diy solar

diy solar

Beginner looking for advice on set-up

Have you used Renogy and had problems or is that because you use a different brand?
No. That’s not how I draw conclusions.

I read for several months before buying my first tiny solar power system. 200W, now who knows? 3000W but I could potentially hook up 5300W with just panels laying around if I wanted to.

All that reading? Renogy was the industry leader by far in complaints about CS and failures. So I bought other stuff and used that. So yes I used a different brand (several, actually) and have been quite happy with support and performance (other than Epever’s voltage spike bug due to either programming or a slow processor.

No actual equipment failures yet other than a leaky MC4 situation that took me forever (many months) to identify the ‘real’ source of water in my solar cables.

And then after a few years here I’m totally convinced that (as with many rebrand purchase order manufacturers) renogy is too expensive after the purchase to spend that much to purchase to begin with.
 
I read for several months
Well, I would say be careful reading stuff online about Renogy or other products from people that may not even use those products and it isn't unknown for brands to attack other brands posting bad reviews.

I have used Renogy and have panels that are over 10 years old now with very little degradation. The MPPT controllers are new but no problems so far. I had an issue with an inverter but they replaced it under warranty. So that is my honest review of Renogy from someone that uses Renogy equipment.
 
This is a picture I took a few days ago of those 10 year old Renogy producing over the rated watts on a sunny day and they actually hit 425 watts but I got the camera out in time to catch it at 406. That is on a 400 watt system.

Also I don't use Renogy batteries so I can't speak to those. I used Vmax tank AGM that lasted over 10 years and this year replaced those with an Enjoyboy 400Ah LFP. I expect that to outlast me!

Renogy producing over rating..jpg
 
No dissing the redneck here, and that is a realistic envelope. I think 2500W starts being too much, though I also consider 3000W as the absolute ceiling on 12V. With several LiFePo batteries in a battery bank you can “hold down” the discharge maximum from each battery to a reasonable level (my 480Ah bank has three parallel batteries for example) and if going ‘high’ to like a 3000W inverter I’d likely utilize four batteries.
Absolutely COULD be done, but I think you'll agree that you have to ask if it SHOULD be done. I can't say I'd recommend anything needing multiple heavy gauge welding cables and a 300+ amp Class-T fuse to be appropriate for a "Learner System". :oops:

Plus with that much amperage draw you'll be needing to get bus bars and numerous batteries involved. At that point a 24v system starts looking real nice.
 
Dumb question #1: can panels that are greater than 12V be used with other components (battery, inverter) that are 12V? (Is this one of the functions of the charge controller, stepping down the input?)

Dumb question #2: can batteries of different type / chemistry be connected in the same set-up? It makes sense what @Rednecktek said above about starting with cheaper components, which is making me think I might start with something other than LiFePO4, though in the long run that is the type I would want to use. So, I could end up with two different batteries.

Regarding panel selection, whichever manufacturer I go with, I'm hoping to stick with smaller / lighter panels, because my ideal location (garage roof) is shaded by the main house when the sun is lower in the sky. (I'm at 39 degrees N latitude.) So, I'd like to be able to move the panels around to find the best location from time to time, perhaps even within the day, to take advantage of a good day.

@Solarcabin Channel , you've got a good idea of my application: I'll be charging batteries for lawn and hand-held power tools, nothing too crazy. I'd also like to run some other loads: lights, fan, dehumidifier, and the garage door itself. (That last one is actually high priority as that is the only access to the garage, so when we have a utility outage I'm SOL.)

To get a better idea of the load, I'll check out the usage on the items listed above. I will check out the specs printed on each device, and is it worth it to buy a gadget to measure actual load?
 
Dumb question #1: can panels that are greater than 12V be used with other components (battery, inverter) that are 12V? (Is this one of the functions of the charge controller, stepping down the input?)
That's exactly what an MPPT controller does. It's basically a DC-DC converter that can take (for napkin math) 90v of solar panel DC and convert it to the 14v that your batteries like. Since Wats = Volts x Amps if your panels are putting 5a into the controller at 90v that's 450w. Since your battery only wants 14v, that would be 32a coming out of the controller into the batteries.

A cheapie PWM controller works slightly differently where it just dumps anything over the voltage you need into the aether as waste heat, so those 90v and 5a coming in are only 14v and 5a coming out. That's a HUGE waste of potential power.
Dumb question #2: can batteries of different type / chemistry be connected in the same set-up? It makes sense what @Rednecktek said above about starting with cheaper components, which is making me think I might start with something other than LiFePO4, though in the long run that is the type I would want to use. So, I could end up with two different batteries.
You Can, but it's not good practice. If you mix & match chemistries you have to go by the lowest common denominator. So if you were wanting to mix Lead Acid (12.8v) with LFP (14.2v) you'll either never fill your LFP or you'll burn up your lead acid. The best thing you can do is to drop the lead acids off when you are ready to step up to LFP, or go straight to LFP since it's a LOT cheaper nowadays and is worth it if you can afford the up-front difference.
Regarding panel selection, whichever manufacturer I go with, I'm hoping to stick with smaller / lighter panels, because my ideal location (garage roof) is shaded by the main house when the sun is lower in the sky. (I'm at 39 degrees N latitude.) So, I'd like to be able to move the panels around to find the best location from time to time, perhaps even within the day, to take advantage of a good day.
More trips with small panels is better than multiple moves with 60lb panels for sure, although you'll be getting sick of that pretty quickly and be looking at where you can stick them and leave them.
@Solarcabin Channel , you've got a good idea of my application: I'll be charging batteries for lawn and hand-held power tools, nothing too crazy. I'd also like to run some other loads: lights, fan, dehumidifier, and the garage door itself. (That last one is actually high priority as that is the only access to the garage, so when we have a utility outage I'm SOL.)
The dehumidifier and garage door are going to be data points you'll want because the startup surge on the garage door motor is going to need to be accounted for and the dehumidifier tends to be a pretty high draw and runs for a long time so that's a lot of battery power to plan for.

