Supreme Court to take on Vaccine Mandates.

[Hedges]

Vaccine mandates might have looked like a beneficial public health measure in the beginning, when effectiveness was so high.
At this point, it isn't even clear that vaccinating for last year's pandemic doesn't increase susceptibility to the current variant.

All this paper offers is hand-waving arguments saying that can't be so, it must be behavior differences.
The least we can expect is a proper analysis, matching vaccinated/unvaccinated participants and otherwise adjusting for "confounding" variable.
(But that offers the opportunity to engineer results.)

See graphs at end of the following paper.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.12.20.21267966v3.full.pdf

 

[BMcL]

referring to this gem..this is Batvette. He says he got caught up believing stuff on the internet LOL

View attachment 79592

How are you any different, Brad? You seem to be stalking Batvette by posting stuff he said years ago on different forums ?

 

[bradbill]

How are you any different, Brad? You seem to be stalking Batvette by posting stuff he said years ago on different forums ?

LOL....sorry...when you believe that people are following you with energy weapons, you deserve the scrutiny.

So, what other conspiracy theories do you believe in? Flat earth? Chemtrails?

 

[A.Justice]

LOL...and the dates on these?

Apparently you missed the part where we were discussing if this happened before or after FDA approval.

What was the approval date?

 

[Bob B]

Vaccine mandates might have looked like a beneficial public health measure in the beginning, when effectiveness was so high.
At this point, it isn't even clear that vaccinating for last year's pandemic doesn't increase susceptibility to the current variant.

All this paper offers is hand-waving arguments saying that can't be so, it must be behavior differences.
The least we can expect is a proper analysis, matching vaccinated/unvaccinated participants and otherwise adjusting for "confounding" variable.
(But that offers the opportunity to engineer results.)

See graphs at end of the following paper.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.12.20.21267966v3.full.pdf

WOW .... This study finds that the vaccine and booster fades QUICKLY with Omicron and a little slower with delta .... So, the solution is to have a "massive rollout of vaccines and boosters."

Since there is concern that repeated boosters could harm immune response .... That doesn't seem like the right way to be thinking about it.

Frequent Boosters Spur Warning on Immune Response

European Union regulators warned that frequent Covid-19 booster shots could adversely affect the immune response and may not be feasible.

www.bloomberg.com

 

[Johnson]

WOW .... This study finds that the vaccine and booster fades QUICKLY with Omicron and a little slower with delta .... So, the solution is to have a "massive rollout of vaccines and boosters."

Since there is concern that repeated boosters could harm immune response .... That doesn't seem like the right way to be thinking about it.

Frequent Boosters Spur Warning on Immune Response

European Union regulators warned that frequent Covid-19 booster shots could adversely affect the immune response and may not be feasible.

www.bloomberg.com

The solution is to make vaccines for the prevailing strains. I am not a virologist and obviously guessing. but that is what we do for the flu. If people don't take the vaccines hospitals could be overcrowded and politicians will have few choices mid they want to protect the public without additional heqlthcare funding.

 

[Bob B]

The solution is to make vaccines for the prevailing strains. I am not a virologist and obviously guessing. but that is what we do for the flu. If people don't take the vaccines hospitals could be overcrowded and politicians will have few choices mid they want to protect the public without additional heqlthcare funding.

I think that the variants are happening at such a fast pace that it is nearly impossible to keep up with them with vaccines. By the time you develop and test them ... the virus has moved on.

I think we need treatments that work regardless of what variant it is.

 

[Johnson]

I think that the variants are happening at such a fast pace that it is nearly impossible to keep up with them with vaccines. By the time you develop and test them ... the virus has moved on.

I think we need treatments that work regardless of what variant it is.

It takes 2 weeks to make the vaccine and years to tests them, unless you speed up that process like we did with the COVID vaccines.

I agree that treatment is also a valid (additional) option.

 

[Hedges]

It has been suggested that vaccination every 2 months is harmful, that once each fall might be better.
Some studies (if only in vitro) indicating vaccination causes suppression of some immune functions. Field data appears to show the same for Omicron, but not conclusive yet (not a well controlled study.)

 

[Johnson]

It has been suggested that vaccination every 2 months is harmful, that once each fall might be better.
Some studies (if only in vitro) indicating vaccination causes suppression of some immune functions. Field data appears to show the same for Omicron, but not conclusive yet (not a well controlled study.)

There are a number of different types of vaccines available, we can switch between them.

At some point we will end up living with the virus just like we do with the flu. Seeing occasionall deadlier variants.

Hospital beds will likely need to be increased and this will require additional funding. Expect vacine requirements imposed by governments, companies, schools and insurance companies.

