230v Quattro 8000 and a Franklin Electric Tri Seal 1.5 HP 15 GPM.. How to wire?

[Dakker]

First off, I'm new. I know enough to get myself in some real trouble, so I figure I better come get some help before I regret frying a $3500 inverter and a $2500 well pump!

I bought 11 acres recently and I'm going completely off grid. I have been playing with solar at an entry level for about 8 years. I've done a couple RV solar installs. The last was 4 REC Solar 330W panels with a Victron CC and BMV-712, a Exeltech XPX2000 and 2 48V Simplifi Lithium 3.3 kWh batteries. I thing they were 3.3's.. anyways.
Now I'm going big. I bought a pallet of Silfab Commercial 490W panels. I'm willing to spend the money on some lithium batteies. And still undecided on the rest of it...
I already had 16 US2200 lead acids sitting around. So I built a trailer and threw 4 REC's above them. PowerStationOne up and running. Charges slow, but that's okay at the moment. It's a 2 bank 48v setup. Going to use this to power my well pump until the well house gets built. (All of this is going kinda slow because I'm 100% debt free and paying cash for everything)

I had my well drilled.. 205' and 17 grand later.. I bought a Franklin Electric Tri Seal 15 GPM 1.5 HP 230v submersible pump. It's down the hole already.
Now to pump some water.... PowerStationOne (PS1) needs to step up to bat. (No pun intended from AirForceOne)
So I may or may not have screwed up, but I bought a Quattro 8000. 230v.
I hooked it up to PS1. Flipped the switch on and probed it with my Fluke. AC Out Line 1 to Neutral.... 230v. AC Out Line 2 to Neutral 0v.. WTF?
I was expecting 115v at each. So I did more research. AC Out 2 only becomes hot from incoming AC power.
My "deluxe" control box from Franklin Electric (yes, it's the one for this pump and motor) has two incoming lines.. L1 and L2. Prior to me turning on the inverter, I was 100% certain. No worries.. 115V out of AC Out Line 1 and AC Out Line 2 from the Quattro and all is good.
Well.. now I'm stumped. I've read. And I've read. And then I did some more reading. And then I watched some YouTube. Then I read some forums. Then I decided to sign up here.

Now I'm thinking I just need to buy Victron's Autotransformer.. But not certain it's going to work for me or not. I see conflicting data on what I read. And not 100% certain I need it based on other things I read.

Pictures are worth a thousand words.. so here they come. Please help me! This is a 3 wire pump. I'm not at all confused about hooking up the pump to the control box. But I am stumped on how to power the control box with this inverter.

Control Box: https://www.rcworst.com/franklin-electric-2823008310-deluxe-submersible-motor-control-box-1-5-hp-230v-1ph-for-3-wire-motors-clone.html

Pump: https://www.rcworst.com/Franklin-Electric-SandHandler-Tri-Seal-15JS15P4-3W230-Submersible-Well-Pump-Motor-15-GPM-1-5-HP-230V-1PH-3-Wire-p5202.html

Inverter: https://www.solar-electric.com/victron-energy-quattro-inverter-48-8000-110-230vac.html

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I had my well drilled.. 205' and 17 grand later.. I bought a Franklin Electric Tri Seal 15 GPM 1.5 HP 230v submersible pump. It's down the hole already.
Now to pump some water.... PowerStationOne (PS1) needs to step up to bat. (No pun intended from AirForceOne)
So I may or may not have screwed up, but I bought a Quattro 8000. 230v.
I hooked it up to PS1. Flipped the switch on and probed it with my Fluke. AC Out Line 1 to Neutral.... 230v. AC Out Line 2 to Neutral 0v.. WTF?
I was expecting 115v at each. So I did more research. AC Out 2 only becomes hot from incoming AC power.

Yep.

My "deluxe" control box from Franklin Electric (yes, it's the one for this pump and motor) has two incoming lines.. L1 and L2. Prior to me turning on the inverter, I was 100% certain. No worries.. 115V out of AC Out Line 1 and AC Out Line 2 from the Quattro and all is good.
Well.. now I'm stumped. I've read. And I've read. And then I did some more reading. And then I watched some YouTube. Then I read some forums. Then I decided to sign up here.

You bought an EU spec inverter with 230VAC L N and G. Think 120VAC/60Hz in north america, but at 230V/50Hz.

it's not working because:

G should be tied to N in 120/240VAC split phase between the two hot legs.
With 230VAC single phase, G and N are bonded with the single L as hot.