The other part of the equation is time. Sure, your fan draws 50w which isn't a lot, but if you have it running for 10 hours that's 500 watt-hours which is about half of a standard 100Ah LFP battery or the entirety of a 100Ah lead acid just for the fan. Then you want to charge batteries and turn on a light and open the garage door on top of that? Battery capacity adds up quick and while you're finding space for all these batteries and putting together all the required bits and bars and wires to keep everything in balance, it makes rolling your own batteries look a lot more attractive.
To get a better idea of the load, I'll check out the usage on the items listed above. I will check out the specs printed on each device, and is it worth it to buy a gadget to measure actual load?
Yes, those are really handy especially for the aforementioned dehumidifier and door opener as well as the running load over time of things that will be on for a while like lights and fans and battery chargers.

Fortunately there doesn't seem to be anything on the list that's going to require a huge inverter to supply which is a good thing. I suspect that once you get your power audit underway that a 1200-1500w inverter will probably be enough.
 
. I'd also like to run some other loads: lights, fan, dehumidifier, and the garage door itself.
The average Garage Door Opener uses 400 watts.

It is a motor so there will be a surge of around 1200 watts for a few seconds but look on the motor to be sure.
 
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That's exactly what an MPPT controller does. It's basically a DC-DC converter that can take (for napkin math) 90v of solar panel DC and convert it to the 14v that your batteries like. Since Wats = Volts x Amps if your panels are putting 5a into the controller at 90v that's 450w. Since your battery only wants 14v, that would be 32a coming out of the controller into the batteries.

A cheapie PWM controller works slightly differently where it just dumps anything over the voltage you need into the aether as waste heat, so those 90v and 5a coming in are only 14v and 5a coming out. That's a HUGE waste of potential power.

You Can, but it's not good practice. If you mix & match chemistries you have to go by the lowest common denominator. So if you were wanting to mix Lead Acid (12.8v) with LFP (14.2v) you'll either never fill your LFP or you'll burn up your lead acid. The best thing you can do is to drop the lead acids off when you are ready to step up to LFP, or go straight to LFP since it's a LOT cheaper nowadays and is worth it if you can afford the up-front difference.
Have you run a hybrid system? It really depends and your use case. And on top of that there are ways to get around the limitations as well.
More trips with small panels is better than multiple moves with 60lb panels for sure, although you'll be getting sick of that pretty quickly and be looking at where you can stick them and leave them.

The dehumidifier and garage door are going to be data points you'll want because the startup surge on the garage door motor is going to need to be accounted for and the dehumidifier tends to be a pretty high draw and runs for a long time so that's a lot of battery power to plan for.

The other part of the equation is time. Sure, your fan draws 50w which isn't a lot, but if you have it running for 10 hours that's 500 watt-hours which is about half of a standard 100Ah LFP battery or the entirety of a 100Ah lead acid just for the fan. Then you want to charge batteries and turn on a light and open the garage door on top of that? Battery capacity adds up quick and while you're finding space for all these batteries and putting together all the required bits and bars and wires to keep everything in balance, it makes rolling your own batteries look a lot more attractive.

Yes, those are really handy especially for the aforementioned dehumidifier and door opener as well as the running load over time of things that will be on for a while like lights and fans and battery chargers.

Fortunately there doesn't seem to be anything on the list that's going to require a huge inverter to supply which is a good thing. I suspect that once you get your power audit underway that a 1200-1500w inverter will probably be enough.
 
Hello, I am planning to build my first solar set-up, with no experience other than watching some videos and reading articles. Below is the set-up I am considering, and I would appreciate any thoughts that people have on it:
  • Would it function?
  • Are any components missing?
  • Is one component over/under sized compared to others?
  • Are the manufacturers reputable?
  • How would it scale if I added more panels or batteries?
  • Etc.
The application is to power my garage, collecting and storing power daily to support weekend use of AC tools.

Potential system components, including links:
  • Renogy 100W 12V Monocrystalline panel (VOC 24.3V)
  • Renogy Wanderer 30A charge controller
  • (MC4 and tray cables included with panel and charge controller)
  • Renogy Bluetooth module
  • Renogy 1000W 12V pure sine wave inverter
  • Li Time 12V 100Ah LiFePO4 battery
Thanks in advance for any thoughts and feedback!