 

[bradbill]

What was the approval date?

8/23/21

 

[Hedges]

Never trust the take-away

"Israeli study shows 4th shot of COVID-19 vaccine less effective on Omicron"​

Israeli study shows 4th shot of COVID-19 vaccine less effective on Omicron

JERUSALEM (Reuters) -A fourth shot of COVID-19 vaccine boosts antibodies to even higher levels than the third jab but it is not enough to prevent Omicron infections, according to a preliminary study in Israel. Israel's Sheba Medical Center has given second booster shots in a trial among its...

news.yahoo.com

Nothing in the text of the article indicates that protection against Omicron was lower for the 4th shot, compared to the 3rd.
Perhaps the study data indicated it was. But article didn't quote anything to that effect.

All it says is that antibodies are even higher with 4th shot, but they know not high enough to protect against omicron.
Even higher would mean either more effective or as effective. Not less effective.

My Googling didn't turn up any reports of data from the study. Anybody else see some?

 

[Batvette]

How are you any different, Brad? You seem to be stalking Batvette by posting stuff he said years rago on different forums ?

Its hilarious, it seems he is now obsessed with me. I dont even know or care who he is. What did I say that got him so butt hurt?
Im not sure what he is trying to accomplish by turning threads into discussions about me, but I addressed this previously and like an ankle biter he ran away.
I was going through some things in my life and I thought I found the answers to questions I had on the internet. I quickly realized I was lied to, and I was wrong. I actually spent much more time afterwards trying to talk sense into many of these people but of course Brad wont mention this.
If Brad or anyone else here has never been wrong in their lives, well just post up your story and turn this into a discussion about you.
A much more interesting discussion might be about the directed energy weapons that actually exist. These arent as classified as youd think.
Or how about the backscatter xray vans, hundreds of which are deployed in cities across the nation.
There is no reason to laugh at the idea of fantasy weapons, surveillance, etc when the ones we know they have are scary enough.

Raytheon's active denial system:

High-Tech Crowd Control Weapon Sought For D.C. Protests Is Too Terrifying To Use

Military police sought unsuccessfully to deploy a 'pain beam' developed almost 20 years ago, for use in Washington, D.C., against protesters. Nobody wants to be the first to use the futuristic 'nonlethal' weapon because of its scary image.

www.forbes.com

Which was made operational by the military 15 years ago and installed at the LA county jail soon after.
I guess Brad has been locked in a closet somewhere and hasnt been keeping up.

Backscatter Xray vans:

Scanner Vans Allow Drive-By Snooping

X-ray vans that can see through walls--and clothes--hit America's streets. Nervous yet?

www.forbes.com

By 2010 the manufacturer had sold over 500 worldwide and in US cities coast to coast. How many in the dozen years since? These are not legal to be used on a dwelling without a warrant, yet its pretty obvious they do.
Some reports claim they can park 27 ft or more from a wall and have the resolution to count the change in your pocket as you walk across the room.

So Bradley, or Chumley, or whatever you call yourself, maybe some day you feel an unusual heat on one side of your body. Or a strange metallic taste in your mouth, and you look outside and theres a strange van in front of your house. Maybe if you go on the internet in search of answers you might find actual information like that I am presenting you. Not some ignorant nonsense like that which was circulating at the time nor some heckler like you adding confusion.

 

[Hedges]

So Bradley, or Chumley, or whatever you call yourself, maybe some day you feel an unusual heat on one side of your body. Or a strange metallic taste in your mouth, and you look outside and theres a strange van in front of your house.

Have any references regarding X-ray (of any energy level) causing metallic taste?
That can be symptom of neutron exposure, I have read.

If you think X-ray (backscatter or otherwise) is likely, any appropriate detectors we might employ?
Film would show it, but only after development.
Electronic detectors could trigger real-time alarm. And log directionality over time, appropriately configured.

The article is about backscatter. More practical for the stated application. But targets anticipating that sort of probing could be cloaked.
I've parked at the border while transmission X-ray was used to inspect vehicles.
We once saw news with X-ray of a semi-truck, showing the skeletons of all the "migrants" standing inside.

 

[Batvette]

I was just making a general assumption about radiation exposure. Not sure if that is typical of backscatter emissions.

 

[Batvette]

I was just making a general assumption about radiation exposure. Not sure if that is typical of backscatter emissions.

I worked for an intentionally brief time in industrial radiography. We carried a film badge for monthly exposure, a dosimeter for daily in our shirt pocket, and a geiger counter in our back pocket for immediate exposure. One of the projects I worked on involved welds on rebar in concrete footings in the ground on the 805 freeway bridge over mission valley in san diego.

