Brucey
Solar Wizard
Maybe triggered by a temp sensor on/adjacent to the batteries.
Wow, basen rack.mounts batteries destroy a home in germany
- Thread starter houseofancients
- Start date
I still don't understand how/why a cell would vent if it is within normal operating (i.e. overcharging) parameters. If you go outside said parameters, the BMS should kick in to prevent this in the first place. It would be very interesting to do a failure analysis/post mortem in this case...
hwy17
Anti-Solar Enthusiast
We've discussed concerns about FETs failing closed right? Maybe an unnoticed battery in BMS distress, repeatedly cycling it's FETs open and closed for days or weeks until they tap out.
Yep - which is why I would really want a post-mortem on this case.
Gas explosions have been happening "all the time" even in Germany. Just do a search and you'd see quite a few even this year. The more people who install RE systems with battery backup make it more likely some of those will occur in a building with an RE system. Places looking for click-bait will of course jump on this that that they finally have the two together.
Daddy Tanuki
Solar Wizard
just read through the german forums that were commenting on this and they have basically the same questions as most of us do. BTW the black case in the photo is one of the server rack batteries. it labels match up perfectly for the basen rack server batteries and it has wires coming out the fron in the correct locations for the battery to battery patch cables and what not.
Bluedog225
Texas
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2019
- Messages
- 2,961
What’s an RE system?
And why would a well ordered country like Germany have lots of gas explosions?
Genuinely curious.
Thanks
And why would a well ordered country like Germany have lots of gas explosions?
Genuinely curious.
Thanks
OffGridForGood
Catch, make or grow everything you can.
{RE = renewable Energy}
no conclusive information provided.
I will leave my cells as they are for now. I am not going to add fans and exterior venting in my climate without better evidence of an issue.
I wonder if a temperature sensor that triggers a relay to cut off all charging/discharging to the ESS based on a high temp set point would be better option anyway.
I will keep my eyes open for any actual technical report on this or similar incidents going forward, re-assess after more thorough reporting.
Full-Disclosure: My 68kWh ESS is in a steel building next door to my home, not in the house where family and I live and sleep.
no conclusive information provided.
I will leave my cells as they are for now. I am not going to add fans and exterior venting in my climate without better evidence of an issue.
I wonder if a temperature sensor that triggers a relay to cut off all charging/discharging to the ESS based on a high temp set point would be better option anyway.
I will keep my eyes open for any actual technical report on this or similar incidents going forward, re-assess after more thorough reporting.
Full-Disclosure: My 68kWh ESS is in a steel building next door to my home, not in the house where family and I live and sleep.
2595 gas incidences in the USA from 2010 to 2021. Most are without injury or death but goes to show you the amount of leaks happening:
Bluedog225
Texas
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2019
- Messages
- 2,961
Yeah. I get why we have them. But Germany seems a better run place in team of civil safety type stuff. Maybe I have the wrong impression.
Don't confuse "more regulated" with "better regulated".
Daddy Tanuki
Solar Wizard
correct answer...
Daddy Tanuki
Solar Wizard
Japan is fairly well run, but in 37 years I have had 3 cases of propane leak. one at a rental when i was younger, one at our current house (and it was scary) and one at the cabin.
apartment gas leak was furnished with a standard two burner stove. it was so old that the gas would leak if you did not shut off the gas valve. (which you are supposed to do when not using). edited for clarity: the stove has its own two valves, one for each burner. but there is a full shutoff valve at the hardline on the wall which since the stoves use a soft perishable line from the valve to the cooktop, you are technically supposed to shut the main valve off when not in use.) (I had not been and the stove itself was leaking).
main house was when the gas company hooked up my whirlpool US stove oven combo they used teflon tape vice pipe dope as instructed in the install manual. it started leaking at the intake valve of the stove (lower back) and slowly filled the crawl space under the house with propane gas. by the time the alarm went off, I could already smell it, and it was dangerous....
called gas company they sent a emergency team that used a large spark proof blower to evacuate the crawlspace under the house before testing and figureing out where they had screwed up. fixed it been good to go ever since.
the cabin had a leaking water heater (reheat heater that keeps bathtub warm) it was mounted on the outside of the house so no danger per se ,just a lot of leaked gas i had to pay for along with the repair.
so all this to let you know that it happens especially with older gear and seals or gaskets that might have not aged as well as hoped.
My personnel opinion looking at the single inside photo? gas leak... explosive pressure from the shockwave cam do a lot of damage. Little difference then a Fuel Air Bomb that the military uses to collapse tunnels in the middle east. notice little if any evidence of flame... yet lots of damage? if the cells had gotten hot enough to outgas you would see some form of heat damage on the metal casing of the battery.
just my 2.8¥
Is it possible that the boiler t&p valve and boiler limits failed creating a super heated steam explosion event without fire at all? Corked water heaters blow up houses all the time. A water heater recently blew a house to little bits in Plum, Pennsylvania:
Daddy Tanuki
Solar Wizard
creepy avatar person: (joke) you could be very well correct. but like normal the news sources are taking the most scary, fantastic and alarming point they can find and running with it for clicks.
I'm only wondering how they figured out to blame the batteries.
To me it looks like 'ow, lithium, yes, thats dangerous, thus is the source'
If I see the images, it looks the batteries are still fine, as also mentioned in that German topic and here. To me, it seems quite unlikely the house is gone, but the batteries itself are still in their original case which appears to look (near?) undamaged, while they are the source...
Would expect those batteries to be shattered all around the place and in now-way look anymore like a battery box based on the amount of damage caused by the explosion.
Even mentioning Basen (basicly blaming them for highly unsafe batteries)... don't think thats anywhere near a professional report.
If they are sure or highly doubting the batteries i would expect a safety issue from an govermental agency and/or selller (altought that might be unlikely with some chinese sellers). Not 'random' accusing by naming from a (seems reputable) website.
To me it looks like 'ow, lithium, yes, thats dangerous, thus is the source'
If I see the images, it looks the batteries are still fine, as also mentioned in that German topic and here. To me, it seems quite unlikely the house is gone, but the batteries itself are still in their original case which appears to look (near?) undamaged, while they are the source...
Would expect those batteries to be shattered all around the place and in now-way look anymore like a battery box based on the amount of damage caused by the explosion.
Even mentioning Basen (basicly blaming them for highly unsafe batteries)... don't think thats anywhere near a professional report.
If they are sure or highly doubting the batteries i would expect a safety issue from an govermental agency and/or selller (altought that might be unlikely with some chinese sellers). Not 'random' accusing by naming from a (seems reputable) website.
We have 'gas explosions' in the UK semi-regularly ...
It's our go to excuse when something goes bang and they don't want to tell you what happened.
It was big during the blitz in ww2, particularly with the V2 rockets .... we'd almost never admit the Germans hit a house, it was always a 'gas leak'...
and we still do it to this day! A terrorist bomb making factory blew up near Leeds a few years ago , took out 2 other houses nextdoor aswell with it ... That was a 'gas leak' too ?
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Daddy Tanuki
Solar Wizard
government, and insurance companies. government wants to control... insurance does not want to pay out. start a negative information campaign in the general public and you can have both scenarios... people are friggin sheep at the best of times. at worst they are lemmings jumping off the cliff
... often attributed to fraudulent owners adding a DIY "bypass pipe" around the gas meter.
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