Victron is Over-priced Eurotrash. Why would anybody buy Victron over an AiO?

[JRH]

As their North American market grows it will probably happen. They are a European market and mobile market.

I would guess that is well underway in their secret meetings…ha .. as this industry evolves many new things will surface… just like everything in the last 100 years has done..

I am sure if they do it will be a kick ass unit …so far they seem to clobber most of the competition when they do release somthing…why would they not continue…?

im also thinking it will cost more than most other products …..and be worth it…

and lastly , I’m absolutely certain upon its release it will spur much desk pounding and cursing from a few select forum members …?…..

J.

 

[rhino]

I think biggest issue is not having a unit that outputs 120/240 in a single unit. You have to have two Quattro's/Multipluses for instance in order to do that.. but then if you need more power then what you initially installed you can't simply parallel another 2 Quattros (or at least they tell you not to do that in the manual). Instead if you have two 5kVA Quattros and need more power for 120/240 they tell you you need to replace those with two 10kVA units instead.

 

[Brucey]

I think biggest issue is not having a unit that outputs 120/240 in a single unit. You have to have two Quattro's/Multipluses for instance in order to do that.. but then if you need more power then what you initially installed you can't simply parallel another 2 Quattros (or at least they tell you not to do that in the manual). Instead if you have two 5kVA Quattros and need more power for 120/240 they tell you you need to replace those with two 10kVA units instead.

I don't know if that's correct. Maybe there's a lesser limit for a 5kVA Quattro versus the 10k and 15k?

Looks like Quattro 10k should be good for five pairs of split phase (5 units on each)? They talk about three phase there but assuming split is covered in that category. Would definitely want to check with a knowledgeable Victron dealer to validate.

 

[rhino]

I don't know if that's correct. Maybe there's a lesser limit for a 5kVA Quattro versus the 10k and 15k?

Looks like Quattro 10k should be good for five pairs of split phase (5 units on each)? They talk about three phase there but assuming split is covered in that category. Would definitely want to check with a knowledgeable Victron dealer to validate.


View attachment 186304

For the European market where it outputs 230VAC yes, you can easily parallel but not for North America where you need two just to make 120/240.

 

[Zwy]

I stopped reading this thread around page 10 because of all the BS. This may have been mentioned. It's actually ON TOPIC!!

From the 250 Manual, section 6.1
"The solar charger will commence battery charging as soon as the PV voltage is 5V higher than the battery voltage. For charging
to continue, the PV voltage must remain at least 1V higher than the battery voltage."

This is a big advantage during early morning, late afternoon, cloudy and rainy days.

48V Starts charging at 53V solar vs 120V which seems to be the norm for higher voltage SCCs.

Yes, that should get you a whole 3 seconds extra of yield.

If you have 8S like I do with VOC of panels at 49.5V each, how long do you think it takes to hit 120V?

I go fishing now and then, I look at marketing much the same. Put the bait in front of the sucker and they will take it.

 

[Brucey]

For the European market where it outputs 230VAC yes, you can easily parallel but not for North America where you need two just to make 120/240.

@HighTechLab can you clarify this question for us? Can the Quattro 5 and 10kVA 120V US versions be run in multiple parallel pairs of split phase like they can with sets of three for three phase config?

 

[sunshine_eggo]

@HighTechLab can you clarify this question for us? Can the Quattro 5 and 10kVA 120V US versions be run in multiple parallel pairs of split phase like they can with sets of three for three phase config?

Yes.

 

[rhino]

Yes.

I've never seen someone install 4 Quattro's paralleled for 120/240 and I know I read somewhere in the Victron manual or site that they tell you to upgrade to the larger unit if you need more power. I'm not saying it isn't possible but they definitely scare individuals away from doing it. Even though they provide many wiring diagrams on their site none of them show this configuration either.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I've never seen someone install 4 Quattro's paralleled for 120/240 and I know I read somewhere in the Victron manual or site that they tell you to upgrade to the larger unit if you need more power. I'm not saying it isn't possible but they definitely scare individuals away from doing it. Even though they provide many wiring diagrams on their site none of them show this configuration either.

When I purchased my system, my dealer confirmed that if I wanted to upgrade in the future, I could simply add a unit to each phase. This also is discussed on community regularly. The VE.Bus System Configurator Tool demo mode is similar to VictronConnect Demo Mode where the software contains all the limitations/settings of the units.

