and the patient was walking around feeling a lot better after a couple of days. Could be coincidence, but after one hears a similar story enough times, he starts to become a believer. First hand reports carry a lot more weight than news articles and social media posts.

If the previous statement "A total of 1,668 reports for ivermectin were identified. The most commonly reported adverse events for ivermectin were pruritus (25.3%), headache (13.9%), and dizziness (7.5%). Under the MedDRA SOC “Neurological disorders,” there were a total of 426 reports; 156 of these were classified as “serious” according to ICH Guidance." came from https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5929173/, I cannot find any statement in that report of how many doses were administered or what the rate of side effects was. Sorry if it has to be spoon-fed to me because of limited reading skills, but without that information I think using this to discuss ivermectin side effects is pretty useless.

Sorry but firsthand reports are somewhat useless. The doctor decided medicine was hopeless and told the patient to give up and die at home? Really? Then this drug which is supposedly only useful early in the infection miraculously healed him? Errrr, ok, sounds legitimate to me. Especially the part where you referred to a third hand at best report as firsthand.

 

[BMcL]

I can see why people see the application for Covid, but still - lot's more double blind studies are needed..

Dr Pierre Kory has addressed this over and over. We have more than enough proof that ivermectin works.
"Double Blind Studies" require that half the people get a placebo.
In a pandemic with people dying, how moral is it to give a placebo instead of the real deal when that person might die ?
People who insist on double blind studies haven't thought that through.

Shale : Did you really just try to claim that moderna and Pfizer we're untested before eua was granted ?

#1 : these "vaccines" don't qualify to be labeled vaccines. They only last a few months.
#2 : they were developed and "tested" in less than 1 year. We do not know the long-term effects of mRNA vaccines.

 

[time2roll]

Dr Pierre Kory has addressed this over and over. We have more than enough proof that ivermectin works.
"Double Blind Studies" require that half the people get a placebo.
In a pandemic with people dying, how moral is it to give a placebo instead of the real deal when that person might die ?
People who insist on double blind studies haven't thought that through.

Did not each of the vaccines go through this process in a pandemic? Need the ivermectiners to get on the warp speed program.

mrna has been studied since the 1960s. ivermectin has been around since the late 1970s.

 

[BMcL]

Did not each of the vaccines go through this process in a pandemic? Need the ivermectiners to get on the warp speed program.

mrna has been studied since the 1960s. ivermectin has been around since the late 1970s.

What "warp speed program" do you need for a generic drug that's been given a billion times with no known problems ?
mRNA vaccines are new and untested.

 

[time2roll]

What "warp speed program" do you need for a generic drug that's been given a billion times with no known problems ?
mRNA vaccines are new and untested.

I think the idea is to test for effectiveness. Not just side effects. What could go wrong?