It's been said already, but I'd choose ANYTHING over Renogy.

Why? Because I have owned several Renogy things: 2000W inverter (high idle draw), Rover 30A MPPT charge controller (maddening to program and it likes to send 16-19v spikes to my LiFePO4 battery), Bluetooth dongle for the MPPT (works but the app is buggy and sometimes (inconsistently) reports inaccurate data) and 200W solar panel suitcase (panels are of low quality and produce LESS than my flexible panels, while the flexibles are flat on the ground and the Renogy rigid suitcase is tilted toward the sun).

But the main reason is: Renogy customer service and warranty is really maddening and a joke. The company was sold some years ago and everyone I spoke with on the phone or dealt with over email/trouble ticket portal is very friendly and courteous, but inept at helping. They would ask for details and screenshots, which I would send to them via their online ticket portal and every time someone different would reply and ask for the same details/screenshots. I would reply by saying, "Please read the ticket thread, everything you ask for is there," to which they would reply (again a new person this time) by asking for the same details/screenshots. To which I would reply again and after three weeks of this, I simply gave up.

I have since sold most of my Renogy gear. It's a good time to sell used Renogy gear, because the public perception is that Renogy is quality stuff for a good price. I was suckered into that perception through their seemingly low prices and fancy marketing - hook, line and sinker. I write to warn you to avoid the same mistake I made. Now that Victron has slashed prices on at least their SmartSolar charge controllers, it's a no-brainer to at least buy that since it's the brain of your system.
 
Plus with that much amperage draw you'll be needing to get bus bars and numerous batteries involved. At that point a 24v system starts looking real nice
There is wisdom needed when considering the options near the margin. In some situations 12V straight-up is desirable, like mine.
Although - not being heady or braggy or whatever - I have the skill and knowledge to do this safely and know the limitations. So ya, maybe not a newbie system but it seems simple to me?

I don’t need 3000W, I just want/need the startup headroom for convenience with the existing integrated system. And I’m already wired to support it.

In an RV 12V is attractive.

But YES- if you actually need 2500W+ or more, then either jumping off the 12V ship entirely or installing a second system for the heavy workload is advised.
would say be careful reading stuff online about Renogy or other products from people that may not even use those products and it isn't unknown for brands to attack other brands posting bad reviews.
Do you know how long I’ve been online, LOL? Geesh. Everyone knows caveat emptor- but logically? Logically- using the same standard- one can’t really take your review too seriously either.
What I took seriously was discussion boards like this with a high volume of real people with real experience with real problems posting real questions with real quality answers getting for real pissed of with renogy at a massively higher volume than other ‘brands.’
So I chose stuff from sources that people like William Prowse recommended.
Lotsa people bought yugos too.
goes both ways and companies want good reviews and to ignore bad reviews
confirmation bias
It's been said already, but I'd choose ANYTHING over Renogy✅
it's a no-brainer to at least buy that since it's the brain of your system
So many good options in same price range that don’t have the common threads you listed. Victron seems also to have the longevity which negates much of the cost difference. It’s about wise choices- essentially what you said.
 
Battery capacity adds up quick and while you're finding space for all these batteries and putting together all the required bits and bars and wires to keep everything in balance, it makes rolling your own batteries look a lot more attractive.

Audit is underway, will post again when complete! In the meantime, what does "rolling your own batteries" mean? Working with individual cells?
 
Audit is underway, will post again when complete! In the meantime, what does "rolling your own batteries" mean? Working with individual cells?
Yes, rolling your own means getting your own cells and BMS and building your own battery. I remember when I built my first one I was nervous but I followed a few of Will's videos, read through the top balancing guide, and when I was done I wondered what I was so nervous about.

Nowadays the cost savings aren't as impressive as they once were but having the battery capacity of 6 deep cycle lead batteries in the space of a single one is really nice.

I'll post some links to my various builds when I get home later for you to see the process.
 
OK, here's a few links to some of the batteries I've built over the years. I think I'm up around 6 or 7 now that I've done.

My first battery for my brother's pop-up camper.

My first ammo can 24v battery.

The solar generator I built with my nephew.

You do need some specialized equipment, mostly a lug crimper for the larger wire, a bench top power supply and regular car battery charger, and the proper size lugs and terminals. Fortunately most of those are really cheap and the tools and chargers will get used over and over again.
 
what does "rolling your own batteries" mean
It’s an adaptation of a common euphemism borrowed from hand rolling cigarettes (sometimes cigars). It’s become an anthro for “DIY” versus manufactured items.
 
It’s an adaptation of a common euphemism borrowed from hand rolling cigarettes (sometimes cigars). It’s become an anthro for “DIY” versus manufactured items.
I was familiar with the expression in its original usage. :) My high school US history teacher used to roll his own cigarettes during class. He had a stack of rolling papers, a handful of loose filters, and a pile of tobacco, and he would fill 'em, roll 'em, lick 'em and twist while we students looked on. As you might expect, this was in the previous century.
 
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