With this inverter, it's like you're grounding either L1 or L2 on your pump, but neither should happen.

Now I'm thinking I just need to buy Victron's Autotransformer.. But not certain it's going to work for me or not. I see conflicting data on what I read. And not 100% certain I need it based on other things I read.

If you want split phase power from your inverter, yes, that's what you need. It's a fairly common solution for folks that want a single big inverter from Victron and need split phase.

Pictures are worth a thousand words.. so here they come. Please help me! This is a 3 wire pump. I'm not at all confused about hooking up the pump to the control box. But I am stumped on how to power the control box with this inverter.

I hesitate to comment on any of the other stuff, but if you want 120/240VAC split phase power from that inverter, get the Autotransformer. You'll need to reprogram the unit for 60Hz from its default of 50Hz. You'll need a MK3-USB adapter and VictronConnect on a PC.

 

[Samsonite801]

You'll need to reprogram the unit for 60Hz from its default of 50Hz. You'll need a MK3-USB adapter and VictronConnect on a PC.

Just a minor comment to append in addition to changing frequency to 60Hz, but often times in the US, voltage would be 240v, you he can also change the inverter output voltage from 230v to 240v, lowers the amps by a little bit... Then it would be 120v on each leg..

 

[Dakker]

I have the dongle to reprogram to 60 Hz and was aware of that.
And the pump is truly a 230v pump. I added a link that goes directly to that pump.
I did stumble across some verbiage somewhere from Franklin that essentially said it is a 240v pump. It's listed at 230v due to voltage drop or something along those lines. Wish I could find that again..
Is the auto transformer the only way this can be done? Do I have any other options?

 

[Dakker]

Are you guys familiar with the Victron Autotransformer?
Will it convert my 230v quattro to spilt phase 115v or is it definitely going to step up the voltage to 120/240?
The spec sheet doesn't tend to be totally clear on this to me.
It seems as though if I were to use the Autotransformer wired to a 120v inverter, It can step it up to 240. But I'm just using it to split the phase, no? Will it step up the 230 single to 240 split?

 

[Samsonite801]

Are you guys familiar with the Victron Autotransformer?
Will it convert my 230v quattro to spilt phase 115v or is it definitely going to step up the voltage to 120/240?
The spec sheet doesn't tend to be totally clear on this to me.
It seems as though if I were to use the Autotransformer wired to a 120v inverter, It can step it up to 240. But I'm just using it to split the phase, no? Will it step up the 230 single to 240 split?

The transformer should just take the input voltage and be the same coming out, but adds a center-tap in the middle of the secondary winding to be the neutral (hard-set on the number of windings on primary and secondary coils, center-tap on secondary, etc.)

So if you fed it with 230v in (L1,L2,Grd), it should theoretically have 230v/115v coming out (L1,L2,N,Grd). But I don't specifically know the details on the Victron Autotransformer, you could ping Victron, or download the full manual for it and see if there are any specific references on it.

They could have alternate (multiple) primary taps for different input voltages. I do have an APC datacenter center-tap transformer that has a physical switch on it showing 208v or 240v input (and I think it allows it to change which primary winding tap utilizes in the doughnut)...


EDIT:
Of course the Victron you're referring to is an autotransformer, which I don't know as much about, my APC unit above is an isolation transformer so not sure as much how Victron sets up their autotransformers. Looks they they can have the possibility for features like variable tap points too and things like that which I don't know all about.

Perhaps someone else knows more about how the Victron autotransformers work. Me personally, I don't like the idea of using an autotransformer as several references indicate, that if the secondary winding goes open it can put full 230v onto your household appliances 115v line, and that danger never sounded too appealing to me. I would rather go for the isolation transformer myself.

It also looks like Victron sells isolation transformers as well...


Ref:

https://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/transformer/auto-transformer.html

 

[Samsonite801]

I see here, the Victron autotransformer just passes through the L1 and L2, and adds one winding to provide a center tap for neutral...

 

[sunshine_eggo]

230/240, 115/120, nothing will care. Victron AT will split whatever comes into it into two legs. Give it 240, you'll get two 120V legs. Give it 230, you'll get two 115V legs.

My neighbor runs his Grundfos 230VAC pump at 240VAC and has done so for over a decade.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I see here, the Victron autotransformer just passes through the L1 and L2, and adds one winding to provide a center tap for neutral...

and a bonded ground to N if needed.