We set the film behind the rebar, and placed the source box nearby, play out the ~15-20' crank cable, crank the source out, then your geiger counter bell starts ringing like mad so you run out of the hole and stand behind the work truck for the designated time usually about a minute.
Once a source got cranked out of the box and due to a malfunction fell off the cable on the ground.
Whole jobsite gets evacuated. Company owner comes out, stops at home depot for some wood dowels about 12 ft long. Took a few minutes of fiddling but was able to safely recover the source and confine it to a lead emergency box.
When he got back to the shop he threw his film badge away. Had he sent it in to the DOE like he was required to he wouldnt be allowed on the premises again.

When I was studying to take the test when I started the textbook had photos and accounts of people who had found radiography sources (jobsites, along a highway, on a bus, etc) put them in their back pocket and walked around with it for a few hours till they felt the damage and went to the hospital.
Their deaths were pretty gruesome, usually taking months as doctors took more and more masses of dying tissue off.
A source was lost off a truck in los angeles in the 70s or 80s, they traced the path of the truck and closed the freeway and ramps till they found it.
These things are like the size of half a finger. Theyre meant to take images of thick steel so emit a lot of radiation. Watch what you pick up.

 

[BMcL]

Never trust the take-away

"Israeli study shows 4th shot of COVID-19 vaccine less effective on Omicron"​

Israeli study shows 4th shot of COVID-19 vaccine less effective on Omicron

JERUSALEM (Reuters) -A fourth shot of COVID-19 vaccine boosts antibodies to even higher levels than the third jab but it is not enough to prevent Omicron infections, according to a preliminary study in Israel. Israel's Sheba Medical Center has given second booster shots in a trial among its...

news.yahoo.com

Nothing in the text of the article indicates that protection against Omicron was lower for the 4th shot, compared to the 3rd.
Perhaps the study data indicated it was. But article didn't quote anything to that effect.

All it says is that antibodies are even higher with 4th shot, but they know not high enough to protect against omicron.
Even higher would mean either more effective or as effective. Not less effective.

My Googling didn't turn up any reports of data from the study. Anybody else see some?

I just saw an article in the Jerusalem Post claiming over 65,000 infected !
Scrolled down and it said there were 113 cases in the entire country that required ventilators or oxygen.
That's a whopping .002%

https://www.jpost.com/health-and-wellness/coronavirus/article-693836

 

[NEpowerandlight]

Opinion | Are Vaccines Fueling New Covid Variants?

The virus appears to be evolving in ways that evade immunity.

www.wsj.com

 

[Hedges]

You're right. Today, justice is getting worse with each new law. It is hard to watch it even. I'm into law news and usually search for essential information on sites like https://ucmjdefense.com/false-allegations-of-sexual-assault-in-the-military-why-are-they-so-common.html. I'm surprised to see that it is more ard for us, people now to defend ourselves, and all these correctives are only to change something, without looking for consequences. I hope I won't have to protect myself in a modern court system, as it will be extreme;y hard even if you're not guilty. Do you agree with me, guys?

When I was a civilian employee of the military, we were required to take various training, including some regarding sexual assault in the military.
The problem was described as an epidemic. Also, not just men assaulting and harassing women, but also men against men, women against men.

The numbers they provided showed the assault was 98% men against women.

The overall rate per capita was considerably lower than for the general population.
Once I separated it by rank etc., I found that only among army enlisted was it as high as the general population. But that included men and women in the general population, so among (predominantly men) enlisted in the army, half the rate. But that included infants and centenarians in the general population, vs. males in the military at an age of peak sexual drive and activity. Overall, all groups of the military were order- to orders of magnitude better behaved than the general public.

Epidemic my @$$

 

[LeoThomson]

Looks like its headed to SCOTUS..

U.S. Supreme Court to take up Biden vaccine mandate cases

The U.S. Supreme Court agreed on Wednesday to take up disputes over the Biden administration's nationwide vaccine-or-testing COVID-19 mandate for large businesses and a separate vaccine requirement for healthcare workers.

www.reuters.com

Lots of interesting perspectives on this one and I know what most people are going to say about it..

Left = Mandates are good we need to protect everyone.

Right = Mandates bad, individual choice is more important.

It is not a left vs right debate.

It is a libertarian vs authoritarian debate. Americans would call me a leftist, but while I believe we have a social responsibility, I am a fierce libertarian. (much more so than Republicans who are in authoritarian in many ways) I also believe that with freedom comes personal responsibility. As such I took the vaccines to protect myself and those in the community who, through medical conditions, can't take vaccines.

How do YOU draw this line?

I can not care about people who refuse the vaccine, their choice, their responsibility and now hospitals are coping there is no great need for mandates either.