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240V V2L from North American Ioniq 5

DC-DC Buck Converter Step Down Module, 30A 800W High Power Constant Voltage Module 12V24V36V48V Adjustable Buck Converter Step Down Voltage Regulator Module https://a.co/d/7ABQPd1

This input is too low. Perhaps a device like a solar charge controller could handle this given its high voltage input.

Anyone with experience?


I found this one.
 
DC-DC Buck Converter Step Down Module, 30A 800W High Power Constant Voltage Module 12V24V36V48V Adjustable Buck Converter Step Down Voltage Regulator Module https://a.co/d/7ABQPd1

This input is too low. Perhaps a device like a solar charge controller could handle this given its high voltage input.

Anyone with experience?
There are various posts out there about testing MPPT inputs on a lab bench with a DC power supply.

Conceptually you would connect the CCS connector to the DC input on a hybrid inverter along with a communications channel for SoC, rapid shutdown, etc.

I would not trust Amazon listings for the price of a power converter. Usually they outright lie, and they don't have to pass along the costs of any NRTL testing. Look at a TIGO or Hoymiles module for a floor on the cost of a UL listed DC-DC (voltage range of a single 72cell module) or DC-AC, power module, respectively.
 
It's at least a bench mark for what's happening in the world :).

If by that you mean, what kind of sane modules exist with the same form factor (but not power rating), sure.

If you use Amazon/eBay Chinesium to estimate the state of human technology, you'll over-estimate it by a factor of 3.
 
Oh, to charge the EV itself. Like, if you wanted to use your car to energy harvest from your solar array rather than exporting to grid. The idea is, to do that efficiently under current circumstances, the car will take a big bite out of your generation simply by being on. If you had a 1kW array, you basically couldn't use that to charge the EV, despite 1kW being a perfectly decent amount of solar capacity. You'd be much better off with a powerwall despite already owning a big battery.


Certainly a fair point. And in that comparison, the car's battery is the only true consumable, where the shore-side equipement, duplicated or not, will last quite a bit longer. But $2k for an EVSE is still a pretty high barrier to entry when you already own the car that can do the whole job itself, IF it can do the whole job itself. $2k is a standalone gas generator that can power your whole house as long as you have gas. Obviously that's not what I WANT, but if the goal is "power the house" it's hard not to compare the generator vs the car.


We're pretty deep into speculation here, but I agree with all your points. My baseline hypothesis is that Hyundai already designed-in 1) 400V out in anticipation of bidirectional CCS, 2) grid-forming (already has it) and grid-following (yet to be seen) capability in the ICCU to support V2G and V2H 3) the necessary PLC stuff for J1772-based V2L applications (vis-a-vis I think it's plug-and-charge ready and they just don't have the software integration sorted out yet). Of course, there's plenty of room for all of that hypothesis to be true, and still not come to pass in terms of delivered features, if the standards change enough by ratification that they can't software update their way to compatibility.

Yep.


Yeah, I think I've heard Denmark it's the norm, but otherwise I wasn't aware it's common in Finland and Germany too.
I’m just catching up on this old thread, so apologies in advance if I’m repeating something that’s already been said.

I’ve been considering using an Ioniq5 as an on-demand generator to boost a LiFePO4 battery with enough additional capacity to offset consumption during non-daylight hours.

For use as a generator, 120VAC is not an issue and 1800W is way more than needed (320W @ 10A of 640W @ 20A charging of my 24V LiiFePO4 House Battery.

But the 300W overhead when charging could be a deal-breaker.

At minimum charge current of 6A, that means only 1140W out of 1440W is making it to the charger, or 79%. The charger itself probably has efficiency below 95%, translating to no more than 75% charge efficiency at minimum current of 6A.

The V2L inverter likely has an efficiency of 90% or so and the 10A LiFePO charger I have also has efficiency of 90%.

So 288WDC into the House Battery requires 320WAC@120V which consumes 355WDC from the EV battery.

Assuming 355WDC out of the EV battery consumed 475W of 240VAC power when charging @ 6A translates to full-chain efficiency of 288WDC / 475WAC = 60.6%.