This shows 6 Multiplus assigned to L1 and L2:


That's consistent with the wording in the 120V manual where up to six units can be configured in parallel (per phase).

 

[rhino]

Okay.. Thanks for clarifying @sunshine_eggo. It was this page where they have the warning about "untrained" people trying to do this. It is still much simpler to expand with units that have 120/240 in one unit and explained in manuals for DIY'ers how to do.

 

[HighTechLab]

@HighTechLab can you clarify this question for us? Can the Quattro 5 and 10kVA 120V US versions be run in multiple parallel pairs of split phase like they can with sets of three for three phase config?

Yes, we have customers running 4 units in split/parallel.

The reason 2 bigger units are better than 4 smaller units is because the current sharing is based on the resistance of the AC and DC cabling. They must be exactly identical per phase otherwise one inverter will do more of the work. With only one unit per phase, there are no parallel current sharing issues.

I look forward to the distributor meetup with Victron in a couple weeks. Hopefully we get some long awaited good news we get to share with everyone!

 

[Hedges]

I think Victron inverters have no design support to facilitate load sharing. SMA simulates resistance (voltage sag with higher current) to better balance.
Pass-through from grid is a separate issue, and wire resistance is all you've got. Or breaker resistance, as I discovered.

It ought to be a simple firmware change for Victron to support sharing parallel inverters even without matched wires. If they don't probably don't see (business case) benefit.

Of course one per phase is easier. Some inverters (e.g. SolArk) offer either 120V or 120/240V from a single unit. Parallel their internal outputs and share one external wire. At least, they do that for 120/208Y, would expect it to work for 120/240V split-phase. Maybe they can also do 240/416Y with a tap at 120/208Y?

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

I stopped reading this thread around page 10 because of all the BS. This may have been mentioned. It's actually ON TOPIC!!

From the 250 Manual, section 6.1
"The solar charger will commence battery charging as soon as the PV voltage is 5V higher than the battery voltage. For charging
to continue, the PV voltage must remain at least 1V higher than the battery voltage."

This is a big advantage during early morning, late afternoon, cloudy and rainy days.

48V Starts charging at 53V solar vs 120V which seems to be the norm for higher voltage SCCs.

That’s the same as Morningstar SCC I would midnight is similiar

 

[Brucey]

That’s the same as Morningstar SCC I would midnight is similiar

Hopefully the earthquake hasn't affected you too badly.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Hopefully the earthquake hasn't affected you too badly.

Thanks for the kind wishes. It Hit the west coast pretty hard, barely a trembler here at the cabin. dog and cat got flustered wife was asleep at the kotatsu and kept snoring. I was more worried about my daughters they were with grandma but all was well.

 

[Culchee]

I really don’t want that image imprinted in my memory.. but it’s too late...the butthole is covered by underwear for good reasons..

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

I really don’t want that image imprinted in my memory.. but it’s too late...

What wife asleep at the kotatsu?

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

This is kotatsu table specifically a “Hori kotatsu “.

 

[Culchee]

What wife asleep at the kotatsu?

I will have to google kotatsu... it was the puckered butthole image ... please I want to forget..?

 

[Culchee]

This is kotatsu table specifically a “Hori kotatsu “.

Ah... thanx

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

It has a space in floor for your legs so you sit upright and to variabl resistance heater’s of 0-1800 watts. Keeps the legs and feet toasty in the winter ?

 

[Culchee]

It has a space in floor for your legs so you sit upright and to variabl resistance heater’s of 0-1800 watts. Keeps the legs and feet toasty in the winter ?

That is a great idea..

 

[Brucey]

I look forward to the distributor meetup with Victron in a couple weeks. Hopefully we get some long awaited good news we get to share with everyone!

Oh man what a tease!

My dream is a 120V or split phase version of the Inverter RS 48/6000 Smart. Or 30-40% across the board price cuts on the quattros and multipluses like the non RS smart SCCs had

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

I have said it more than once if victron had been more popular 15 years ago when I started I could very well have ended up as a Smurf as well as a fellow cult member, but back then it was Magnum at the top of the heap. Sensata bought magnum and all R&D stopped and they stagnated. ?

 

[Hedges]

Oh, I get it now! It's not that the table is low, it's that the floor is as high as a bench.
(You couldn't do this in Tasmania; the devils would gnaw your legs off.)