Exporting 1kWh during peak production hours when NEM 3.0 credits export at ~10% of Off-Peak Retail rates would still translate to over 0.5kWh of consumption that could be offset, so it’s still a better alternative than export, but that 20% loss of efficiency due to the 300W wasted when charging reduces the attraction by ~half.

Hopefully, future generations of the Ioniq5 and other EVs supporting V2X will reduce this unfortunate source of inefficiency.

While most EV owners go use on highest-power / fastest charging rates where 300W of overhead is inconsequential (3.1% when charging @ 9.6kW), charging from solar export or Solar Divert as some are calling it will require modest charge power when 300W of overhead will often represent unnacctotable inefficiency (if avoidable).
 
My setup is a Conext XW Pro with two EG4 Lifepower4 batteries 48v and a cheapo no-name LFP 25amp battery charger, all connected in parallel using a busbar. I can disable battery charging on the Conext and plug the V2L of my Kia EV6 into the battery charger. This way, the Conext drew power from both the EG4 LPs and the EV6 during a power outage two days ago. The display on the car's dashboard said 1.3Kw was being consumed while the charger can only do 48v*25a = 1200w.

I'm now checking if I can connect the V2L adapter directly to the Conext. Perhaps the generator 120v/240v split-phase can be wired for that as I believe the Conext can perform load balancing between different phases.
This is exactly the configuration I am considering (V2L as generator to recharge battery).

My application is Consumption Offset (don’t care about backup power).
 
On a slightly different topic, but there are some great thinking minds on this thread, so please help if you can.
I own a 2019 Nissan 40kw eNV-200, utility van, I live off grid with 42Kw of lithium installed. I want to add the car battery to my battery capacity to get over winter dull weeks. Will want to use the van as a ‘source’ only when I choose.
The eNV is going to be ‘range extended’, by adding another 40Kw of capacity by a ‘properly’ capable business. As part of the process the conversion offers me switchable access to the HV (~400v DC) that I would like to make use of.
My plan would be to use the battery input to run a PV grid connected inverter running in ‘island mode, aka ‘frequency shifting power throttling’, which would then output into my ac grid, and hopefully this would react in the same was as my three other SMA Sunny Boy inverters all controlled by a Sunny Island when the storage battery is full by upshifting the grid frequency.
My worry with my plan is that unlike the inverter being attached to solar as intended, and therefore the input current being limited by the installed PV array, that a high voltage battery might just be able to destroy the inverter with limitless current. Would anyone know if that would be the case? If so, is there a means by which I could say ‘limit’ the current leaving the battery to 20A for example.
 
a high voltage battery might just be able to destroy the inverter with limitless current. Would anyone know if that would be the case? If so, is there a means by which I could say ‘limit’ the current leaving the battery to 20A for example.
I know it work for my setup with Chevrolet Bolt 400V battery plug into PowMr inverter : https://diysolarforum.com/threads/360v-dc-input-split-phase-120v-240v-ac-inverter.15036/page-6
Battery can supply over 400A, but the inverter take only what it can (around 5A-6A).
Don't know for the SMA inverter though.
 
My worry with my plan is that unlike the inverter being attached to solar as intended, and therefore the input current being limited by the installed PV array, that a high voltage battery might just be able to destroy the inverter with limitless current. Would anyone know if that would be the case? If so, is there a means by which I could say ‘limit’ the current leaving the battery to 20A for example.
Maybe try a fuse, that would be needed anyway to protect your wiring
 
My plan would be to use the battery input to run a PV grid connected inverter running in ‘island mode, aka ‘frequency shifting power throttling’, which would then output into my ac grid, and hopefully this would react in the same was as my three other SMA Sunny Boy inverters all controlled by a Sunny Island when the storage battery is full by upshifting the grid frequency.
My worry with my plan is that unlike the inverter being attached to solar as intended, and therefore the input current being limited by the installed PV array, that a high voltage battery might just be able to destroy the inverter with limitless current. Would anyone know if that would be the case? If so, is there a means by which I could say ‘limit’ the current leaving the battery to 20A for example.

I'm thinking similar about Sunny Boy Storage, which is meant for battery application in that voltage range. (actually a lower voltage battery with boost converter.)
It expects a BMS, so might need a protocol converter.
Spec calls for 30A max available current. Don't know that it would intentionally draw too much, but better at least have a precharge circuit. Fast "semiconductor" fuse should help protect against damage.
It would reduce power output in response to frequency shift, but don't know if it could also store power before shift is high enough to curtail Sunny Boy outputs. It is marketed for time based and grid need storage and support.
 
This is exactly the configuration I am considering (V2L as generator to recharge battery).

My application is Consumption Offset (don’t care about backup power).
This is what I'm doing too -- going to use a Victron Multiplus-II 2 x 120V... which includes a 50A 240V transfer switch.

Going to use the transfer switch while on mains -- and then have a manual changeover switch that'll disconnect mains and provide AC input to the Victron via my Ioniq 5 -- mostly for backup -- but sometimes to offset usage too.

Beauty of these Victron units is they have a feature called "Power Assist" -- so you can combine the available power from your AC supply (1900W on my Ioniq) and the inverter to get about 4900W -- plenty for us in a power outage.

When AC usage slow -- it'll use that 1900W to charge a small lithium battery bank -- so my Ioniq 5 will basically charge my backup batteries in the house.

I like this system for a number of reasons... #1 it relies on the transfer switch and not the inverter while on mains, #2 it's a robust transfer/UPS switch so is good enough to backup my sump pumps, #3 takes both 240V and 120V as input -- so I don't have to worry about leg imbalance on my critical loads panel when on mains, #4 all of our critical loads are 120V (we have gas heat, which helps).

I was going to use a hybrid inverter -- but honestly -- I'd rather not rely on an inverter for my critical loads while on mains -- since that will be 99% of the time.
 
This is something I’m strongly considering too, except I’m also considering adding an autotransformer so the 1900+2400 (multiplus is 2400w active power) can be used by 240V circuits.

The autotransformer would also let me AC couple to 240V microinverters, however this would require the EV to be DC coupled into the system so that the Victron can do frequency shift.
 
Keep in mind that you can only use the 2x120 if you have no MWBC on that panel. Code requirement as well as safety thing with overloading neutral.

Also NEC does not want you to have 240 on that panel if you feed it as 120.
 
Keep in mind that you can only use the 2x120 if you have no MWBC on that panel. Code requirement as well as safety thing with overloading neutral.

Also NEC does not want you to have 240 on that panel if you feed it as 120.
Yeah -- I'm not a fan of MWBC in general -- everything in that panel will have its own neutral. We have a 100 year old house and I'm in the process of replacing every single inch of wire. Knob and tube isn't my jam!!

I just want the 240V infeed so that my split phase legs are more balanced -- but it probably isn't even necessary.

My other consideration was to buy 2x 120V multiplus (multipluses?) and set them up for split phase but feed them from the EV for battery backup.

The beauty of it is using the "current control assistant" -- so that you can set the AC current limit directly via the transfer switch (manual or otherwise) when you plug/select the EV source...

The blue stuff is overpriced IMO -- until it isn't -- and, frankly, there is a reason Victron stuff is expensive -- it's one of the few technology ecosystems where you can basically do anything if you're willing to figure out how!

And now with the inflation reduction act covering standalone battery systems at 30% tax credit -- uncle sam can help, too :)
 
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My other consideration was to buy 2x 120V multiplus (multipluses?) and set them up for split phase but feed them from the EV for battery backup.

OK. I have 90% MWBC on my 120V, so my solution approach is admittedly biased...

Which is why my preference is to go to a 120/240 approach initially with step-up autotransformer and later maybe to switch to stacked inverters for more battery capacity. There's also 240V circuits I may want to run, like turning on central heat pump in blower only mode to help circulate heat from my backup gas furnace through the whole house. My belief is that step-up autotransformer is safer than step-down in terms of failure modes (and can be done in a code compliant way).

One thing Multiplus does not have AFAIK is relay-based disconnect on AC coupled solar. I think Multiplus only has one relay controlling the grid OR generator connection (it's bidirectional obviously). While things like SolArk and Quattro have relay for grid connection and for generator connection (I think, at least Quattro has the extra port so it's possible for it to have that relay).
 
If I replace 120V V2L ICCU of my USA IONIQ5 to an ICCU for South Korea IONIQ5, will I get 240V V2L?
Thanks and Happy Father's Day
 
If I replace 120V V2L ICCU of my USA IONIQ5 to an ICCU for South Korea IONIQ5, will I get 240V V2L?
Thanks and Happy Father's Day
That would be interesting to see... Is there evidence or documentation that shows that hardware is different in vehicles in EU/Japan and US market? Is it only configuration? Maybe one day the dealer (or a cleaver guy with an ODBII dongle) can do something about it...

I have the exact same use case as the initial request, since my water and sewage pumps require about 3kW and 240V to run.

With the EU power available in NA, no need for a Quazar or dcbel for occasional outages. It would just fit perfectly like a gas generator...

Thanks!
 
This is what I'm doing too -- going to use a Victron Multiplus-II 2 x 120V... which includes a 50A 240V transfer switch.

Hey Winnie. Just wanted to pop in here and let you know the Multiplus works great with solar and with using the EV6 as a viable 120V source, provided the proper current limit is set.

HOWEVER, it does NOT work with the ESS assistant if you have that configured in your Multiplus system. The Multiplus is unstable and drops the input. I haven't confirmed the cause, but I believe it's due to the Loss of Mains (LOM) detection feature. There's a chance it would work with LOM disabled or on Type B, but I haven't gotten that far yet.

If you're not going to be using the ESS assistant (which is phenomenal for solar, BTW), then this comment is irrelevant to you, but just wanted to put that out there for ya.

Cheers
 
If I replace 120V V2L ICCU of my USA IONIQ5 to an ICCU for South Korea IONIQ5, will I get 240V V2L?
Thanks and Happy Father's Day

With the EU power available in NA, no need for a Quazar or dcbel for occasional outages. It would just fit perfectly like a gas generator...

Have you tried asking this question on IoniqForum?

HOWEVER, it does NOT work with the ESS assistant if you have that configured in your Multiplus system.
I don't think one should connect a V2L in a config where inverter thinks it is connected to grid. Since it is possible the inverter will attempt to export before it detects invalid grid.

Yes the Chargeverter config is something I have been interested in to guard against this. In my particular case I would combine it with microinverter AC coupling and that will definitely not be compatible with syncing in AC power from V2L
 
Hey Winnie. Just wanted to pop in here and let you know the Multiplus works great with solar and with using the EV6 as a viable 120V source, provided the proper current limit is set.
@drlanford,
Are you just connecting the V2L to the AC input on Multiplus and limiting to 15a
draw? Never thought about the power assist for larger loads until it was stated above.
 
@drlanford,
Are you just connecting the V2L to the AC input on Multiplus and limiting to 15a
draw? Never thought about the power assist for larger loads until it was stated above.
I just got this up and running yesterday. Was able to export about 32A at just under 52V. When I bumped the Chargeverter up to 34A, the car tripped off the output. At some point I’m going to try to parallel the two 120V outputs to see if I can get over 3k. I’ll likely test just loading the exterior V2L output with the Chargeverter and then load the interior V2L with another load to see if I can get a combined output over the rated 1800w. I’m not convinced those two outputs aren’t the same output.
 
At some point I’m going to try to parallel the two 120V outputs to see if I can get over 3k.
You can do this yourself but trustworthy folks on Ioniq5 forum say it's on the same 1800W inverter in the car, only (maybe) separately fused. Many people before you have smoked on this hopium
 
I just got this up and running yesterday. Was able to export about 32A at just under 52V. When I bumped the Chargeverter up to 34A, the car tripped off the output. At some point I’m going to try to parallel the two 120V outputs to see if I can get over 3k. I’ll likely test just loading the exterior V2L output with the Chargeverter and then load the interior V2L with another load to see if I can get a combined output over the rated 1800w. I’m not convinced those two outputs aren’t the same output.
So you didn’t use V2L to the AC Input of Victron, only V2L to chargeverter to batteries?
 
You can probably presume the V2L to work, if it is PSW. The ioniq forum folks with this EV have scopes, they might have measured it.

If the Victron rejects this AC you can fall back to DC coupling, it's not a huge difference in system cost or complexity, though a 10% efficiency drop. It's an emergency solution, interim even before better V2H so I personally temper my expectations.
 

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